TUME’s Simulation of “The Milwaukee Road”
- Thread starter tume
- Start date
Jimbiglion
261 Train Crew
Tume
I think if you add an train to your pic add more movement and more interest than empty tracks
I think if you add an train to your pic add more movement and more interest than empty tracks
jjanmarine3
Active member
I want to say thanks for this enjoyable route, Iguess it must be one of the all time favourites of trainzers .
@ jjanmarine3
Thank you very much for such a nice compliment
I hope the updated route will enjoy people even more
@ Jimbiglion
Yes I just posted a lot of screens without any “action” at the tracks. My intension was to document the state of progress about my seasonal route and content update. Unfortunately I did not create a seasonal train yet – but soon. Therefore I mostly just made the screens without any trains as it looks a bit strange if a non seasonal train goes through a snowy landscape.
But take these screens here:
A NP Mallet pulls an eastbound train through Mullan, Id and passes Lucky Friday Mine. I once posted these screens in the “Happy new year” thread, but just to come along with some “action” I post it again.
Yes – the train assets does not support season change as well, but we just can say the snow is melted away from the train because the steam loco produces a lot of heat
Your’s TUME
Thank you very much for such a nice compliment
I hope the updated route will enjoy people even more
@ Jimbiglion
Yes I just posted a lot of screens without any “action” at the tracks. My intension was to document the state of progress about my seasonal route and content update. Unfortunately I did not create a seasonal train yet – but soon. Therefore I mostly just made the screens without any trains as it looks a bit strange if a non seasonal train goes through a snowy landscape.
But take these screens here:
A NP Mallet pulls an eastbound train through Mullan, Id and passes Lucky Friday Mine. I once posted these screens in the “Happy new year” thread, but just to come along with some “action” I post it again.
Yes – the train assets does not support season change as well, but we just can say the snow is melted away from the train because the steam loco produces a lot of heat
Your’s TUME
Fantastic work Tume.
One thing about seasonal trains. A steam locomotive would almost never have much snow on it. The pilot, the pilot truck, and tender might have some snow on them. But the boiler would be so hot, that most of the locomotive would be kept frost free. The only time they would ice over is when stored cold, ready for scrap or shop time. Boilers tend to be so hot as to boiler water on contact.
Another thing, your seasonal track. When, if, it be released? Id love to use it on some of my routes.
One thing about seasonal trains. A steam locomotive would almost never have much snow on it. The pilot, the pilot truck, and tender might have some snow on them. But the boiler would be so hot, that most of the locomotive would be kept frost free. The only time they would ice over is when stored cold, ready for scrap or shop time. Boilers tend to be so hot as to boiler water on contact.
Another thing, your seasonal track. When, if, it be released? Id love to use it on some of my routes.
Thank you both for your compliments.
@ JIb228,
Yes, I agree with you about the snow at steam locos. I am about to create my MILW S3 4-8-4 just like this way. But I am still working at it. Unfortunately there is no possibility at the moment to make differences between a hot and a cold steam loco – as far as I know. But if this would be introduced we would need some tools to get the loco under fire – with needs several hours until the loco is ready to move. Such a session would be interesting to carry out in trainz but would probably used by very hardcore steam loco fans only I cannot really imagine that the whole community wants to spend hours in front of the trainz-PC just playing how to fire a steam loco. For the man in the engine shops this used to be a hard – mostly overnight – job, but could be a bit boring just inside a simulation. Perhaps if we get trainz connected to a Wii console the users would need to make real body movements to put coal through the fire door by using a shovel – the Wii console in this case
The snow would need to melt slowly away while the loco gets hot which would require several different snow meshes and textures been used to simulate the melting process of the snow.
But we don’t be able to make differences between a hot and a cold steam loco and therefore I am thinking about to create a second version of my MILW S3 4-8-4 but this time as an ordinary rail car – without an engine behavior. Then sessions can be created including some cold steam locos unable to move itself but including the possibility to be switched around by maintenance switchers. This version of steam locos would get snow overall at its snow-mesh.
Now about the track: The track will be released within all the other seasonal content like buildings, roads and structures and as a bundle which will include the route and the locos and the rolling stock. I can’t tell you an exact date of release now but I hope it’s only a question of several month.
Your’s TUME
@ JIb228,
Yes, I agree with you about the snow at steam locos. I am about to create my MILW S3 4-8-4 just like this way. But I am still working at it. Unfortunately there is no possibility at the moment to make differences between a hot and a cold steam loco – as far as I know. But if this would be introduced we would need some tools to get the loco under fire – with needs several hours until the loco is ready to move. Such a session would be interesting to carry out in trainz but would probably used by very hardcore steam loco fans only
I cannot really imagine that the whole community wants to spend hours in front of the trainz-PC just playing how to fire a steam loco. For the man in the engine shops this used to be a hard – mostly overnight – job, but could be a bit boring just inside a simulation. Perhaps if we get trainz connected to a Wii console the users would need to make real body movements to put coal through the fire door by using a shovel – the Wii console in this case The snow would need to melt slowly away while the loco gets hot which would require several different snow meshes and textures been used to simulate the melting process of the snow.
But we don’t be able to make differences between a hot and a cold steam loco and therefore I am thinking about to create a second version of my MILW S3 4-8-4 but this time as an ordinary rail car – without an engine behavior. Then sessions can be created including some cold steam locos unable to move itself but including the possibility to be switched around by maintenance switchers. This version of steam locos would get snow overall at its snow-mesh.
Now about the track: The track will be released within all the other seasonal content like buildings, roads and structures and as a bundle which will include the route and the locos and the rolling stock. I can’t tell you an exact date of release now but I hope it’s only a question of several month.
Your’s TUME
railventure
New member
Wow Tume,
Really brilliant stuff and to think that not only do you create the route but alot of the assets too.
This is what i call a great advertisement for Trainz.
Really brilliant stuff and to think that not only do you create the route but alot of the assets too.
This is what i call a great advertisement for Trainz.
@ railventure
The only creator who started to create seasonal assets (except ground texture and trees) is Dinorius Redundicus. Therefore I was required not just to update my own assets, I also needs to create seasonal replacements for all of the DLS assets I once used for the Avery – Drexel – Route. The route as it has been released as builtin at TS2010 contained a little more than 1000 assets. That means I needed to create about 1000 new assets – this time seasonal assets.
@ kamran
Yes trains will be seasonal as well –at the end. I am already working on it but I don’t have a representable train asset at the moment.
Here is just a first loco season test:
Your’s TUME
The only creator who started to create seasonal assets (except ground texture and trees) is Dinorius Redundicus. Therefore I was required not just to update my own assets, I also needs to create seasonal replacements for all of the DLS assets I once used for the Avery – Drexel – Route. The route as it has been released as builtin at TS2010 contained a little more than 1000 assets. That means I needed to create about 1000 new assets – this time seasonal assets.
@ kamran
Yes trains will be seasonal as well –at the end. I am already working on it but I don’t have a representable train asset at the moment.
Here is just a first loco season test:
Your’s TUME
Last edited:
That's a great start! You're content is great TUME and I look forward to using it in the future.
I would suggest a little bit more snow on the front of the locomotive, such as on the top and front of the pilot. That may not be correct though as the wind would probably blow all of the snow off.
I would suggest a little bit more snow on the front of the locomotive, such as on the top and front of the pilot. That may not be correct though as the wind would probably blow all of the snow off.
Hallo,
here some screens about the Avery-Drexel upgrade progress:
We are sitting here beside the tracks just about 200 meters east of Tunnel 31 looking toward Long Liz Creek and taking some pictures from an wast-bound Olympian Hiawatha passing bye.
Many thanks goes to Dinorius Redundicus who decided just some time ago to update some of his very nice assets.
Therefore we now can create our creeks with great looking rock boulders at its side making it much more realistic looking
BTW: If we will have strong snow falls in the Bitterroots quite often, I probably will have to take care to create some scripted snow plow stuff to be stored down at Avery, Id coming along with a "Snow-Plow-Session".
In all cases it will be a tough session just for tough RR-man who will need to pull up their socks to get the f...g track cleared before the next westbound needs passing by WITHOUT ANY DELAY!!!!
But I don't want to promise too much right now
Your's TUME
here some screens about the Avery-Drexel upgrade progress:
We are sitting here beside the tracks just about 200 meters east of Tunnel 31 looking toward Long Liz Creek and taking some pictures from an wast-bound Olympian Hiawatha passing bye.
Many thanks goes to Dinorius Redundicus who decided just some time ago to update some of his very nice assets.
Therefore we now can create our creeks with great looking rock boulders at its side making it much more realistic looking
BTW: If we will have strong snow falls in the Bitterroots quite often, I probably will have to take care to create some scripted snow plow stuff to be stored down at Avery, Id coming along with a "Snow-Plow-Session".
In all cases it will be a tough session just for tough RR-man who will need to pull up their socks to get the f...g track cleared before the next westbound needs passing by WITHOUT ANY DELAY!!!!
But I don't want to promise too much right now
Your's TUME
Tume I heavily enjoyed your route and I do like how you are updating it. But one small critique that i have is the snow texture. From a distance where the trees are out of view it creates a whitewash efffect. One thing I would do is add a very small variation in the snow texture to break up the effect. It will also seem a little more realistic considering that there is rarely a place where snow covers everything perfectly.
Hello Tume,
First off I would like to say that I really admire your Milwaukee Road ~ Avery To Drexel Route and your so desperately needed Milwaukee Road stock. I also love how you are able to find so many seasonal assets for use on your routes.
That's why I am here. I am making a payware route modeling the Illinois & Midland Railroad in central Illinois and I set it during the winter. So obviously there will be snow on the ground. Would you happen to know of a lot of seasonal textures that can be used well in a mid-west setting and also be used in a PAYWARE route? Also are there any field textures that are seasonal but still show the textures of a barren plowed up field?
I was also wondering how you make a custom asset seasonal?
I really admire your work Tume and hoping you can help me in your area of expertise.
First off I would like to say that I really admire your Milwaukee Road ~ Avery To Drexel Route and your so desperately needed Milwaukee Road stock. I also love how you are able to find so many seasonal assets for use on your routes.
That's why I am here. I am making a payware route modeling the Illinois & Midland Railroad in central Illinois and I set it during the winter. So obviously there will be snow on the ground. Would you happen to know of a lot of seasonal textures that can be used well in a mid-west setting and also be used in a PAYWARE route? Also are there any field textures that are seasonal but still show the textures of a barren plowed up field?
I was also wondering how you make a custom asset seasonal?
I really admire your work Tume and hoping you can help me in your area of expertise.
montanawestren
meh..
I love the pics of 4500, the Mullan branch train is near exact!!!! Catch me if im wrong but didnt UP interchange with the NP at Mullan, ID, guess I need to look through my big book of NP 
.
Catch me if im wrong but didnt UP interchange with the NP at Mullan, ID, guess I need to look through my big book of NP .Hallo,
thank you all for your nice words and recommendations – as always appreciated
@ Ace39:
I know what you mean about the whitewash effect. It’s always not easy to create nice looking snow versions of anything. This is because snow is not like snow – not from the color as snow is not always white – as well as from the volume as we can have many snow covering everything below half a meter of it or we can have snow which covers just some areas but not all.
Eventually I need to consider two things. First is time. I just want to get some things done and I had to create hundreds of new assets to replace the non seasonal stuff in that route. The other thing it performance. I don’t want to introduce too many extra mesh and polygons e.g. for heavy snow piles here and then. Therefore I decided to go for a “medium” snowy area – just enough snow to cover everything but not as much for creating large snow piles. The only exaptation will be if the wind plowed snow piles onto tracks e.g. into a cut which eventually will be cleared out during a snow plow session.
I already attempt to create patterned snow textures to prevent the “whitewash” effect. And it works in a short and in a middle distance. You are right it does not work in the far distance. The best I can probably do is to make some of my snow textures a bit more light grey looking rather than too white. This should create a better mixture even in the distance – so I hope.
Again: Thank you for your critics its really appreciated and helps me a lot to get things done in a better way.
@ BlakeDooley:
“I also love how you are able to find so many seasonal assets for use on your routes.”
Well I did not find the seasonal assets, I just created the content by myself – except the speed trees and a few assets created by Dinorius Redundicus e.g. the rock boulders. That means I needed to create a seasonal replacement for nearly all assets which I previously used at my Avery – Drexel – Route which originally has been released as builtin at TS2010 exclusively.
“I was also wondering how you make a custom asset seasonal?”
As I already described, I created the seasonal assets by myself. There is a technique to make an existing asset from another creator seasonal. All you have to do first is: You need to ask the original creator to get his permission to do so. If he allows you to continue, you need to create just a snowy reskin from the original asset and then you need to arrange all the mesh and texture filed into the new asset folder within a new config file. Sometimes such a reskin technique results in quite suitable looking seasonal assets but more often reskinning is just not enough to update an asset from a non seasonal into a seasonal one because mostly the mesh needs to be touched as well.
To create a seasonal asset e.g. to replace a non seasonal DLS house, I just measure the house by using the rulers in trainz surveyor. After that I create my own mesh and my own texture to create a similar looking house with the same dimensions. Once the asset is finished and installed in trainz I do the asset replacement – mostly by using the replacement tool – sometimes by hand.
“Would you happen to know of a lot of seasonal textures that can be used well in a mid-west setting and also be used in a PAYWARE route?”
All of the textures I used for my Avery – Drexel – Route – Update have been created by myself and its still unreleased. Therefore it could go into a payware route as well. If you are interested we just would have to find an agreement together as well as with N3V. In any cases it probably would be the best if I would create a bundle containing the textures you would like to use but with a new kuid number for each of the textures. This would keep the textures you would use independent from the textures I use and any changes I perhaps make afterwards at that textures would not affect your route.
“Also are there any field textures that are seasonal but still show the textures of a barren plowed up field?”
Mcguirel made some seasonal crop textures, but it’s on DLS and therefore not suitable for a payware route. But you could ask her to get the permission to use this textures inside your payware route as well. Perhaps you could make her an offer about some payment and she will agree. Just ask her and then it’s a matter about seeing what happens.
@ montanawestren:
Just find an NP map from about 1900 below. There you can see that the NP track goes as far as Wallace, Id. From there the map indicates three branches going from Wallace to Wardner, to Sunset and to Bruke. The map also indicates other RRs drawn as very thin black lines. Such a one goes from Wardner further to Tekoa. I know that Tekoa used to be served by UP. That line was the first at Tekoa which has later been overpassed by the MILW via a large steel trestle which is still there while both line have been ripped off – shame. This line connecting to Wardner could have been built by the UP or by a local RR and the UP purchased the line later on. Eventually there could have been an interchange between UP and NP at Mullan, Id but it is more likely that such an interchange used to be further west e.g. at Wallace or Kellogg or so. I conclude this as there have been a big deal of discussion about the old historic NP station building at Wallace back the time (about 1980) as the Intestate 90 needed to be built through Wallace, Id. And this station building was always named as a NP station building not as a UP station building. So from that point of view you may have a look into your sources too – just to be sure.
BTW: It’s quite interesting that the NP map indicates a proposed NP line between Lind and Ellensburg, Wa – probably as a short cut to the line via Pasco as there was nothing between Lind and Ellensburg back that time which would have satisfied a local rail line rather than the use as a short cut. Later the MILW used this corridor for its mainline. I also knows about some correspondence between the two general managers from the NP and the MILW about the possibility for NP trains to go from Lind directly via Othello and Kittitas to Ellensburg joining back onto NP track just west of Ellensburg. But NP did not jump onto that possibility as far as I understood that correspondence. There was an interchange at Lind but in my point of view they just changes some cars from one RR to the other but never a whole train. The biggest problem that they did not do so, probably was the electrification. There was no maintenance anymore for transcontinental steam locos between Othello and Kittitas. And especially at the steep grade between Beverly and Boylston such maintenance would have been required. To go with NP steam locos to Othello in order to change power by using the MILW electrics to carry the train to Ellensburg in order to change power again would probably have been too complicated and the save too less. The only possibility which perhaps have never been discussed would have been to extend the electrification from Othello to Lind moving all of the maintenance facilities from Othello to there where it could have been used by both RRs. But we know a collaboration along this corridor have never been established and both RRs eventually went down in this particular area where only the two mainlines remained at Lind and at Ellensburg after it’s reopening in BNSF times. And would Othello have never became such a big place of potato food production, it would have lost it rail connection at all.
Your’s TUME
thank you all for your nice words and recommendations – as always appreciated
@ Ace39:
I know what you mean about the whitewash effect. It’s always not easy to create nice looking snow versions of anything. This is because snow is not like snow – not from the color as snow is not always white – as well as from the volume as we can have many snow covering everything below half a meter of it or we can have snow which covers just some areas but not all.
Eventually I need to consider two things. First is time. I just want to get some things done and I had to create hundreds of new assets to replace the non seasonal stuff in that route. The other thing it performance. I don’t want to introduce too many extra mesh and polygons e.g. for heavy snow piles here and then. Therefore I decided to go for a “medium” snowy area – just enough snow to cover everything but not as much for creating large snow piles. The only exaptation will be if the wind plowed snow piles onto tracks e.g. into a cut which eventually will be cleared out during a snow plow session.
I already attempt to create patterned snow textures to prevent the “whitewash” effect. And it works in a short and in a middle distance. You are right it does not work in the far distance. The best I can probably do is to make some of my snow textures a bit more light grey looking rather than too white. This should create a better mixture even in the distance – so I hope.
Again: Thank you for your critics its really appreciated and helps me a lot to get things done in a better way.
@ BlakeDooley:
“I also love how you are able to find so many seasonal assets for use on your routes.”
Well I did not find the seasonal assets, I just created the content by myself – except the speed trees and a few assets created by Dinorius Redundicus e.g. the rock boulders. That means I needed to create a seasonal replacement for nearly all assets which I previously used at my Avery – Drexel – Route which originally has been released as builtin at TS2010 exclusively.
“I was also wondering how you make a custom asset seasonal?”
As I already described, I created the seasonal assets by myself. There is a technique to make an existing asset from another creator seasonal. All you have to do first is: You need to ask the original creator to get his permission to do so. If he allows you to continue, you need to create just a snowy reskin from the original asset and then you need to arrange all the mesh and texture filed into the new asset folder within a new config file. Sometimes such a reskin technique results in quite suitable looking seasonal assets but more often reskinning is just not enough to update an asset from a non seasonal into a seasonal one because mostly the mesh needs to be touched as well.
To create a seasonal asset e.g. to replace a non seasonal DLS house, I just measure the house by using the rulers in trainz surveyor. After that I create my own mesh and my own texture to create a similar looking house with the same dimensions. Once the asset is finished and installed in trainz I do the asset replacement – mostly by using the replacement tool – sometimes by hand.
“Would you happen to know of a lot of seasonal textures that can be used well in a mid-west setting and also be used in a PAYWARE route?”
All of the textures I used for my Avery – Drexel – Route – Update have been created by myself and its still unreleased. Therefore it could go into a payware route as well. If you are interested we just would have to find an agreement together as well as with N3V. In any cases it probably would be the best if I would create a bundle containing the textures you would like to use but with a new kuid number for each of the textures. This would keep the textures you would use independent from the textures I use and any changes I perhaps make afterwards at that textures would not affect your route.
“Also are there any field textures that are seasonal but still show the textures of a barren plowed up field?”
Mcguirel made some seasonal crop textures, but it’s on DLS and therefore not suitable for a payware route. But you could ask her to get the permission to use this textures inside your payware route as well. Perhaps you could make her an offer about some payment and she will agree. Just ask her and then it’s a matter about seeing what happens.
@ montanawestren:
Just find an NP map from about 1900 below. There you can see that the NP track goes as far as Wallace, Id. From there the map indicates three branches going from Wallace to Wardner, to Sunset and to Bruke. The map also indicates other RRs drawn as very thin black lines. Such a one goes from Wardner further to Tekoa. I know that Tekoa used to be served by UP. That line was the first at Tekoa which has later been overpassed by the MILW via a large steel trestle which is still there while both line have been ripped off – shame. This line connecting to Wardner could have been built by the UP or by a local RR and the UP purchased the line later on. Eventually there could have been an interchange between UP and NP at Mullan, Id but it is more likely that such an interchange used to be further west e.g. at Wallace or Kellogg or so. I conclude this as there have been a big deal of discussion about the old historic NP station building at Wallace back the time (about 1980) as the Intestate 90 needed to be built through Wallace, Id. And this station building was always named as a NP station building not as a UP station building. So from that point of view you may have a look into your sources too – just to be sure.
BTW: It’s quite interesting that the NP map indicates a proposed NP line between Lind and Ellensburg, Wa – probably as a short cut to the line via Pasco as there was nothing between Lind and Ellensburg back that time which would have satisfied a local rail line rather than the use as a short cut. Later the MILW used this corridor for its mainline. I also knows about some correspondence between the two general managers from the NP and the MILW about the possibility for NP trains to go from Lind directly via Othello and Kittitas to Ellensburg joining back onto NP track just west of Ellensburg. But NP did not jump onto that possibility as far as I understood that correspondence. There was an interchange at Lind but in my point of view they just changes some cars from one RR to the other but never a whole train. The biggest problem that they did not do so, probably was the electrification. There was no maintenance anymore for transcontinental steam locos between Othello and Kittitas. And especially at the steep grade between Beverly and Boylston such maintenance would have been required. To go with NP steam locos to Othello in order to change power by using the MILW electrics to carry the train to Ellensburg in order to change power again would probably have been too complicated and the save too less. The only possibility which perhaps have never been discussed would have been to extend the electrification from Othello to Lind moving all of the maintenance facilities from Othello to there where it could have been used by both RRs. But we know a collaboration along this corridor have never been established and both RRs eventually went down in this particular area where only the two mainlines remained at Lind and at Ellensburg after it’s reopening in BNSF times. And would Othello have never became such a big place of potato food production, it would have lost it rail connection at all.
Your’s TUME
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