Open Letter to the Trainz Community

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Well I have just made up my mind. Downloading the stand-alone package ($US69.99 = $AU99.95 at that moments exchange rate) now at about 1.8MB/sec.

EDIT: 1 hour 7 minutes download time but I had to go to a friend's place where their Internet speed is 10x what I get.
 
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Tony,
Just wondering will there be an option to get the boxed version on a USB stick any time in the future. That way no more trying to get those pesky drives to read those double layer DVDs.
 
We're exploring physical distribution options but not at this point for the Early Access version.
 
That's one interesting letter there (and against my original feelings I've decided to trial the gold membership) - just hoping that exchange rates don't cause me problems.

One question though - why isn't the discount showing that was successfully applied during the checkout stage for the renewal price?

Shane
 
One question though - why isn't the discount showing that was successfully applied during the checkout stage for the renewal price?

Shane

We'll need to check that out, but I checked your sub and it is showing a $2 discount until Feb 2019.
 
yes, but along with this subscription, you get discounts on items. Once your subscriptions end, you still can play with what you have purchased, just not the "free" stuff
>>

As does our system... from the FAQs

Gold Class provides all the benefits of the Silver Class membership, plus a number of extras:


  • A 25% Trainz Store discount on digital items

Of course there you had to buy an Xbox to use the extras, here you would either be able to use TANE for any TANE DLC purchased, or you would need to purchase TRS19 to use any TRS19 specific DLC.

Again, this is not the whole truth. When your sub ends your access to the game ends and the DLC you purchased is useless.
 
Could you link to where you read that?

yes, but along with this subscription, you get discounts on items. Once your subscriptions end, you still can play with what you have purchased, just not the "free" stuff
>>

As does our system... from the FAQs

Gold Class provides all the benefits of the Silver Class membership, plus a number of extras:


  • A 25% Trainz Store discount on digital items

Of course there you had to buy an Xbox to use the extras, here you would either be able to use TANE for any TANE DLC purchased, or you would need to purchase TRS19 to use any TRS19 specific DLC.
(Bold-Mine)

Among other places it has been mentioned.

As I wrote before, I think this is the biggest sticking point for many. The fact that, with the most expensive option, you never actually get to own the game unless you buy a stand-alone copy in addition to that (an outlay of AUD$300 here in Aus). Therefore, if you find yourself in a situation where you are simply unable to afford (or justify) the subscription, you lose all access to the whole game, and any DLC you have bought for it is useless.

I understand the benefits included with the subscription model and have no issues at all with that concept, and I honestly have no interest in "bashing" the team for their choices. I like what I've seen of the new game and I like what's on offer in the options. It's just that, when forking out so much money for the option I am most interested in (made even worse by the currently poor exchange rate for us), it just doesn't seem "quite right" that if someone is unable to keep paying in the future, for whatever reason, they're left with nothing at all to show for it, other than unusable DLC.

As I suggested before, I think if the first year's subscription (at the current prices) included permanent access to the game (after the first 12 months) at whatever standard it was at when their subscription ceases, with the follow-on subscriptions at a rate between the current Silver and Gold levels, that might go a long way to addressing people's concerns.

Cheers,
Piere
 
As a matter of interest, have you considered a Trainz plus subscription that includes just TRS19 (no routes or DLC) and the ongoing upgrades?​

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Plus one !

Thierry
 
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Good point. As Tony has mentioned, the subscriptions are in addition to the standard methods already in place. Since I spend most of my time in Trainz in Surveyor and only using Driver to test what has been created, the subscriptions with all of the extra stuff has little appeal. As a consequence didn't look that closely into what happens down the track if a subscription is stopped or suspended.

In past versions of Trainz, I have looked at the built-in routes as well as some on the DLS. Good for inspiration but was never attracted to run most more than once. Thus all the extra DLC being touted is not attracting me.

Therefore I think I will probably be going to get TRS19 directly. Already have a lifetime FCT which is enough for my needs.
 
Everything here is referring to USD. As my signature now says "I sure ain't ready to pay $70 for it". I agree with everyone that it looks amazing, but that ain't an amazing price. In fact it is the exact opposite and I am sure you have seen my distaste for the price already. I can buy a lot of other things for $70. I could buy real model trains instead of, well, a game I can't physically touch anything in. I am talking about new and used model trains or accessories for less than or equal to $70. A single piece of freight HO rolling stock new is about $25 - $40 which means I could get about 2 cars. The other option would be to buy a used one which is anywhere from $5 - $20 for a used car depending on quality and condition. Most are $10 - $12 and have metal wheels and couplers already on them! That means I could buy about 7 used real, physical HO cars for my model railroad in great condition or 1 video game that looks amazing, not completed yet, and will set me back a lot. The only other company I know that has a game this pricey is Nintendo. Every good game from them is $60, period. Any crappy one is about $20 - $40 and no one really buys most of them anyway because they are not that enjoyable ones. We have only bought 1 game from them, Mario Kart 8, but for that much we said thats it, they are way too much money for no reason and sales are not exactly something Nintendo usually does. I think it would be wise for most of you out there that don't want to spend $70 on a game to wait till N3V puts it on sale for a much lower price. I would think around the holidays or so they will.
 
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Good point. As Tony has mentioned, the subscriptions are in addition to the standard methods already in place. Since I spend most of my time in Trainz in Surveyor and only using Driver to test what has been created, the subscriptions with all of the extra stuff has little appeal. As a consequence didn't look that closely into what happens down the track if a subscription is stopped or suspended.

In past versions of Trainz, I have looked at the built-in routes as well as some on the DLS. Good for inspiration but was never attracted to run most more than once. Thus all the extra DLC being touted is not attracting me.

Therefore I think I will probably be going to get TRS19 directly. Already have a lifetime FCT which is enough for my needs.

Wow, everything that Martin said above is a billion X's how I feel and think trainz overall for years!

Ish
 
The subscription would be way more tempting if there was a minimum sub time before you could pay a one off sum to cancel yet keep what you had accrued. Rather than feeling trapped into a subscription because you'll lose your DLC.
 
... I can buy a lot of other things for $70. I could buy real model trains instead of, well, a game I can't physically touch anything in.
you also can't drop and damage a virtual train
I am talking about new and used model trains or accessories for less than or equal to $70. A single piece of freight HO rolling stock new is about $25 - $40 which means I could get about 2 cars. The other option would be to buy a used one which is anywhere from $5 - $20 for a used car depending on quality and condition. Most are $10 - $12 and have metal wheels and couplers already on them! That means I could buy about 7 used real, physical HO cars for my model railroad in great condition or 1 video game that looks amazing, not completed yet, and will set me back a lot.
and what are you going to do with a few pieces of rolling stock unless you've already spend a lot more $ for all the other parts needed to actually use them.
 
Okay Tony, so you get to pay more money to buy this product than ever before... because it includes more content and looks better than the Versions before? Two of these "new" routes are slightly revamped versions of older freeware (Niddertalbahn and Cornish mainline). Kickstarter County is II is a slightly revamped version of a newer version of a really old route (highland valley) and collumbia river basin was payware in TANE. The rolling stock for the Niddertalbahn , the Cornish Mainline and Kickstarter County is at least partly recycled freeware older than trs 2010 not even updated for pbr, as far as I can see. Sebino Lake is a little italian branch line usually operated by stadler GTWs, not an orient express! I still remember it being announced as payware for TANE a while back. Edinburgh Dundee sounds interesting, but I still have the terrible junction spaghetti of the ECML in mind. Honestly, most freeware routes are much nicer than any Trainz builtin or payware, for me, builtin is just a nice extra , not a reason for a higher price, seeing as many builtin objects often come from freeware developers who never see any money in the end. Second reason: if trs 2019 should be so expensive because it is better than TANE, we'd already be at over 100$ by now. The gold subscription is a total rip-off. The payware never was worth its price, sve for a few exceptions. Most freeware is much better. I also never needed a permanent FCT. But subscribers will lose the game the moment they unsubscribe. It's sad that probably the best train sim on the market ruins itsself by its own pricing policy.
 
Okay Tony, so you get to pay more money to buy this product than ever before... because it includes more content and looks better than the Versions before? Two of these "new" routes are slightly revamped versions of older freeware (Niddertalbahn and Cornish mainline). Kickstarter County is II is a slightly revamped version of a newer version of a really old route (highland valley) and collumbia river basin was payware in TANE. The rolling stock for the Niddertalbahn , the Cornish Mainline and Kickstarter County is at least partly recycled freeware older than trs 2010 not even updated for pbr, as far as I can see. Sebino Lake is a little italian branch line usually operated by stadler GTWs, not an orient express! I still remember it being announced as payware for TANE a while back. Edinburgh Dundee sounds interesting, but I still have the terrible junction spaghetti of the ECML in mind. Honestly, most freeware routes are much nicer than any Trainz builtin or payware, for me, builtin is just a nice extra , not a reason for a higher price, seeing as many builtin objects often come from freeware developers who never see any money in the end. Second reason: if trs 2019 should be so expensive because it is better than TANE, we'd already be at over 100$ by now. The gold subscription is a total rip-off. The payware never was worth its price, sve for a few exceptions. Most freeware is much better. I also never needed a permanent FCT. But subscribers will lose the game the moment they unsubscribe. It's sad that probably the best train sim on the market ruins itsself by its own pricing policy.

According to Tony the content access etc is still available up until the next renewal date if one cancels their membership and doesn't end straight away.

Shane
 
... Honestly, most freeware routes are much nicer than any Trainz builtin or payware, for me, builtin is just a nice extra , not a reason for a higher price, seeing as many builtin objects often come from freeware developers who never see any money in the end. Second reason: if trs 2019 should be so expensive because it is better than TANE, we'd already be at over 100$ by now. The gold subscription is a total rip-off.
You do realize that the subscriptions are optional?
The payware never was worth its price, sve for a few exceptions. Most freeware is much better. I also never needed a permanent FCT. But subscribers will lose the game the moment they unsubscribe. It's sad that probably the best train sim on the market ruins itsself by its own pricing policy.
All in the eye of the beholder. Since I rarely look at the builtin and don't really do payware, it is all rather moot for me but brushing them all off seems a bit much.
 
All in the eye of the beholder. Since I rarely look at the builtin and don't really do payware, it is all rather moot for me but brushing them all off seems a bit much.

Yeah I agree with you. I rarely get payware stuff but unlike trainzrule2 I think it is better than some, but very little, freeware stuff you can get. I do think I will get payware stuff this time around for TRS19 because N3V actually has done a great job of keeping their payware up to date so it works with the latest game but also still with the older ones. Other private businesses have as well. Jointed Rail and K&L Trainz are payware sites with amazing freeware. K&L Trainz is much more limited on the freeware side though. If you are looking for amazingly detailed and a lot of freeware go to JR. They have A LOT of amazing stuff but I have found it is all other the place with geographical area and roadnames you can get. They have Southern Pacific GS4 and a Reading 0-6-0 Camelback as an example. Another is era, they have content from the modern and past eras but way less stuff from the past eras. They also do not have any coaches to speak of, payware or free. One more great website I use is Trainz Forge. It is a mostly freeware site with some payware but not much. They have amazing and very high quality content and yes, passenger cars, just not on their website. The author of the site has Southern Pacific Daylight coaches, along with others, on the DLS though.
 
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Point is, when I get it, I will buy it. Still, 70$ is a lot, especially when Tony's argument is more builtin, part of which is actually freeware. The Niddertalbahn for example was never intended to generate cash and never did so for the original creators. If there were anything that made this release REALLY special except for some more fancy graphics like at any release, such as the multiplayer surveyor, I wouldn't have a problem. The whole subscription idea was for the multiplayer suveyor. Now it's being rolled out without it. Just a wild guess, but could that whole surveyor feature thing have been a test to see how far people were prepared to go?
 
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