Metrolink Train Crash

Hey Everyone,
Of course we all know this is very tragic. I just watched the latest reports: 25 dead (including an LAPD officer on her way home) and the engineer on the metrolink was at fault. He passed a red signal. The metrolink was supposed to wait on the siding while the frieght passed.
My thoughts and prayers to the dead and injured and their families.

Matt
 
Tragic Event

Calif. rail agency: Commuter train engineer's error caused wreck that killed 25 people Rescue personnel work at the scene of a train crash in Los Angeles, Friday, Sept. 12, 2008. A Metrolink commuter train believed to be carrying up to 350 people collided with a freight train Friday, killing four people and injuring dozens of others. (AP Photo/Hector Mata)09-13-2008 8:06 PM
By GILLIAN FLACCUS, Associated Press Writer
LOS ANGELES (Associated Press) -- A commuter train engineer who ran a stop signal was blamed Saturday for the nation's deadliest rail disaster in 15 years, a wreck that killed 25 people and left such a mass of smoldering, twisted metal that it took nearly a day to recover all the bodies.
A preliminary investigation found that "it was a Metrolink engineer that failed to stop at a red signal and that was the probable cause" of Friday's collision with a freight train in Los Angeles' San Fernando Valley, Metrolink spokeswoman Denise Tyrrell said. She said she believes the engineer, whose name was not released, is dead.
"When two trains are in the same place at the same time somebody's made a terrible mistake," said Tyrrell, who was shaking and near tears as she spoke with reporters.
Authorities later announced that the effort to recover bodies from the Metrolink train's crushed front car had ended, with the death toll at 24. It rose to 25 when USC Medical Center spokeswoman Adelaide DeLaCerda said a 50-year-old man transported to the hospital from the wreck died Saturday. She would not release his name.
"It was a very, very difficult operation," Mayor Antonio Villaraigosa said. "It was like peeling an onion to find all the victims there."
A total of 135 people were injured, with 81 transported to hospitals in serious or critical condition. There was no overall condition update available Saturday, but a telephone survey of five hospitals found nine of 34 patients still critical. Many were described as having crush injuries.
Firefighter Searcy Jackson III, a 20-year veteran and one of the first to pull bodies from the wreckage, said he had never seen such devastation. The 50-year-old said his team pulled one living passenger from the train and cut the mangled metal to remove about a half-dozen bodies.

"The metal was pushed together like an accordion," Jackson said.
Firefighters who extricated the dead from the wreck were rotated in and out of the scene to prevent emotional exhaustion, fire Capt. Armando Hogan said.
"There are some things we are trained for, there are some things I don't care what kind of training you have, you don't always prepare for," Hogan said. "This situation, particularly early on, with people inside the train, with the injuries, and with people moaning and crying and screaming, it was a traumatic experience."
The collision occurred on a horseshoe-shaped section of track in Chatsworth at the west end of the San Fernando Valley, near a 500-foot-long tunnel underneath Stoney Point Park. There is a siding at one end of the tunnel where one train can wait for another to pass, Tyrrell said.
"Even if the train is on the main track, it must go through a series of signals and each one of the signals must be obeyed," Tyrrell said. "What we believe happened, barring any new information from the NTSB, is we believe that our engineer failed to stop ... and that was the cause of the accident.
"We don't know how the error happened," she said. Tyrrell said Metrolink determined the cause by reviewing dispatch records and computers.
National Transportation Safety Board member Kitty Higgins said her agency, which is leading the probe, is waiting to complete its investigation before making any statements about the cause of the accident. It hopes to complete its final report within a year.
Higgins said rescue crews on Saturday recovered two data recorders from the Metrolink train and one data recorder and one video recorder from the freight train. The video has pictures from forward-looking cameras and the data recorders have information on speed, braking patterns and whether the horn was used.
The Metrolink train, heading from Union Station in downtown Los Angeles to Ventura County, was carrying 220 passengers, one engineer and one conductor when it collided with the Union Pacific freight, with a crew of three, about 4:30 p.m. Friday. It is common in California for freight and commuter trains to use one track.
The crash forced the Metrolink engine well back into the first passenger car, and both toppled over. Two other passenger cars remained upright.
By late Saturday morning, the Metrolink engine had been pulled out of the mangled passenger car, which was raised by a crane and surrounded by tarps. Bulldozers pulled away chunks of metal.
"It's the worst feeling in the world because you know what you're going to find," said fire Capt. Alex Arriola, who had crawled into the bottom of the smashed passenger car. "You have to put aside the fact that it's someone's husband, daughter or friend."
Police set up what they called a unification center at a local high school to try to connect worried people with information about friends or relatives who they believed were aboard the train.
Families of eight of the dead had been notified and two women who were pronounced dead at hospitals were unidentified, coroner's Assistant Chief Ed Winter said.
The only victim officially identified is Los Angeles police Officer Spree Desha, 35, of Simi Valley, who was riding the train home.
Donna Remata, 49, also was among the dead, her youngest sister, Debra Nieves, said Saturday.
Tyrrell, the Metrolink spokeswoman, said the engineer had driven the agency's trains since 1996 and worked for a subcontractor, Veolia, since 1998. She said she didn't know if the engineer ever had any previous problems operating trains or had any disciplinary issues.
Veolia issued a statement Saturday calling the collision a "tragic incident." The company said it is cooperating with NTSB's investigation.
Ray Garcia, a train conductor with Metrolink until 2006, said he knew the engineer involved in the crash for nine years and called him qualified and talented. He declined to name the engineer.
"I'm very sad that that happened," Garcia said. "It's terrible."
Garcia said he knows the stretch of track where the collision occurred and believes engineers are warned twice with yellow lights before reaching a red light at the end of a siding.
Tim Smith, state chairman of the Brotherhood of Locomotive Engineers and Trainmen, a union representing engineers and conductors, said issues that could factor into the crash investigation could be faulty signals along the track or engineer fatigue.
He said engineers in California are limited to 12 hours a day running a train, although that can be broken up over a stretch as long as 18 hours.
"Doing that for five or six days in a row, you have the cumulative fatigue factor that becomes are real bear," he said.
It was not immediately clear how many hours the train's engineer had worked.
Metrolink launched its service in Southern California in 1992. More than 45,000 commuters board Metrolink trains weekdays in Los Angeles, Ventura, Orange, Riverside and San Bernardino counties.
Until Friday, Metrolink's worst disaster was on Jan. 26, 2005, in suburban Glendale, where a man parked a gasoline-soaked SUV on railroad tracks. A Metrolink train struck the SUV and derailed, striking another Metrolink train traveling the other way, killing 11 people and injuring about 180 others. Juan Alvarez was convicted this year of murder for causing the crash.
Friday's train crash was the deadliest since Sept. 22, 1993, when the Sunset Limited, an Amtrak train, plunged off a trestle into a bayou near Mobile, Ala., moments after the trestle was damaged by a towboat; 47 people were killed.
___
Associated Press writers Thomas Watkins, Raquel Maria Dillon, Greg Risling, Denise Petski, Josh Dickey, James Beltran, John Rogers and Michael R. Blood contributed to this report.

Copyright 2008 The Associated Press. All rights reserved. This material may not be published, broadcast, rewritten or redistributed. Disclaimer: the news stories on Cox.net are the work of leading news organizations whose services are purchased to populate Cox.net with news as a service to our customers. Views and opinions presented in the news are not necessarily the views of Cox Communications.
 
Oh wow...
I just realized that the lead unit on the UP freight is one of the two UP ACes that captkilljoy skinned. That's kind of creepy, in a way.
 
Metrolink is already blaming the engineer, but there were some reports coming from the NTSB that he may not have been totally to blame. It's not been verified yet, but one early report has suggested that there was a malfunction with the switches, possibly causing the light to go red at the wrong time. Problem is they've not exactly confirmed or denied that yet.
 
ya they said the engineer was txting and bypassed the red light unnoticingly. and that the u.p. engine was going full speed predicted thats why the engine wa scrsudhed so far back, compared to metro going only 40 mph
 
WOW seriously dude! He can't hear you because he is DEAD! So are 22 other people! Before you decide to say something, THINK first! Not only was that comment rude and inconsiderate, it was just downright stupid! Sorry if I am a little ticked, but the insensitivity of this comment is just unbearable.

If the mods want me to remove this comment, just PM me and I will.
 
oops

WOW seriously dude! He can't hear you because he is DEAD! So are 22 other people! Before you decide to say something, THINK first! Not only was that comment rude and inconsiderate, it was just downright stupid! Sorry if I am a little ticked, but the insensitivity of this comment is just unbearable.

If the mods want me to remove this comment, just PM me and I will.

I'm very sorry but I get a little sensitive when the person driving a commuter train full of people is texting on a cellphone and not paying attention to the lights or controls.

Can you understand the logic in that? It ticks me off, man.

Really basic rule: Cellphones and Train Driving don't mix.
 
Actually my brother in law is an engineer and I have to say that cellphones are a big part of train running. They can be used as a communication device if you are running an engine that doesn't have a radio. This is also still speculation about the texting. It's not something that you can prove easily. There are also some reports that there might have been a signal timing error.
 
Cell Phones

Some RR's do use cell phones to communicate with crews, as a company policy. When I worked for the RR there was no reading the newspaper, book etc...only the RR safety publications. No radios, music, nor cards. Anything that would take your mind off of what is happening, or distract your attention, was prohibited.
 
Ugly Story Behind the Resignation of Metrolink’s Front Person

NOTE: Please DO NOT speculate, as it could impede the investigation.

To Applgathc, you can't say that a member of the crew WAS texting, it is only alleged that he/she maybe. Please wait until the investigation is over.

< SNIP >Can you understand the logic in that? It ticks me off, man.
And it "ticks" me off, when people assume something, or read "may have" for "was/ is", that may not be the correct facts.

Back to todays post.
Ugly Story Behind the Resignation of Metrolink’s Front Person
By Ari L. Noonan @ 3:00 PM September 15, 2008 (local time)

When a national agency was upstaged over the weekend in the crucial area of media credit that drives many employees of government, was a board member being merely petulant when she staged a public tantrum?

Or was there a more prosaic explanation behind the page one foot-stomping at the Chatsworth train crash, as reported this morning by the Los Angeles Times? . . .

. . .Sometimes with a flourish, NTSB, a fairly familiar acronym to newspaper readers, conducts investigations of major commuter tragedies, and then dashes to the nearest mic and camera to interpret and take a bow.

Not this time, however. . .


Full Story, Click on Front Page Online
 
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I wanted to echo what's been said about railroads and cellphones (not the bad posts, no offense intended). More times than not, I've seen the train crews use cell phones to contact the dispatcher to obtain track warrants between here and St. Louis. Back when Brighton Park was still a manned interlocking, the operator apparantly fell asleep (which is an interesting anecdote in itself), and the engineer, conductor, and dispatcher were all trying to call him on the phone to find out what's going on.

While I don't think texting is the greatest idea when you see an approach signal, I do think that banning phones for the train crews is going to cause more trouble than it's worth. Those phones are a big part of keeping those trains operating (I can only speak in good conscience for the Jefferson City Sub, and the route of AMTK 303 on this one).
 
Engineeers on the UP?

The media has focused almost exclusively on the victims on the Metrolink train, but I was wondering what happened to the UP engineer(s) in the crash. I can find absolutely no mention of this anywhere. How many engineers did the UP have? Did anyone survive? If they did, they would have something to tell.
 
Immediate Answer

In todays world of high tech gadgets, we have become so spoiled, and think Immediate answers are your God given right. You will not get Immediate answers untill the NTSB investigation is complete. Be prepared for flaws, rumors, and coverups, as the deceased engineer is the easy one to blame. And RR's are quick to lie and cover their tracks wth blame on the deceased operator. It has always been this practice of RR's.
 
immediate answers

It's so funny that someone using an online internet forum would complain that we expect immediate answers - almost immediately after the issue was posted.

But seriously folks, does anyone know what happened to the UP engineer(s)?
 
In todays world of high tech gadgets, we have become so spoiled, and think Immediate answers are your God given right. You will not get Immediate answers untill the NTSB investigation is complete. Be prepared for flaws, rumors, and coverups, as the deceased engineer is the easy one to blame. And RR's are quick to lie and cover their tracks wth blame on the deceased operator. It has always been this practice of RR's.


Yes, I completely agree. We will know what happened when the NTSB finishes their investigation. No sooner, no later

And for the love of god, DO NOT trust the media, the always blow everything out of proportion, and jump and any chance to get the word out first, even if it is wrong, they want to say if first, with little thought of if this is the correct answer or not
 
KK

Actually my brother in law is an engineer and I have to say that cellphones are a big part of train running. They can be used as a communication device if you are running an engine that doesn't have a radio. This is also still speculation about the texting. It's not something that you can prove easily. There are also some reports that there might have been a signal timing error.

KK sorry bud. It's just...it gets me all sensitive.:)

Are you serious? You can use cell phones? Do you get the dispatchers cell number or something?:p I'm joking but how does it work?
 
kk

NOTE: Please DO NOT speculate, as it could impede the investigation.

To Applgathc, you can't say that a member of the crew WAS texting, it is only alleged that he/she maybe. Please wait until the investigation is over.

And it "ticks" me off, when people assume something, or read "may have" for "was/ is", that may not be the correct facts.

Back to todays post.

Sorry I wasn't thinking and I jumped to a conclusion.:wave:
 
To admins/mods

EBoy87, I'm not refering to devices that are their as part of the rail company, to obtain track warrants and similar, but about the possibility (take note of wording) of devices not meant to be used by public transport workers.

To admins/mods, I think it better if you put a note, and only aks users to post known information.
 
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