4,568 miles in lengths and 220,000,000lbs sounds a little farfetched for 682 ore cars
Longest Train Ever Probably Was In America and Not Australia????????????!!!!!!!!!!!!!
- Thread starter kmothersil
- Start date
4,568 miles in lengths and 220,000,000lbs sounds a little farfetched for 682 ore cars
There's another discussion on it here
http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?10,1295759
Dave
http://www.trainorders.com/discussion/read.php?10,1295759
Dave
Donaldgatlin
New member
4,568 miles? dont u think u r stretching that a lil bit! maybe 4,568 feet or meters? sound more reasonable?
Try 4.568 miles, he only made a typo for crying out loud.
OK, no rumors only fact.
" In 2001, BHP Billiton operated the world’s longest and heaviest train
comprising 10 locomotives and 336 ore cars, which was 7.2 kilometres long."
A quote from this OFFICIAL report
http://www.bhpbilliton.com/bbContentRepository/News/RelatedContent/wheelarrajv.pdf
Note the site
nameOh yeah, if you belive that 2 bigboys could pull a 7mile train (even empty) I know of a nice big bridge in Sydney Australia that is for sale :hehe:
Cheers David
I have just had a look at the pic in question, what a laugh, you can see the end of the train O_O
The signals, poles and line are all visible at the horizon, which means the track is straight, but the train stops before the horizon, it can't be round the bend cos there is no bend.
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Its not true. Anyone with the least bit of an education is physics would realized that there would be so many forces ripping this train in different directions it wouldn't have made it halfway out of the yard without replacing drawbars or couplers or even cleaning up a stringline derailment... Just not possible...
My 3 cents...
Steve
My 3 cents...
Steve
kmothersil
New member
Well all I got to say is we probably may never know if this is not a 7 mile long train or it is cause this was taken back when most of us weren't around, but it does give you dreams and wonders of the days when the big boys ruled the rails for 20 years.
jadebullet
might be back?
OH HEY! finally my useless information comes into play. Yes 2 bigboys could theoretically pull 10 miles of cars. And yes BHP (i think thats the name i dont know alot of Aussie stuff) has the record for the longest RECORDED train. I say recorded because they made a big deal out of it. Back in the late fourties there was a double headed Bigboy train that was around 7 miles, all empty cars. Back then though noone really thought to make a big deal and that it was some record breaking thing. It was just a long train that was serving a purpose. Also it was on a down grade which helped considerably in releaving the stress on the drawbars. And also you cant see the end of the train in that picture. Ill give you two reasons. Reason 1. The track curves. I zoomed in to where you said that you could stills see the telegraph poles. I didnt see anything but a few maybe telephone poles that werent in a line at all. more like haphazardly placed. Reason 2. I highly doubt that UP would waste 2 of its 25 Bigboys to pull such a short train. They pulled more of the longer trains. Also the fact that they are using 2 tells you something. That train is either very long, very heavy or they put 2 engines on for no reason(highly unlikly seeing how rare bigboys actually were. there were only 25 made.)
Edit: Also if i remember correctly there were 2 or three helper engines in the train for the purpose of mantaining air pressure.
All of this information i got in a book about Bigboys. If i find it in my attic ill give you the title.
Edit: Also if i remember correctly there were 2 or three helper engines in the train for the purpose of mantaining air pressure.
All of this information i got in a book about Bigboys. If i find it in my attic ill give you the title.
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Red_Rattler
Since 09 May 2003
NOTE ABOUT PERSON'S SIGNATURE BEFORE I CAN CONTINUE.
I'm not an mod/admin, but before I can continue, can Iced8383 reduce his signature height to within the board limits, as it is around twice the height allowed & almost 70Kb, more than the twice allowed, and is slowing the page down. He should know the limit by now. I can only post without the tags at the moment.
I'm not an mod/admin, but before I can continue, can Iced8383 reduce his signature height to within the board limits, as it is around twice the height allowed & almost 70Kb, more than the twice allowed, and is slowing the page down. He should know the limit by now. I can only post without the tags at the moment.
kmothersil
New member
Well if this is the longest train then looks like record book will have to be changed. I don't know if those cars were empties and I doubt it too they were probably loaded. Guys we may see trains around in the upcoming years that could be longer than 2 miles thanks the ECP airbrakes being tested. So far on BNSF and Norfolk Southern. Plus it's also un likely that the Big Boys will be restored all though I could be wrong and I too would like to see this giant running again.
Donaldgatlin
New member
my bad
sorry! did'nt mean to be rude.
sorry! did'nt mean to be rude.
err no, the brakes are controlled by the front loco only, no matter how many loco's there are, (todays radio controlled loco's are different)
Helper loco's are there to HELP, hence the name, so if there were helper loco's in the middle or on the end, then it was not just 2 bigboys it was 2 bigboys plus 2 or 3 other loco's, when I went to school that would be 4 or 5 loco's.
C'mon face it, it's one time the Aussie's have done something bigger and better than the Americans, so some dream up a bigger train using an old photo that only shows a short train as proof (even if it is on a bend it is not showing a long train)
You can rest assured that the person who took that photo would of got himself to a different position to get a photo of a 7 mile train or phoned some friends ahead of the train so they could get photo's, so dig up a photo that shows 2 bigboys on the front of a train taken from a hight (from a hill) that trails to the horizon and I just might think it MAY of happened.
Cheers David
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well it all depends on what you call a locomotive. diesel units, at least in the north western hemisphere, can be multipled togather to give any size/power of locomotion reguired. the real limit of course is drawbar failure from putting to much power on one part of too long a train, up and down grades and starting it and so on.
this is the reason for midtrain helpers on grades. when i was growing up on 'the hill' as we called donner summit, ruling grade 2.2%, which may not sound like much in narrow guage or trolly terms, but we're talking about typically 120 to 200 car freight trains, mixed freight, tens of them, often more then 50, sometimes close to a hundred, EVERY DAY, 24-7-365, over donner pass, elevation 7010 feet, from 130 some odd feet elevation approximately in roseville, IN LESS THEN A HUNDRED MILES, then dropping 'down' to 6800 or so elevation in truckee, and then i think somewhere arround 5 or 6 thousand something in reno/sparks.
in steam days it took three big mallet consolodations, 4-8-8-2 cab forwards, one on the point, one 40 cars back from the head end, and a third one 20 cars ahead of the caboose. the helpers were then cut off at norden, within a couple of miles of the actual summit, and sent back down the hill to roseville where all eastbound freight departed out of.
when the went to diesel, four f-units, when they were new, were used to replace each mallet (they weren't componds, the were simple, but they kept calling them mallets because that's what everyone was used to and a simple name to remember to call them). it wasn't long though befor the hill started wearing them down and each 'engine' consisted of five or more f-units, with early gp's and sd's interspersed. over time the f-units got replaced of course with more powerful gp's and sd's and their alco equivelants, and any number of other experiments, ALL MU'd togather.
sp chainged the pinouts of the alco and any other mu connectors to match those of emd and made whatever other electrical chainges was neccessarry, to multiple all of them togather in any all combination, which they did in fact run.
for a while the sd45 was the standard, with three or four of them to an engine, then they, in cooperation with emd developed the t-2's, which stood for tunnel unit, dash two series. which like the steam mallets with their cab in front, were specific adoptations to 80 miles of a mix of snow sheds and tunnels, streatching most of the way from blue canion, over the summit, to almost into truckee.
so while i don't think we can boast of neccessarily the longest or heaviest SINGLE TRAIN, typically massive tonnage was moved, ON A ROUTINE BASIS over a gradient signifigantly steep for a class one line, using lots and lots of power, in often odd and interesting combinations.
(i might add, that while ownership of the line has chainged hands, and individual diesel units have gotten massively even more powerful, this, other then the cutting off of hepers at norden, continues to this day. the helpers now, instead of cutting off, just run on through to the old devision point at sparks, that or they run slightly shorter trains without them. but i see them heading out up the hill everyday just a few blocks from my house where i live in roseville now.)
=^^=
.../\...
this is the reason for midtrain helpers on grades. when i was growing up on 'the hill' as we called donner summit, ruling grade 2.2%, which may not sound like much in narrow guage or trolly terms, but we're talking about typically 120 to 200 car freight trains, mixed freight, tens of them, often more then 50, sometimes close to a hundred, EVERY DAY, 24-7-365, over donner pass, elevation 7010 feet, from 130 some odd feet elevation approximately in roseville, IN LESS THEN A HUNDRED MILES, then dropping 'down' to 6800 or so elevation in truckee, and then i think somewhere arround 5 or 6 thousand something in reno/sparks.
in steam days it took three big mallet consolodations, 4-8-8-2 cab forwards, one on the point, one 40 cars back from the head end, and a third one 20 cars ahead of the caboose. the helpers were then cut off at norden, within a couple of miles of the actual summit, and sent back down the hill to roseville where all eastbound freight departed out of.
when the went to diesel, four f-units, when they were new, were used to replace each mallet (they weren't componds, the were simple, but they kept calling them mallets because that's what everyone was used to and a simple name to remember to call them). it wasn't long though befor the hill started wearing them down and each 'engine' consisted of five or more f-units, with early gp's and sd's interspersed. over time the f-units got replaced of course with more powerful gp's and sd's and their alco equivelants, and any number of other experiments, ALL MU'd togather.
sp chainged the pinouts of the alco and any other mu connectors to match those of emd and made whatever other electrical chainges was neccessarry, to multiple all of them togather in any all combination, which they did in fact run.
for a while the sd45 was the standard, with three or four of them to an engine, then they, in cooperation with emd developed the t-2's, which stood for tunnel unit, dash two series. which like the steam mallets with their cab in front, were specific adoptations to 80 miles of a mix of snow sheds and tunnels, streatching most of the way from blue canion, over the summit, to almost into truckee.
so while i don't think we can boast of neccessarily the longest or heaviest SINGLE TRAIN, typically massive tonnage was moved, ON A ROUTINE BASIS over a gradient signifigantly steep for a class one line, using lots and lots of power, in often odd and interesting combinations.
(i might add, that while ownership of the line has chainged hands, and individual diesel units have gotten massively even more powerful, this, other then the cutting off of hepers at norden, continues to this day. the helpers now, instead of cutting off, just run on through to the old devision point at sparks, that or they run slightly shorter trains without them. but i see them heading out up the hill everyday just a few blocks from my house where i live in roseville now.)
=^^=
.../\...
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kmothersil
New member
Already know that, but we have more tracks to cover from USA,Canada,Alaska,and Mexico and your right about Australia, but here's one thing no one here can't deny no one here knows if this is a 7 mile long train so it will probably remain unknown and I can tell that outta of everyone on this website I think no one here on the forum was around when Big Boys dominated the Union Pacific for nearly 20 years.
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Gandalf0444
FVRR member
This could have happened,this might not have happened. We don't know from that single picture.But some people here don't have to fight tooth and nail against the possibility of this occurring either But as for now we will let Australia hold the title until proven otherwise.
But as for those helper locos that may/may not have been in the consist. IF they were in the consist they would be put through out as said some in the middle and some towards the end of the train. Each steam locomotive runs under its own power,with a full crew to tend to the controls,fire etc.
Each locomotive would be coupled into the train just like any other car/locomotive. Just that the helpers were usually surrounded by cars,cars in front and back. The locomotives have the ability to apply there own brakes. As well as keep the brake pipe PSI up. They would simply keep it up much like the lead locomotive would do. Dylan has more info and this and next time he is on I will send him over here.
But as for now we will let Australia hold the title until proven otherwise.But as for those helper locos that may/may not have been in the consist. IF they were in the consist they would be put through out as said some in the middle and some towards the end of the train. Each steam locomotive runs under its own power,with a full crew to tend to the controls,fire etc.
Each locomotive would be coupled into the train just like any other car/locomotive. Just that the helpers were usually surrounded by cars,cars in front and back. The locomotives have the ability to apply there own brakes. As well as keep the brake pipe PSI up. They would simply keep it up much like the lead locomotive would do. Dylan has more info and this and next time he is on I will send him over here.
Again NO, the lead locomotive applies the brakes by reducing the brake pipe pressure, how could he do this if the loco's in the middle are pumping air into the pipe.
The only reason it happens now is radio control, the lead loco controls the other loco's brakes by remote control, so when the driver applies the brakes they are applied by each consist at the same time and by the same amount.
Going back to the Aussie train, that train broke 2 HEAVY DUTY couplers during that run, and that was with three sets of loco's, all radio controlled from the lead loco so that uneven application of power was minimized, even now a train that long is impossible to move with the power all at the front.
Cheers David
hi,
if you got about 8 minutes to spare this might clear up things.
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=9LsuNWjRaAo
cheers,
patchy
if you got about 8 minutes to spare this might clear up things.
http://au.youtube.com/watch?v=9LsuNWjRaAo
cheers,
patchy