Do you know of any particular way to repro this bug, or any specific assets that may be used to trigger a repro?
chris
Patching TS12 v. 49922 to v. 57720
- Thread starter steamboateng
- Start date
Do you know of any particular way to repro this bug, or any specific assets that may be used to trigger a repro?
chris
This doesn't appear to match Vern's description (his bug involves loading and saving the route, yours does not appear to) so I'll assume that these are two unrelated issues. Are you still able to repro this issue in SP1? What assets are you using?
I should also note that you guys appear to be under the misapprehension that we read every thread on these forums. We generally don't have time to do anything more than skim topics, so "reporting" something on the forum is usually about as effective as "reporting" it to a brick wall. If you've brought this up with helpdesk and the message hasn't gotten through to the dev team, then I apologise, but they're pretty heavily worked as well and may sometimes not realise that what you're talking about is a legitimate bug. Your best bet with any actual bug report is to send an example asset through to <trainzdev@auran.com> with a very clear explanation of what the problem is.
thanks,
chris
And that is probably why it's never actually been reported properly. Everyone who is aware of it probably "can't believe that the dev team hasn't already seen it."
Okay, so if it's reproducible.. how exactly do we go about reproducing this issue? Literally just install the route on a fresh build, save and reload it?
Sure. I'm much happier with native mode and well-built native assets than I was with the old pre-TS2009 style assets and routes. Looks better and performs better. There, was that so hard?
kind regards,
chris
To hang a lantern on the spline problem, Chris, this is what I have seen:
I will go into surveyor and add fixed track items, i.e. Andi06's animated turnouts, fixed track stations, BNSF50's crossings to name a few, and then save them in surveyor. Now it might take a while before it does it, but eventually I will be rolling along in driver and derail at the switch, station, crossing! I go into surveyor again to the place of derailment only to find the track has unattached itself from the switch, station, or crossing. I don't know if the fact that those items tend to dig into the terrain when placing tend to cause the spline to eventually disconnect due to the fact that the crossing or switch has buried itself lower than the spline is the cause, but when looking at surveyor at the disconnect the track seems to have raised back up to the original level of the terrain and the affected switch or crossing is still buried into the terrain.
Just a thought that might shed some insight into what might be causing it.
Some testing of SP1 and importing older stuff.
I was able to bring in thecowboy's 9000 locomotives without any problems what so ever Hurray!
I attempted to import Sherman Hill 2.0 and ended up with 148 broken assets, almost all due to the thumbnail issue. I am also missing some stuff and will have to do some research.
At this point I have no intention of updating my main installation. I have decided to start a new "main" installation of TS12-57720 and gradually import all my content.
I can not recommend applying this patch to your existing TS12 installation if you have a large number of older routes and assets. Far better to start with a new installation and import and debug as you go along. JMO.
I was able to bring in thecowboy's 9000 locomotives without any problems what so ever Hurray!
I attempted to import Sherman Hill 2.0 and ended up with 148 broken assets, almost all due to the thumbnail issue. I am also missing some stuff and will have to do some research.
At this point I have no intention of updating my main installation. I have decided to start a new "main" installation of TS12-57720 and gradually import all my content.
I can not recommend applying this patch to your existing TS12 installation if you have a large number of older routes and assets. Far better to start with a new installation and import and debug as you go along. JMO.
I have read through this entire thread and seen the level of interaction between N3V and its customer base. I think that N3V's participation is at an all-time high after the release of SP1 for TS2012. I write software (now, as a hobby) but when I did it professionally me any mr group would ALWAYS take into consideration that we could definitely not cover all the bases in testing. One thing we did do - without fail - was to make any patching available to a select few customers and, after making them fully aware they were testing a patch, receive their input. What appears to me, in this case, is that the patch may have been tested by as many beta testers as N3V maintains, but the decision was made to allow the patch to proceed. That is a recipe for disaster.
I am somewhat happy to report that my gaming machine downloaded the entire multi-Gig patch in just under an hour. At 2300 I did a clean re-boot of the machine (Windows 7 Ultimate x64, AMD Athlon II X3 460 3.40Ghz, 8GB RAM, NVIDIA 8400GS w/1G RAM), made sure nothing but essentials were running in the background, pulled the Ethernet cable out, and started the patch. Then I went to bed.
The next morning, I was shown a box telling me that TADDaemon should be allowed through my firewall. I'd seen this after every install so it was not a problem, The patch summary told me there was "1 err and 0 warnings" however it did NOT tell me what the error was.
I fired up CM and did some checking of various items. Nothing appeared to be amiss except there were a load of obsoleted items where they hadn't been before. But what then struck me was that I couldn't find the content that replaced the obsolete items. I ran an EDR. That seemed to solve that particular problem but then a load of items with warnings appeared. Most of the warnings were what I considered rather picky. Like telling me that a given texture is a solid color. Well, so what? Why should CM care that 'red.tga' is actually a solid red color? That's the purpose of making an asset with a red color TGA file, so why flag it as a Warning?
Satisfied with the download process after downloading some random items, I moved onwards to Trainz itself.
Initially, I was taken aback by the added buttons on the initial screen. Not a bad marketing mechanism to have a given list of items for sale. Moving on to the Routes button, I was baffled by the appearance of all the colors depicting various routes available. I think I may have figured out what they mean, but a simple legend at the side explaining the colors would have been nice. I picked a route (in green) I had been working on for the last six months and opened it.
A quick traverse showed no errors so I attempted a bit of content placement. There is where the troubles started. I found that there were hundreds of items that, when I clicked on them in the list, no thumbnail showed to rotate in the box. The last time (pre SP1) I used them, I was able to see the item and use it on the route. I went up and down the list and still no thumbnails. I tried placing them on the route, but nothing showed up. Needless to say, I didn't save the route when I exited. When I went back into CM, I found that there were no errors or warnings for some of the specific items I tried to use. They were shown as being in-game, but nothing else. I cured one item by deleting it and re-downloading it from the DLS. Now I was able to use it.
Curious, I fired up my unpatched version of TS12 and looked at the same item. The size was 1.34Mb. Back to SP1 CM and the item was now a whopping 12.6Mb! Three more items later, I determined that the size on all three had gone up exponentially. I haven't had the time (or inclination) to do some comparing between the two versions but it was surprising that they both had the same KUID - just that the size was increased. Would someone care to comment on that? If that trend continues, my disc is going to fill up rather rapidly.
Sorry for the long dissertation. My general grading of this patch has to be around 6 out of 10, no higher.
Bill
I am somewhat happy to report that my gaming machine downloaded the entire multi-Gig patch in just under an hour. At 2300 I did a clean re-boot of the machine (Windows 7 Ultimate x64, AMD Athlon II X3 460 3.40Ghz, 8GB RAM, NVIDIA 8400GS w/1G RAM), made sure nothing but essentials were running in the background, pulled the Ethernet cable out, and started the patch. Then I went to bed.
The next morning, I was shown a box telling me that TADDaemon should be allowed through my firewall. I'd seen this after every install so it was not a problem, The patch summary told me there was "1 err and 0 warnings" however it did NOT tell me what the error was.
I fired up CM and did some checking of various items. Nothing appeared to be amiss except there were a load of obsoleted items where they hadn't been before. But what then struck me was that I couldn't find the content that replaced the obsolete items. I ran an EDR. That seemed to solve that particular problem but then a load of items with warnings appeared. Most of the warnings were what I considered rather picky. Like telling me that a given texture is a solid color. Well, so what? Why should CM care that 'red.tga' is actually a solid red color? That's the purpose of making an asset with a red color TGA file, so why flag it as a Warning?
Satisfied with the download process after downloading some random items, I moved onwards to Trainz itself.
Initially, I was taken aback by the added buttons on the initial screen. Not a bad marketing mechanism to have a given list of items for sale. Moving on to the Routes button, I was baffled by the appearance of all the colors depicting various routes available. I think I may have figured out what they mean, but a simple legend at the side explaining the colors would have been nice. I picked a route (in green) I had been working on for the last six months and opened it.
A quick traverse showed no errors so I attempted a bit of content placement. There is where the troubles started. I found that there were hundreds of items that, when I clicked on them in the list, no thumbnail showed to rotate in the box. The last time (pre SP1) I used them, I was able to see the item and use it on the route. I went up and down the list and still no thumbnails. I tried placing them on the route, but nothing showed up. Needless to say, I didn't save the route when I exited. When I went back into CM, I found that there were no errors or warnings for some of the specific items I tried to use. They were shown as being in-game, but nothing else. I cured one item by deleting it and re-downloading it from the DLS. Now I was able to use it.
Curious, I fired up my unpatched version of TS12 and looked at the same item. The size was 1.34Mb. Back to SP1 CM and the item was now a whopping 12.6Mb! Three more items later, I determined that the size on all three had gone up exponentially. I haven't had the time (or inclination) to do some comparing between the two versions but it was surprising that they both had the same KUID - just that the size was increased. Would someone care to comment on that? If that trend continues, my disc is going to fill up rather rapidly.
Sorry for the long dissertation. My general grading of this patch has to be around 6 out of 10, no higher.
Bill
This raises a very concerning question as you are not the first person to report that the size of an asset has exponentially grown. What, exactly, N3V, have you added to the assets to cause such bloat?
shaneturner12
Tutorial Creator
It's probably image file related in order to avoid the new warning added by SP1.
Shane
Shane
Another problem seems to have reared it's ugly head...concerning the 'thumbnail' problem; it looks like sp1 has also decided to make missing .jpg files in the thumbnails container a "faulty" asset now instead of a "warning" asset. Either that, or sp1 has removed the .jpg file from the asset as I never had this many critical errors on thumbnails. 
dragonharh
Acount Deleted
I'v had only one minor error witch was nothing to fix its working great for me so I don't see what the big deal is.
Absolutely! I have found that a 'lot' of my assets which warned are now invisible because of that error. And it isn't my job to go around fixing what wasn't broke before. There are over 600 items that are now broken because of that change from Faulty to Error.
On the plus side, I have to report that the Pick List 'drop-down' is now a 'slide-in' from the left AND it scrolls properly! My very complaint has been fixed in SP1! Well done!
@Shane: I can't imagine an image size that would bloat 1.3Mb to over 12Mb, 5000x5000 or so?
Bill
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shaneturner12
Tutorial Creator
Uncompressed TGA files could explain it as I've seen ones over 20MB.
Shane
Shane
shaneturner12
Tutorial Creator
Reason probably is that Trainz cannot load compressed TGAs unless N3V have changed that.
Shane
Shane
shaneturner12
Tutorial Creator
It would explain why the .ja processing in the patching process is taking so long...
Shane
Shane
The DLC is stored in a new folder, UserData/packages and is in the same format as the hash folders, looks pretty unlocked to me. Of course until you download the new versions of the DLC which are also updated then the old versions won't work. All the Murchison assets are available in Surveyor as are S&C etc and usable after updating to the new packages, items can be opened for edit in CM.
Check the backup folders mine went up to 17GB after patching, deleted it after establishing nothing was missing.
steamboateng
New member
What is NV3 up to; meaning what is the intent of bloating files with uncompressed graphics?