Problem with HOG.

[Tokkyu40]

I'm trying (with limited success) to learn HOG. I followed the instructions for both HOG and MicroDEM, plus two tutorials, and managed to merge the desired route, generate the .bmp map, elevation histograms and tiger map, import to HOG, set up the little windows in HOG, then pushed the button to generate the ground file.
The error message was "tile template file tile_blank.dat not found or failed to open"
Did I miss a step? Do I need to make a new file? Do I need to scrap HOG and download it again? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

Claude

 

[Dermmy]

Hi Claude

While HOG will allow you to browse to the location of the images used to generate the gnd file, it will only actually work if the images are located in the HOG program folder. I suspect that moving them there will fix your problem.

I always convert the bmp images to tga format, not sure if HOG reads bmps...

Andy

 

[Tokkyu40]

The images are in the HOG folder in .tga format. Is there a special file in HOG they should be in?

Claude

Edit: I moved the DEM and TIGER images to another folder, deleted HOG, reinstalled it from the zipfiles and tried again. With the images back in HOG, and confirming that the Tile_blank.dat file is there and ready to go, I get the same results.

CLM

 

[Jerker]

G'day Tokkyu40,

Once again, you can place the *.tga files anywhere on your computer and HOG will browse to find them so that it will do what it has to do. However you MUST create the *.gnd file in the same 'folder' where the "Tile_blank.dat" file exists. This file is created when you install HOG in the main HOG folder (the %HOG% root folder). This offers you two choices. Either you can ALWAYS create the *.gnd file there (moving it to the appropriate Trainz/World/Custom/Map folder afterwards) or you can copy the "Tile_blank.dat" file to the location where you WANT to create the *.gnd file. Since the latter method involves a lot of unnecessary file moving and copying, I choose the former!

Jerker {}

 

[Dermmy]

G'day Jerker - long time

Oddly enough I have exactly the opposite experience with HOG:

If I do NOT have the tga's in the HOG directory then I get the exact error message that Claude reports and HOG grinds to a standstill.

However i habitually create the .gnd file direct to the desktop - makes it quicker to find.

Somebody recently described getting things right in Trainz as 'black magic', might be the same thing here

Andy...

 

[RPearson]

My recollection is like Jerker's but who knows it been a while since I last used HOG to create a gnd file. The fact is HOG needs to read the tile_blank file to create a gnd file. If it doesn't work by placing the image files and a copy of the tile_blank in a seperate directory then move the image files to the directory the HOG program is in (and make sure the tile_blank file is there too!) and do it that way. It's really not that difficult. In this case one way or the other and probably both work.

Trainz itself is a great black box. HOG in comparision is rather straight forward.

Bob Pearson

 

[Jerker]

G'day Tokkyu40,

Hey there Dermy, indeed, it has been some time since we last 'conversed'. I trust you are well? I have to say that some may see it as 'black magic' but it's all logic to me. Given your statement, I must conclude that you have a copy of the tile_blank.dat file on your desktop, as well, otherwise HOG could not possibly create any *.gnd file there! If this is not the case, then I am not surprise that you get the error message (your interpretation of it's cause is simply incorrect)

Rob has summed the matter up quite succinctly. Wherever you attempt to create the *.gnd file, there must reside a copy of the tile_blank.dat file! It doesn't matter where that is, HOG will allow you to browse to the file location to point towards it. My attitude is to save myself as much work as possible, so I keep the tile_blank.dat file in the root HOG directory and always create the *.gnd file there, moving it as required, later. For ease and convenience, I have a shortcut on my desktop to take me directly to the HOG root directory. Maybe I should also provide one directly to the Trainz/World/Custom/maps directory but I am intrinsically lazy and still 'browse' there manually every time I need to.

Jerker {}

 

[RPearson]

G'day to you Jerker, To check it out I grabbed the laptop and a couple of old image files. When I placed the images in a seperated directory and ran HOG I got the error tile_blank.dat not found. By adding a copy of the tile_texture.dat in the directory with the image files it ran. However I also requested texturing the map and I got a warning that it was unable to find the textures.txt file in the current directory though it proceeded to create a gnd file but left it unpainted. Adding a copy of the textures.txt file to the directory with the images and rerunning HOG got a painted gnd file.

I'll add that this worked because I specified the output gnd file to be in the same directory as as the image files. When I specified a new directory for the gnd file I got the same error and warning as above. When tile_blank.dat and textures.txt were added to the new output directory it worked - no error or warning.

EDIT: So the key it appears is the directory you specify for the gnd file (path you supply when specifing the output file). This must have the tile_blank.dat and textures.txt files in it. - that's what I thought but there is another possibilty that HOG uses the path from the last file you specify on the form to look for the needed files. And sure enough that's what it does. In the past I've always put image and output files in the same directory so it was easy for me - it worked consistetly - copy in the image files and move the gnd file out.

So if you use different directories for the input and output files for HOG it searches the last directory you specified in filling out the form before you hit "Generate gnd file" to find the textures.txt and tile_blank.dat files. It could be either the directory with the image files or the output gnd file directory. Just put copies in one of them and make sure you specify that one last and it should work fine.

Bob Pearson

 

[Dinorius_Redundicus]

I wish we could 'sticky' this thread, or add the essential question and answer to the Trainz FAQ. This thing about the tile_blank.dat trips up so many HOG users.

 

[RPearson]

And I still say this is straight forward compared to Trainz itself.

Bob Pearson

 

[Tokkyu40]

Since it seems a needlessly evil curse right now, I'll accept the term "black magic".
I went to this tutorial again and set up the textures exactly as described, and got the message "source is not uncompressed true colour targa image". Apparently, it's missreading the .tga files in the HOG folder.
I used PhotoFiltre to do the conversion. I don't know if that makes a difference.
On the other hand, I seem to have moved past (or I'm not reaching ) the original error. Every little bit helps.

Claude

 

[RPearson]

Claude some progs compress them by default. Check if that's the case. HOG will only read uncompressed files.

Bob Pearson

 

[Tokkyu40]

Okay, it's late, and I'm off to bed, but here's what I have so far.
I downloaded the latest IrfanView and reconverted the image files.
This time the error message said it couldn't find the textures, but it did generate the ground file, so I deleted the Trains ground file and replaced it with the HOG version.
On opening the layout I found the TIGER lines on the minimap, but not on the baseboards. The boards were there, and trimmed to fit the track just like in the tutorials, so I followed the minimap to lay the mainline and go for a drive.

Here's a South Kansas & Oklahoma engine south-bound out of Bartlesville and heading for the BNSF yard in Tulsa.

There are no bridges yet, and of course no cuttings or embankments, so it's a lot like riding a rollercoaster, but the terrain is all right where it should be.

Thanks to everyone who got me this far. If I can't get the textures sorted (yes, they've been copied to the Trainz folder, just like it says) this is still an excellent product. I would never have made it to this point without all the help.

Claude

 

[Dermmy]

Given your statement, I must conclude that you have a copy of the tile_blank.dat file on your desktop, as well, otherwise HOG could not possibly create any *.gnd file there! If this is not the case, then I am not surprise that you get the error message (your interpretation of it's cause is simply incorrect)
Jerker {}

Sorry Jerker, but wrong! I just re-ran a HOG route creation as I normally do it to be certain that my recollection was correct:

1. To find the tga files they must be in the HOG folder. I tried a couple of other locations and crashed out with the error message Claude quotes after 'browsing' to the locations.

2. Created the .gnd file direct to the desk-top, where i definitely do NOT have a tile_blank.dat (or any other HOG file).

3. Apart from the error message Claude reports when I did once locate the tga files somewhere other than the HOG folder I have never had an error while running HOG and I always create the gnd file to the desktop.

I am not trying to be argumentative, just suggesting that there may be more than one way to skin this particular cat...

Andy

 

[RPearson]

Okay, it's late, and I'm off to bed, but here's what I have so far.
I downloaded the latest IrfanView and reconverted the image files.
This time the error message said it couldn't find the textures, but it did generate the ground file, so I deleted the Trains ground file and replaced it with the HOG version...

On opening the layout I found the TIGER lines on the minimap, but not on the baseboards. If I can't get the textures sorted (yes, they've been copied to the Trainz folder, just like it says) this is still an excellent product. I would never have made it to this point without all the help.

Claude

The error means that HOG can't find the textures.txt file. This file tells HOG which HOG ground texture kuid to assign to a given color in the Tiger image file. I'd suggest you put a copy in the same directory that you put tile_blank.dat file if you're not doing everything in the HOG directory. Several questions:
1) What directory did you put the image files in?
2) What directory did you create the gnd file in?
3) What directory is the tile_blank.dat file in?
4) What directory is the textures.txt file in?
5) Which was the last file you specified in the HOG program form before generating the gnd file - elevation data, additional data or output?

@ Dermmy
I tried it the way you indicated with the image files in the HOG directory and the output to the desktop and it failed with the error abt unable to find tile_blank.dat. The last file I specified was the output file in the desktop directory. When I specified one of the image files (additional data) in the HOG directory last - it worked. This is exactly the way I described in my post above. HOG uses the path to the last file specified to find the tile_blank.dat and textures.txt files. So I'd like to ask you the the same question #5.

Bob Pearson

 

[Dermmy]

Bob

I think you've nailed it!

I just re-did another HOG creation to be sure and I have no idea why, but I habitually fill in the HOG thingy bottom-to-top, specifying the image files last. Possibly I found this way worked 'way back when' and just do it without thinking.

Which confirms my thought that there may have been more than one way to skin this cat!

Simplest solution would of course be to put the image files in the HOG folder and create the gnd file to the same location....

Andy

 

[Tokkyu40]

The error means that HOG can't find the textures.txt file...
... Several questions:
1) What directory did you put the image files in?
2) What directory did you create the gnd file in?
3) What directory is the tile_blank.dat file in?
4) What directory is the textures.txt file in?
5) Which was the last file you specified in the HOG program form before generating the gnd file - elevation data, additional data or output?

@ Dermmy
I tried it the way you indicated with the image files in the HOG directory and the output to the desktop and it failed with the error abt unable to find tile_blank.dat. The last file I specified was the output file in the desktop directory. When I specified one of the image files (additional data) in the HOG directory last - it worked. This is exactly the way I described in my post above. HOG uses the path to the last file specified to find the tile_blank.dat and textures.txt files. So I'd like to ask you the the same question #5.

Bob Pearson

I did everything in the HOG folder just like the tutorial said. Windows were filled in top to bottom (does it make a difference?) so output was the last one to be picked.
I did go back and check the spelling. When I set up the HOG folder as per the tutorial, I missed the final "s" in textures.txt, so that's why it couldn't find it.
Does anyone else have the file set up like that, or am I the only one?

Claude

Edit: Spelling corrected, new .gnd file made, and now the colors show up in surveyer. Now I need to practice. Thanks for walking me through this.
CLM