No longer a member of NAT

[Euphod]

Although it affects almost no one, I am posting this as information for the community, and as notice to preserve what little dignity I have left. I suppose if there is a lesson in all this, it is that what you post in your name, or in your nickname anywhere on the INTERNET is search-able, viewable and able to reflect your character. I would caution those that have not previously considered this fact to consider it now. Angry words and unflattering language may be allowed on some forums, but in the end it's your choice of how you want to present yourself.

Below is the text of what I've posted at the NAT forums. As I said, this is intended to be a "notice" by which I hope to distance myself from further forum shenanigans, whether they take place here, or at forums elsewhere.

I am not attempting to cause an issue here, nor am I trying to "fan the flames" of any existing controversy, I just don't want to be associated with those who's temperament is so volatile.

I ask your understanding and sufferance if you disagree with this post, or the content herein. I only want to make it clear that I am NOT a member of NAT any longer.

Forum Mods are welcome to lock, or remove this thread if they deem it inappropriate or inflammatory.

Thank you for your patience,

Ed


"Due to the above thoughtless and inflammatory comments by the leader of this organization, I respectfully post my resignation from NAT. I would appreciate it if you would do me the courtesy of removing my name from the team member's list immediately.

I do not wish my name to be attached to an organization who's leaders or members allow themselves to be drawn into the "drama of the day" and cannot demonstrate the restraint necessary to advance a polished, professional team. Posting in other forums is not anonymous, and after reading comments from various persons in other forums I find I no longer have the respect for them that I once did, no matter the content they produce, nor the quality of that content.

Sincerely,

Ed "

 

[quakers1]

Hey Ed, I finished editing the team page. I have removed you from the roster. Sorry about what I did. I wish you the best of luck Ed. Later.

-quakers1

 

[Gandalf0444]

I hate to say this but...I knew(and I'm sure a lot of other people did) that somthing was going to happen sooner or later.

 

[slave-driver]

Well put Ed. I know you are not the only one that has experianced that. I've had a very similar experiance and it's not sitting well with me. Any way, you have my support.

Bill

 

[yutzk]

I also agree with you Ed. I for one am sick of the drama attached sometimes to this game and its really put a sour taste in my mouth as well.

I'm one of those people who steers clear of the drama and moves on with life, as seriously....this is a hobby for me.

 

[TheCowboy]

Remember the good old days when there was the Trainz Forum and that was it. There seemed to be a lot less "drama" back biting and flame wars in those days. Now everyone that has a "team" or website has to have their own forums. WHY, well from what little I have read on the 2-3 forums I have visited is so they can complain to their hearts content about moderators on the Trainz Forum complain about Trainz the software, Trainz employees etc etc etc..... and the sad thing is that good people from the Trainz community get SUCKED into that world of drama.

My suggestion is STAY AWAY from these forums and micro Trainz communities because that is why they are there, because they are disgruntled about something and if you go there you are going to get sucked into their miserable world and ruin the Trainz experience for you. Some of the people on these forums have been banned from the Trainz Forum and for good reason. They have caused trouble and they will continue to cause trouble. Don't ruin the Trainz experience for yourself and stay away.

 

[wreeder]

Ed,

What you say is very good advice. I think a lot of young people including those on this forum do not fully understand that when they go to get a job or move into a better job a human resource person may google their name or nicknames. I see this more and more in the IT world and I'm sure it is not the only industry doing it. What may have seemed cute or rad or cool or whatever it is they say these days when you're young may not be so flattering when you grow up.

William

 

[Euphod]

I suppose if you don't visit any other Trainz site than this one you will be insulated from information that may offend your sensibilities. I'm sure you can find mudslinging of one type or another on any Trainz related forum. I believe there is nothing wrong in posting your disagreement with a decision, or a mod, or a person in general, as long as you do not include profanity or veiled threats while doing so. This is even more crucial if you are in a leadership position.

My position is not one that I was born with, came to the INTERNET with, came to Trainz with, or suddenly acquired this morning. It is a position that came with the years, and culminates in this thread. I'm sure right now there are people gathering insensitive posts of mine from various sources and building a "Notepad Collage" to add to this thread, and that's fine. It would only serve to illustrate my point. We learn from mistakes, and I'd like to think I have learned, and no longer want to be associated with those that represent themselves crudely.

Many Trainz fan sites have sections open to members of the resident team only, and that's the place to vent your anger and foul words, if you don't mind the other members of your team reading it.

I read the other forums to gather information, even if I don't participate in the discussion. Due to certain circumstances in my life, I find forums to be a social outlet, which is why I continue to read them. You may say I shouldn't visit sites knowing a certain mindset exists, but it's not about the mindset, it's about how it's expressed.

I suppose it's simplest to say that everyone should assume that their Mother will read what you post, anywhere...about anything. The INTERNET should not become "The Lord of the Flies", it's not anonymous, and it's not "anything goes", unless you have no regard for your own reputation. I suppose some people don't respect themselves, and those people can't be expected to respect others.

But I don't have to stand next to them at a party.

Ed

 

[ish6]

Hi Ed,

I have had these encounters, here in at Aurans... I just ignored it all and always moved on ...:wave:

Happy New Year, and all the best in the coming months my friend!!

Ishie

 

[zatovisualworks]

Reading this thread with sympathetic interest. One of my deepest concerns about the 'Net (and I'm not centainly a newcomer since I've been in since the mid-nineties) is the increasing belief that it was made for anonimity and hideout.

And I wrote 'sympathetic' because unfortunately I also know what being massacred in public by unknown people means. Some users (hiding behind the curtain of a silly nickname in most of the cases) at certain localized forums dared to type (or better put letters together) opinions or expressions about me who hadn't really dared to tell me in person or in court. That's seems to be lifestyle in the 21st century 'Net.

Interesting and worrying thoughts, Ed!

Alberte Zato :wave: (that's my ID for more than a century) :hehe:

 

[CasyJ]

I took your advice and Googled your nick. Seems as though you visit quite a number of Rail Simulator forums, and have created some impressive rolling stock. I assume the NAT is National American Trainz forum. I scanned that and didn't find one public thread which reflects your concerns, so can I assume that the abuse was private?

 

[Mike10]

I have had these encounters, here in at Aurans... I just ignored it all and always moved on ...:wave:

Aaack...

Sorry, just choked a little there.

Mike.

 

[johnwhelan]

Remember the good old days when there was the Trainz Forum and that was it. There seemed to be a lot less "drama" back biting and flame wars in those days. Now everyone that has a "team" or website has to have their own forums. WHY, well from what little I have read on the 2-3 forums I have visited is so they can complain to their hearts content about moderators on the Trainz Forum complain about Trainz the software, Trainz employees etc etc etc..... and the sad thing is that good people from the Trainz community get SUCKED into that world of drama.

My suggestion is STAY AWAY from these forums and micro Trainz communities because that is why they are there, because they are disgruntled about something and if you go there you are going to get sucked into their miserable world and ruin the Trainz experience for you. Some of the people on these forums have been banned from the Trainz Forum and for good reason. They have caused trouble and they will continue to cause trouble. Don't ruin the Trainz experience for yourself and stay away.

I'm not quite sure I completely agree with you. Sometimes a micro forum can be valuable if you are building a route and want an item or two, or if you want some assistance on a project without exposing yourself too much to when is it going to be uploaded. A smaller focused community works reasonably well, there can be more involvement and you get better beta testing feedback.

For those with a North American interest the Auran forums work fairly well but for UK interests they really don't have a focused forum hence the UK forum has grown up which has meant less information and expertise available on the main forum.

It's always seemed dumb to me that we can have a Swiss forum but for the number of people involved we can't have a UK forum. It isn't language since Switzerland basically uses French, German and Italian all of which have their own forum and you can't tell me that the language spoken in America is the same as the UK or would you like a list of differences starting with lorry? Many railway / railroad terms are quite different.

Cheerio John

 

[AHSAN]

Hello Ed

I like to wish you all the best, you were good person and you always helped people out on the Trainz forum and you were a talented creator and a respected person in the Trainz community.

Regards

Ahsan
North Amercian Trainz Team

 

[seeseeme]

Hi Ed,

Since I first "joined" this forum you have been here and given help to so many people and added some "funny" post.

I can not understand exactly what you mean in this thread however it is a sad situation you have found yourself in.

Take care,

Craig

 

[Euphod]

Gentlemen and Ladies;

There is no reason for anyone to pursue this issue to satisfy curiosity, suffice to say a post was made on a forum that I do not agree with, and I made a decision based on my own level of tolerance. Others may have no issues with what offends me.

The folks at NAT are a fine bunch, and their behavior at their forums is perfectly respectable. Some may feel that I've over reacted, but that will just have to be.

I, in no way am condemning NAT or their members, and I hope you won't let my decision reflect on your opinion of that group....or any other. There is not now, or ever has been posting on their forum that I would deem offensive.

I would ask that you all do your own research, and reach your own conclusions before you decide your "bedmates".*

Ed

*.....and then use a spell checker!:hehe:

 

[Wessex_Electric_Nutter]

Gentlemen and Ladies;

There is no reason for anyone to pursue this issue to satisfy curiosity, suffice to say a post was made on a forum that I do not agree with, and I made a decision based on my own level of tolerance. Others may have no issues with what offends me.

You are correct Euphod. Forget the rest of the posts, no one else needs to really comment, but sometimes, you got to make a decision based on your circumstances. If you personally disagree with some members, fine, leave, if you feel a little pushed out, fine, bail out. If you move somewhere else, more regional, fine, go there.

In the end, you have the right to your own rights of your work, unless it is by request of the group (in which case, they are your client, and all work made on behalf of the client, becomes their own copyright.), you have the right to work for who you wish, you have the right to accept a reasonable offer from someone else.

On the other hand, being with TLW and moving to UKBL (as it was more suited), I did feel a little awkward to be honest. I won't explain publically.

 

[slave-driver]

In the end it's your sanity and piece of mind that is important. There will alway be those that miss understand what you post and make assumptions on incomplete information, (even though they think they know what's going on) then they end up making a fool of themselves. (they look so funny with their foot in their mouths. In my case it's both feet) Then some are so oblivious to the fact that what they say can be or is offensive to others or they just don't care.
Like the last sentence in you post Ed.

I would ask that you all do your own research, and reach your own conclusions before you decide your "bedmates".*

The way I interpret it may not be the same as others. The way I see it it is very sound advice. Not, to my own discredit, that I do it every time.

Bill

 

[sethmcs]

Very interesting thread

Ed,

This is an interesting discussion. I google my real name and just found out that I am a wounded Major in the Canadian Army who is headed back to duty in Afganistan.:hehe: I didn't even know.

I guess it saddens me greatly that such a great community can fragment over disagreements and hurt feelings. I don't believe that any ex-member that I witnessed being banned from this group did it unintensionally. They wanted to be banned and they are gone. Maybe they have gone somewhere else and that is fine. Live and let live.

I am of the opionion, not that means any more than anyone elses opinion, that the moderators have done a pretty good job of making the forum a nice environment. Most of the problems I have had with moderators were solved by opening new forum areas like General, Community, Parts & Labor etc. The Code of Conduct is not unreasonable. Nor is the Trainz forum uncivil wild wild place. Such places exist and are fine by me. Live and let live.

When growing up I used to talk alot to the oldtimers. One oldtimer explained how to deal with anger. One way is aggressive. You #%^$& you upset me. That will get some banned here. Another way is passive. Go to another forum an tell them how you really feel. However, the best way according to the oldtimer is a thing called assertive. Assertive is where I say exactly what is upsetting to me to the person who is upsetting me. There have been alot of times that anger has got the best of me and I have made foolish decisions. I have forgiven myself for that and can forgive others too. Live and let live.

I remember as a little kid I get into a fight and demand to know "whose side are you on anyhow!" People would be divided into "us" verses "them". Which was fine as long as I was leading the battle. However, I found myself pull into other peoples battles as well. Did a lot of fighting as a kid. Well, today with scars on my face I fight my own battles which are carefully choosen. Live and let live.

I guess you post reminds me of a politican who endorses project and publicly removes support when it is revealed that the project leader has some controversal view. I guess that stuff still happens. Live and let live.

Ed you got my respect regardless of this thread. Live and let live.

 

[Euphod]

I guess you post reminds me of a politican who endorses project and publicly removes support when it is revealed that the project leader has some controversal view.

That's fine with me. We all have our own tolerances for behavior we don't agree with. I tolerate very little, and will not lend tacit approval or support through association.

Yes, we all have warts and faults (live and let live), but I have quite enough of my own without appearing to endorse anyone elses!

Ed