The Florida High Speed Rail Authority.... Dead or Alive???

[Isaacg]

Everything from Florida DOT hiring Virgin Trains for being the operator for a 5-year contract to the Bombardier-Flour Corp. building the trains for the proposed Virgin Trains Florida.... to 2 years later, Gov. Bush derailing the plan, yet congress advises the authority to go through. The citizens of Florida being plagued by the Governer's anti-rail remarks being "It will make teachers loose they're jobs, put criminals on the street, and will take medicine away from the needy"... as its been discussed over and over again. Is Florida still with the HSR project? California is, and its making me GREEN with envy. If Florida kept to its word, the FHSR "Virgin Trains Florida" would have been completed by next year. Connecting my city, Tampa with it's "Twin City" Orlando. I find it very confusing to see that its still in motion, and all. I have some quotes and links provided:

Officials of Virgin Trains roamed Florida this week to talk with contractors and officials of the Florida High Speed Rail Authority, which plans a $2.6-billion bullet-train system between Orlando and Tampa.

This would not be Virgin's first interest in Florida high-speed trains. Branson met with Florida officials in 1998 during the state's last attempt to create a high-speed rail system, dubbed Florida Overland eXpress, or FOX. Virgin never pursued the deal, though, and in early 1999 newly elected Gov. Jeb Bush killed the FOX project.

http://www.jacksonville.com/apnews/stories/042404/D82595IO1.shtml

http://www.sptimes.com/2004/02/21/Business/Speed_rail_contractor.shtml

... Its nice to know that Virgin Trains is excited to run high speed rail trains in Florida. I'd also like to think that the initiative will still be in the "works". As there are rumors about a Florida version of Amtrak California, but I'm not as keen on it as I am the HSR Project. As I'm not sure about Crist's stance in transportation, but he funded the TBARTA, the Tampa Bay Area Regional Transportaion Agency with $2 Million Dollars for a jump start in the project, and plans to support the agency some more along with the FTA, FRA, FDOT, USDOT, and some other government departmentals. I think that if this is working, FHSR could be a new step forward, although theres been talk of Maglevs, Monorails, Bi-Level commuter cars, Electrified railways, Large stations in Tampa and Miami or Orlando and JAX. This is all exciting, but is it really up-to-date in the senses that there are any 08 updates or there are any projections for the future in these projects. I hope if this does go out as planned, that Virgin is re-considered the operator for this first bid. I think that in the first place, they wanted a 5-year bid for the system whenever the contract goes up, a new company takes over, unless there are no calls for the bid, the same contractor will be the same. I think its a good start to choose a company like Virgin, as its a UK corp and the UK knows how to manage its rail services. Arriva, First and Stagecoach already run city bus services and school bus services here in the US, and are also good targets for holding the rail service. Not just for Florida, but any other state in the Continental US, Alaska, and Hawaii.

Isaac

 

[Winterpaw]

florida is extremely spread out, theyd seriously have to fix the local commuter systems in these cities and make them more used-friendly to the people that dont live in those areas.

ive lived in both tampa and orlando and know what a tiresome mess it is to hop buses all day to get where you want. id ultimately take my car between tampa and orlando just out of convenience on the other side.

 

[ish6]

Interesting .... thanks for the info .... I'm from Daytona Beach ....

Ish

 

[Isaacg]

florida is extremely spread out, theyd seriously have to fix the local commuter systems in these cities and make them more used-friendly to the people that dont live in those areas.

ive lived in both tampa and orlando and know what a tiresome mess it is to hop buses all day to get where you want. id ultimately take my car between tampa and orlando just out of convenience on the other side.

I'm not talking about local transit systems like LYNX, JTA, MDTA, PSTA, PCPT, or HARTline.... I mean the Florida High Speed Rail plan. Which will be eventually created through Amtrak Florida(I checked the FDOT Rail Strategic Plan). As a Tampanian who's ridden HARTline, PSTA, PCPT, SCAT, MCAT, THE Bus, CTA, and some various other transit systems, I found them to have more ridership(they put new tags for standing passengers to hold onto on PSTA and HART buses), friendlier bus drivers, good customer service, an online transit planner, a delay info page on the websites, and some counties are gearing up for light railways similar to TRAX of Dever RTD, DART of Dallas, Metro of LA, and LYNX of Charlotte. I'd still like to know if there is anymore updates than the fact that this project will be an Amtrak Florida project(bad idea I think.... it should be run by Virgin Trains) or if it will be used like a UK-style franchise...

ISaac

 

[Tokkyu40]

I'm against it, since I want a valid high speed rail system. Governments tend to build expensive political show pieces and run them into the ground.
The ideal system would be a series of high-speed privately owned links between neighboring air hubs, then connect them to complete the system when you reach the critical saturation. If the stations are built to generate revenue it should turn a profit fairly quickly.
The government system is almost guaranteed to be slow, overpriced and unreliable, and a big money loser.

Claude

 

[Winterpaw]

i think youve misunderstood me

im all for some sort of transportation between cities, im saying that people wont want to use the rail system if they cant easily move around once they get to the city theyre going to, which needs to be addressed.

so in essences we agree but on seperate, though related, subjects that effect each other and their popularity.

 

[bendorsey]

I think in the long run the ridership will never justify the enormous cost of building the system. It will be a political boondoggle of the first order and an albatross around the necks of the Florida taxpayer.

Far better to re-introduce passenger service on the FEC from Miami to Jacksonville with a spur to Orlando from either Titusville or Port St. John. The ridership and rails are already in place.

Ben

P. S. I grew up in St. Petersburg and now live in Tequesta (a little north of West Palm Beach).

 

[Isaacg]

i think youve misunderstood me

im all for some sort of transportation between cities, im saying that people wont want to use the rail system if they cant easily move around once they get to the city theyre going to, which needs to be addressed.

so in essences we agree but on seperate, though related, subjects that effect each other and their popularity.

Winterpaw

You DO have a point. Its a bit like an Airport system. After you arrive at the gate(In this case, a platform), you find your way to the baggage claim area. Then after you've grabbed your luggage, the first thing you'd head for is the taxi stand, bus centre, or train station(with signs directing you to the areas such as Transport, Food Court, Information/Tickets, and etc). Right now, TBARTA has moved a couple more steps forward with implementing the referendum to the ballot for 2010. They recieved state funding to start a base(Headquarters, Salary for Director, Website Tools, and Transit Centre, and the plan to lease 50 buses from each TBARTA-served county). In an earlier thread, I mentioned the Commuter Rail Services similar to those of Amtrak California. They are being considered as a starter for the High Speed Rail. So when California, gets its HST, Amtrak will re-assign them to new services connecting Florida's major metropolitan areas.

Bendorsey,

I live in Clearwater. A Suburb(if you will) of Tampa. Its the 3rd Largest Municipality/City in the West Central Florida Region. The weather isnt that good right now in Downtown, and its starting to sprinkle :'( :hehe: .

I'd better leave.

Isaac

 

[Winterpaw]

i hope very much they get these many facets in order and produce a system we all can use and enjoy.

i would most definitely use it to go between tampa and melbourne, if those were stops, when i am in florida visiting family. driving 3+ hours back and forth can be a killer especially catching I4 Disney traffic at the wrong time of day.

 

[Outwest]

As a resident of Beautiful South Tampa, I must Agree with Winterpaw. My wife works in a Major Business center in the Westshore district, yet she tried once not too long ago to try out taking the bus to work. Well for the total distance of 5.2 miles from our house to her work, she would have to get up at 4:30am to be able to arrive at work by 8am. The local transit system we already have here in place needs some serious adjusment before it could be justified to use. Matter of fact, The city of Tampa has alot of unused trackage already in place, for instance, how about the Brooksville line, that sees maybe 3-4 trains a week? The time to act on that would be NOW, before CSX pulls up what is already in place. I am all for Rail transit in FL, only halfway decent thing we have is the ability to hop on amtrak for a $16 ride into ORL from TPA. My 2.43 cents.

Mike

 

[Isaacg]

Courtney Campbell is a NIGHTMARE.... Let alone S. Skyway, I4, 275, US19, and any other product of Tampa that the government deemed "successful". At least Tampa Bay has seen the light on transit. We're the only Metro area in the Continental US that does not have a fully-fledged transit system.

Isaac

 

[mawilson]

Winterpaw, Use I4 to SR517 to SR528 and bypass most of the Disney traffic.

ish, Man you are close. I'm an I-4 hostage from Deltona.

Issacg, I'm not positive but, I think the constitutional amendment requiring the system was repealed. Anyway, I'm with bendorsey. I don't think it would ever pay for itself.

Then again, there ain't anything stopping us from building one in Trainz.

 

[Winterpaw]

Winterpaw, Use I4 to SR517 to SR528 and bypass most of the Disney traffic.

oh yeah, i always go Davenport and take the south route through Kissimmee. my family has lived in florida for 24 years now, ive learned to dodge that mess as best as possible.

 

[Isaacg]

Winterpaw, Use I4 to SR517 to SR528 and bypass most of the Disney traffic.

ish, Man you are close. I'm an I-4 hostage from Deltona.

Issacg, I'm not positive but, I think the constitutional amendment requiring the system was repealed. Anyway, I'm with bendorsey. I don't think it would ever pay for itself.

Then again, there ain't anything stopping us from building one in Trainz.

It WAS repealed in 2004, because of all the lies Jeb Bush created(I hate the FCAT, his Educational programs, and brainwashing students that you have to be in school all your life). There is still talk of it, but in a different form. Amtrak says it wants to start InterCity services in the state like Amtrak California's services. They say its a step into the right direction with HSR.

Isaac

 

[strench707]

i didn't know amtrak had plans for such a thing. i was reading rains magazine and there is a proposal to upgrade the NEC and to create 1 new coridor that will not be identified yet. Could be that or maybe an LA lAS Vegas connection. I was thinkin something west but I could be wrond. I'm just a marylander in annapolis with no hope of MARC building a line out here. Too bad they have most the track... sigh

Davis

 

[Isaacg]

i didn't know amtrak had plans for such a thing. i was reading rains magazine and there is a proposal to upgrade the NEC and to create 1 new coridor that will not be identified yet. Could be that or maybe an LA lAS Vegas connection. I was thinkin something west but I could be wrond. I'm just a marylander in annapolis with no hope of MARC building a line out here. Too bad they have most the track... sigh

Davis

This project has been out for a while now. Amtrak officials met with officials in the locales of Miami, Tampa Bay, Orlando, and JAX. Why don't you want MARC to build a line out there. Trains mag doesnt cover EVERYTHING. I suggest, if you ever find interest, go to govenment websites. Its much more valid.

Isaac

 

[strench707]

no i do want them to build sorry.It would be great. It would work perfectly. They could go to DC and Baltimore easily. There is a wye on the NEC near Bowie that CSX uses (Popes Creek Sub) which lets trains go North and South on the NEC without flipping around. Then near Six Flags America it could split off again and follow 214 nto Parole and then head into Annapolis where the ld trolley tracks went. Its still a grass line all the way in from Parole to Annapolis from the old Trolley line. I just dream all day.

Davis

 

[rjhowie]

Makes me appreciate how lucky I am with local transport on this side of the pond in Glasgow and a woman having to get up in the middle of the night for a bus ride of less than six miles?! My suburban electric system has one of it's lines through my suburb and I am just over 5 miles from the city centre like the lady concerned. The train service runs a train every 15 minutes from the early hours to midnight and they run under the 2 rail termini Glasgow (Central) and Glasgow (Queen Street so a goodly choice as to where in the city centre you want to go. There is a junction which allows access to both places. I have three bus services running every 15 minutes and I walk 5 minutes further on, I would have four! I often have to ponder when people complain about public transport here because they are more fortunate than they realise

Even in Scotland's two major cities, Glasgow and Edinburgh we have a high speed shuttle that runs the 50 odd miles with a 15 minutes service on a main line (there is also a slow line between the 2 cities and a third being re-opened!). In the evening the fast service is a 30 minute interval as slightly quieter

 

[Winterpaw]

Portland, Oregons lightrail is fantastic for getting around, it still takes quite a bit more than driving but its cheap, clean, and you dont have to find parking. The bus system on the city side is efficient and effective. I rode from 15 miles out of the city center to downtown, caught a bus, and was in the downtown area mall before I could barely get cold from the winter weather.

Same with San Jose. I walked out of my hotel room, got on the local, jumped off at International House of Pancakes.

 

[PerRock]

well if anyone is curious here is my thoughts for HSR in the US...

http://maps.google.com/maps/ms?ie=U...40291,-92.109375&spn=77.393944,105.292969&z=3

peter