Layers confusion in TS2010

Approach_Medium

Trainz Addict
Hello;

I don't know how many of you have played around with layers, but I have found some important facts concerning routes, sessions, and layers.

If you are using certain objects (assets) which contain rules or other variables which you must enter manually, it will be necessary to have a route AND a session open in Surveyor while setting up these assets.
You must then save both route and session with any changes.
Next time you open the route in Surveyor, you must also open the session where you set the rules. If you open only the route, the rules and setup data will be lost.

This is completely independent of what layer you place these assets on.
Even if you place them on the Route layer, the rules they use will not be saved to the route layer, but to the session layer.

A couple of examples:

Junction Controller V2 by mizi.

You set the rules to switch multiple junctions together, such as with crossovers.
Normally, I would put this object on the route layer.
When you save the route and session from Surveyor, all of the rules get saved to the SESSION, not the Route.
This, as I said is completely independent of layers you use in Surveyor.

Another example:
JK Junctions by Andi06.

You place all of the junction components (including the invisible track) on the Route layer.
Set the rail and sleeper/ballast textures you want.
Save the Route and Session from Surveyor.

Now, if you open only the route, without opening the session, the textures of the JK junctions have reverted to the default.
If you open the session in Surveyor, your saved textures are all there.

These two examples might not be representative of other assets used in TS2010. I guess it depends on which database the asset's creator has used to store the object's variable data.

I am experimenting with the ATLS system to find out how these work with respect to routes and sessions.

What all of this says, is that when you are using such objects as I have described, you must be sure to always to have a "master" session that will always be saved with the route in Surveyor.
That way, you never lose any of the object data.

If you were to load the route only, then merrily work for a day on creating a new session, you might be disappointed, and frustrated to find that a lot of your work from the previous session didn't get carried over with the route.

I realized back in TS2006 that I always needed to open the last session in Surveyor while working with objects like the Junction Controller. I recall several times having to re-enter all of the rules for each controller because I had failed to carry the session through my route changes.

I thought that with TS2010 having layers, I might be able to simply place these objects on the Route layer, and not have to work with the sessions unless I wanted to change trains and the like. But that is not the case as I have described here.

This might help to explain to anyone why he or she has lost some of the route's functionality when opening a different session.

FW
 
Well, you are not "discovering" anything new. I have had this problem since 04, and I have asked for a way to "save" these commands so that we can make a new session and "transport" the commands to it.. But so far, Auran has deaf ears and nobody has been able to find a solution. This has cost me weeks of doubling work to set hundreds of junctions with the V2 controllers and all that. Compound the problem: you "transport" a route to another computer and it shows in surveyor. You transport a session with all the settings and it does crash when you want to open it! This forces you to make a new session of the tranported route and start all over again! Somebody must have an answer to all this, yes? Anyhow, I am glad somebody is "touching' this theme and making some noise about it.. :'(
 
Hi Fwassner,

I haven’t looked at Layers yet, but what you are saying doesn’t seem that unreasonable. From TRS 2004 on, when ‘Sessions’ started, the data from in-game objects (like ATLS) has always been saved to a Session, not a Route (or Map). The concept of building your Route, setting up its Assets to your preferences and then saving a ‘Master’ Session to work from is the best way I would think. Layers presumably add more flexibility, (and thus confusion) but saving a Master Session should still work OK surely?????

You should find that my ATLS will also need to be saved to a Master Session to retain the settings, though in ATLS case, I have added a provision to be able to Save to a Map, (or Route). This can be done by saving the name of the asset according to the instructions. It’s a bit long winded and I really only included it for Scenario writers as Scenarios don’t save Soups. Try it out on Layers. I’d be interested to see what happens!

Boat
 
My method is to always do any editing by loading the session.

Then when finished do the merge option in the layer window.

Save both route and session.

Only thing I get wrong is after this I have to exit the game and reload the session to run it.

If I try to run from surveyor after doing the above it loses all my drivers.

If I do not use the merge in layers I lose most of my track.

The edit, merge, save method makes it similar to before layers were introduced.

Dennis
 
Back
Top