Water in Surveyor Classic and Surveyor S20

[Paul_Bert]

Can a route use water generated in Classic Surveyor and Surveyor S20 simultaneously?

The reason I ask is that most of my routes created in TRS2019 use water in rivers and lakes.

When I use one of my existing routes and try to add another lake or river using the Surveyor S20 tool (which is a layer) I find that my route is now covered with water in many places I don't want water.

Is there a way around this, or are the two types of water incompatible in the same route?

 

[stagecoach]

S2.0 provides water over the entire baseboards as it is a layer. But it is treated as the ground in the same way you would raise or lower ground levels you can also raise and lower water levels. My route won't mix the two due to the amount of water in the old route.

 

[big_b]

Just curious about this I still use old Surveyor as I find it quicker to use.
I have streams on slopes with level changes using water in some cases ,where I use rocks or Dams at the level change point to cover the height difference.
So if I attempt the same thing in S2 I would have to have a new layer for each level change in water height ?

 

[Paul_Bert]

The water layer apparently works differently than the grass layers. When I activate a grass layer it only shows the areas where I have painted the grass, not the entire grid.

I am happy to continue using the surveyor classic water, but at some point, the classic version will go away.

 

[stagecoach]

You only need one water layer in S2.0 but you can have more. You alter the height in the same way as making hills or slopes with the new S2.0. In the layer section add the water layer. Now change ground to water in the top window under the paintbrush. Select raise, lower, slope, or set height in the window underneath. Choose your water height, brush size, etc from the selections below that. Now just paint the ground and the water will do what you have asked.

 

[sterrett]

Just curious about this I still use old Surveyor as I find it quicker to use.
I have streams on slopes with level changes using water in some cases ,where I use rocks or Dams at the level change point to cover the height difference.
So if I attempt the same thing in S2 I would have to have a new layer for each level change in water height ?

I find the old Surveyor quicker to use as well. However, is that because we have become used to it so we know where to find things, we know how the menus behave and we know to flick Route/Session Layers as we need them?
Maybe those who come into the hobby now and learn Surveyor 2.0 from the outset may find that quicker.

 

[Jayco-man]

Well, I like the old way better too, seems like this is all they ever do anyway is just change the way you do something instead of actually making what they have better. I know there's a learning curve, but thank the old way is much faster in a lot of ways.

 

[JCitron]

I prefer the old water as well and the old way of placing it down. It's quick and easy compared to the new water-effect. It's not that the new way is different because that's actually pretty easy once we know how to use it. The problem is it doesn't work as intended and the water doesn't really look like water and the new water-effect is like working with marshmallow fluff or very stiff marang. It's goopy and blobby and not a smooth area. Unlike the old water sheet, the whole route is covered with the water instead of the small, selected area. Maybe this issue is due to this still being WIP, and to be honest I sure hope so but I'm not counting on it.

 

[Paul_Bert]

I don't like the way the whole route is covered with water. A big issue for me is that the old water and the new water do not seem to be compatible. This means that if you want to use the new water in a route, then all the old water must be removed. I guess the answer to this is that the new water level must be decreased until it no longer affects the old water. The in the areas where you want the new water you just raise the water layer in that area.

 

[JCitron]

I don't like the way the whole route is covered with water. A big issue for me is that the old water and the new water do not seem to be compatible. This means that if you want to use the new water in a route, then all the old water must be removed. I guess the answer to this is that the new water level must be decreased until it no longer affects the old water. The in the areas where you want the new water you just raise the water layer in that area.

I haven't tried that aspect of the gloppy mess. Does raising the new water layer cause it to flood the rest of the route or does that only cover the area where it's needed?

 

[Paul_Bert]

I haven't tried that aspect of the gloppy mess. Does raising the new water layer cause it to flood the rest of the route or does that only cover the area where it's needed?

i find it floods the whole route, or at least many baseboards. I was hopping it worked more like TurfFX where it only appeared where you painted it.

 

[Jayco-man]

Yeah, I know what you're talking about, it looks like lava coming up out of the ground , put it back the other way, looks horrible.

 

[stagecoach]

I have to disagree with the comments about the water. The old type water plane can be converted to the new water type. Use Import Legacy Water, this will convert to the S2.0 type water. To place water in a new route or a route that has no water still use the Import Legacy Water which will be zero. You can now paste the grid squares in the same way as the old water placing. Use the set height to give you the flat plane for large areas. You can also select grade to give sloping water in rivers.

 

[rhban]

This does seem a backward step. Under the old system, you could have a dam with water at two different levels - it wasn't exactly easy because if the two areas of water got too close to each other, they would merge and you'd have to start all over again, but it was possible.

 

[stagecoach]

Quickly put together in S2.0. You will notice that the water has a steeper slope where it changes height. You can eliminate the connection by creating two layers, one for each level this will not join the two levels at the dam.

 

[JCitron]

i find it floods the whole route, or at least many baseboards. I was hoping it worked more like TurfFX where it only appeared where you painted it.

Great that's what I was afraid of.

Yeah, I know what you're talking about, it looks like lava coming up out of the ground , put it back the other way, looks horrible.

That's a good description of it.

 

[Paul_Bert]

I have spent more time with the new water effects. I took one of my routes with lots of rivers and lakes. I created the "Water Effects Layer" and used the "Import Legacy Water" command. On my route it took about 4 minutes to complete the conversion. I was pleasantly surprised to see the proper water height at the end of this operation. There was no water appearing where it did not belong. I could go into the water layer menu and adjust the nature of the water - calm, choppy, ripples, etc.

What I couldn't see however was how to adjust the color. The converted water effects come out a dark blue. In some cases I want a lighter blue. In the classic surveyor to change the color you went into the environmental controls and there was a place to adjust the color of the water. But this method doesn't seem to be available in Surveyor 20.

Is there another way of adjusting the watercolor? I didn't see anything in the layer menu that addressed this.

 

[stagecoach]

Go into the edit environmental settings and click on the peg at the bottom of the clock. Select the top window of the three on the right of the main view.

 

[Paul_Bert]

Go into the edit environmental settings and click on the peg at the bottom of the clock. Select the top window of the three on the right of the main view.

The problem with adjusting the top window is that it also affects the color of the overall landscape, not just the water. In TRS19 and TRS2022 Classic surveyor the bottom window only adjusted the watercolor. It seems it no longer works in Surveyor 20.

 

[rhban]

I am stunned how, after choosing Australia as my route's location, I am. presented with orange water. Now, I suppose a muddy colour might be appropriate for a creek or river, but an ocean of orange water when it's not even sunset is a bit strange.