High Speed Rail St Louis to Chicago

Nux_Vomica

New member
I truly believe that this "Amtrak " project is a waste of taxpayer money. I think that it is a project that benefits the UP much more. the UP needs a track and signal upgrade to service their inter-modal facility in Joliet. The UP tries very hard not to pay for anything except the politician. I hate the UP.
 
I live at the northern end of the HS line (many think its Chicago, but its really Joliet) and I've driven most of the line while traveling south on I-55. Its single track most if not the hole way so I have to imagine there is traffic problems. if not before defiantly now with the opening of center point facility. its a great idea to force HS rail into the heads of America but.
 
I truly believe that this "Amtrak " project is a waste of taxpayer money. I think that it is a project that benefits the UP much more. the UP needs a track and signal upgrade to service their inter-modal facility in Joliet. The UP tries very hard not to pay for anything except the politician. I hate the UP.

So what? It's not like the UP volunteered or paid someone off to get this line upgraded. This isn't their busy line, and that's why it's getting the upgrades. You can thank the reckless State of Illinois for being how they are. 110mph trains exist in Michigan without as much work Illinois is mandating. The state is the one who decides everything need to be quad gated and redone. Amtrak is the one who decides blah-blah and x and y. Point is, UP only owns the line and has to maintain all the new equipment and meet train on-time percentages with Amtrak through their dispatching. You cannot say you hate UP because they got chosen for upgrades they never asked for, well you can, but it doesn't make sense. You also cannot blame UP for taking advantage of this. Amtrak doesn't run all the time, and Union Pacific has plenty of holes they can fill with trains on this route without interrupting Amtrak.

Look at the other Chicago to St. Louis route UP has. The old C&EI, and MoPac. The UP Villa Grove and Pana Subdivisions. These routes are rough around the edges, and have that classic freight-train line feel. Wooden ties, incandescent signals, and more. That line is just now getting PTC upgrades here and there. The Illinois HSR line has been cab-signaled, PTC, and more. UP didn't ask for any of that and clearly haven't made is the priority it is on the HSR.

Additionally, if you think that's a waste of taxpayer money, visit Chicago sometime. (just sayin'. Chicago has plenty of waste, and mostly check out the quiet zones build up in the suburbs. Look into what work the local jurisdiction has to pay for for those)

So ask yourself, what is the problem here? Is is truly a waste of money? Or is it actually helping?

I've rode this service several times. The new depots are great looking and the track is smooth as silk. The reason they are pushing for this is that it helps Amtrak and helps American Rail by establishing a platform for profitable passenger rail service among freight trains. People won't take the train when it's just as quick as driving, but they will if it's even just 30 minutes quicker. At least not as many, but more. Increasing ridership is the lifeblood of Amtrak (to an extent). The problem is that the agreements stop there. The Illinois HSR was implemented with issues and errors along the way. In the 1990s the State of Illinois and Amtrak both hoped for a 2004 finish, and we all know to this date it's a massive project undertaking with plenty of work yet to even go through. The whole line is an experimental ground for the future of Amtrak travel. Grade crossings are overbuilt, fences are crazy everywhere (even when you can just walk around the fences), and more. The problem I see with the line is that it's a dream of perfection which is overdone.

Also, the way this is presented doesn't bring outsiders into the loop.

Just to give people an idea of what the State, Amtrak, and Friends (Friends = UP, some local gov'ts, and a few sponsors) have done to just the town of Dwight, IL. BTW, Dwight wasn't a sponsor. ;)

Dwight, IL has new wayside signals. Completely reconstructed crossings which required ripping up intersections, and signing and re-doing the downtown roadways. The new crossings are quad-gated with new equipment. They pulled the original depot out of service and keep it as its a historical landmark. They build a brand new depot with its own LED sign boards, emergency call stations, trash cans, bathroom, the whole 9 yards. The entire downtown railroad track was fenced in with black steel security fencing with gate. They have redone the track and signals at the siding north of town and junction with the NS. Now this seems like a lot, right? This is what they are trying to do with every single town from Chicago to St. Louis on this line. Now you see the massive feat ahead. What if I also told you none of the upgrades in Dwight mean anything better for the speed of service? The only thing truly upgraded is the signals and track is newer and the station reflects Amtrak's image. Again, it's time to ask some questions.

But...

To truly say its a waste is one-sided as people who ride the train everyday on this line or for those who benefit from the quick Intermodal service would beg to differ. That's what it comes down to. How much investment into new infrastructure is too much investment into new infrastructure. Is newer really better? Is this money really there to be spent this way? Is the outcome achievable or worth the millions? All these questions are answered over time. So far it seems that most the answers are "No.". Union Pacific once came out and redid almost all of the 'new' concrete ties due to them having casting defects. As I mentioned before, both Amtrak and the State have pushed the deadlines back for project work countless times. The implementation has been localized and only recently streamlined into a common theme. This means signals upgraded by the first wave in the 1990s are being already taken out of service due to pushes for the latest and greatest. Which brings that 'is new really worth it?' argument in doubt.

In case anyone's wondering, it's 55 bucks for me to run between St. Louis and Dwight, round trip. Which is almost the price of gas for me, and my car stays at home where it's not getting miles put on it and not driven by me.

That said, I'm for some of the upgrades. The rest is excess lost in a world obsessed in protecting the public from themselves.

:wave:

Cheers,
Joshua
 
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