I'm not even a Beta-Tester. But, seeing as how N3V screwed up SP1, i'm a bit worried about the performance of TANE.
This Needs to Stop
- Thread starter chris2001trainz2010
- Start date
Screwed up in the sense that it doesn't like you shooting it in the head when you get impatient?
Paul
Then you need to look at what changed about the beginning of August. Did you instal some new software? Was there an update to the OS? Did you change the configuration of your anti-virus or was there an update? Is something now running in the background that wasn't running before? Have user or folder permissions changed? Has your internet connection changed - more brief dropouts, for instance?
When you find what changed you will know what to change back in order to restore things to what they were.
No dice, I didn't change anything.
shaneturner12
Tutorial Creator
The only change I'm aware that you've made is installing DLC content. This quite often contains quite a few assets that have to be validated.
Shane
Shane
Oh, yeah, the Nickel Plate DLC. Wouldn't it be done validating it by now?
Does this help ?
[h=1]TADDaemon[/h]
[h=2]General[/h]TADDaemon.exe is found in the "bin" folder and comes from Trainz Asset Database Daemon. TADDaemon manages the database of all Trainz assets known to the installation. Trainz, Content Manager and other Trainz programs depend on it.
In addition to it's main task (maintaining the local database of Trainz assets), it is also responsible for asset validation, most internet communication, and other background tasks.
[h=2]Technical Details[/h]TADDaemon must be allowed through firewall because it has to connect to the internet and to communicate with other Trainz Components.
TADDaemon will shut down when Trainz is not running. If Windows prompts to 'Wait' or 'End Task' while shutting down, choose to wait for TADDaemon to finish. Avoid using 'End Task' on TADDaemon, or it will likely need a database repair on the next start. Also avoid hard powering off the machine while TADDaemon is running, for the same reasons.
I'm no expert but it seems when one or two users are having trouble and the vast majority are satisfied with performance etc. how can it be the software at fault ?
Ron
[h=1]TADDaemon[/h]
[h=2]General[/h]TADDaemon.exe is found in the "bin" folder and comes from Trainz Asset Database Daemon. TADDaemon manages the database of all Trainz assets known to the installation. Trainz, Content Manager and other Trainz programs depend on it.
In addition to it's main task (maintaining the local database of Trainz assets), it is also responsible for asset validation, most internet communication, and other background tasks.
[h=2]Technical Details[/h]TADDaemon must be allowed through firewall because it has to connect to the internet and to communicate with other Trainz Components.
TADDaemon will shut down when Trainz is not running. If Windows prompts to 'Wait' or 'End Task' while shutting down, choose to wait for TADDaemon to finish. Avoid using 'End Task' on TADDaemon, or it will likely need a database repair on the next start. Also avoid hard powering off the machine while TADDaemon is running, for the same reasons.
I'm no expert but it seems when one or two users are having trouble and the vast majority are satisfied with performance etc. how can it be the software at fault ?
Ron
Given this issue has been discussed several times I think it's more than one or two users. The software is at fault because prior to SP1 CMP in 49922 ran impeccably. For people experiencing the fault in 61388 on exactly the same hardware that means *something* changed when N3V updated CMP and it no longer works reliably. Even if, as the N3V fanboys suggest, we are being terminally impatient and should wait for the white mist to dissipate and CMP to magically start working again, that's not how it was in 49922 or indeed with TS2009/TS2010 before.
We can debate this round in circles all day of course but I'd be quite interested in an official response from N3V with their view on the issue and whether it has been logged at Helpdesk. If not, then suggest all of us encountering the problem start sending in a report each and every time it happens in an effort to get them to take notice.
norfolksouthern37
what's a normal map?
Given this issue has been discussed several times I think it's more than one or two users. The users are at fault because prior to SP1 CMP in 49922 ran exactly the same. For people not experiencing the fault in 61388 on exactly the same hardware that means *something* changed when N3V updated CMP or it wouldn't be an update. Even if, as the N3V naysayers suggest, we are lying vehemently and something was purposely changed in CMP to magically stop working for only a few people, that's exactly how it was in 49922 or indeed with TS2009/TS2010 before.
Do I really think that? No, not 100%. Do you sound that ridiculous? Very much so.
Quite possibly I would be violating some NDA, but if it satisfies you people it is worth it. TANE CM has a nice large 'load circle' that spins around letting you know when it is busy working.
Note: Please keep in mind I am not advocating that there are no problems and everything works perfectly and all rainbows and unicorns, but I find continual 'conspiracy with malicious intent' posts to be annoying at best.
Do I really think that? No, not 100%. Do you sound that ridiculous? Very much so.
Quite possibly I would be violating some NDA, but if it satisfies you people it is worth it. TANE CM has a nice large 'load circle' that spins around letting you know when it is busy working.
Note: Please keep in mind I am not advocating that there are no problems and everything works perfectly and all rainbows and unicorns, but I find continual 'conspiracy with malicious intent' posts to be annoying at best.
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I'd like to say something regarding this mess, again.
I am one of those victims of validations and have been for some time. I have, however, discovered that there are numerous causes to this and in part this I my own doings, hardware related and version related.
1) TS12 SP1 HF4, aka 61388....
There definitely has been a change somehow in the database management. I feel that this logic is more sensitive to updates and content handling, and triggers a validation sequence whenever something is done with content.
I have seen this when opening and closing content for edit, installing new content via CDPs, adding in the old JA files from TRS2010 and TRS2009, and removing obsolete items.
2) A failing hard disk or other computer component which causes the system to burp.
Recently, I've had a to replace a hard drive. The drive wouldn't start one day, and prior to that there were bouts of just slow performance. No diagnostics on the drive showed errors, and even SMART reported everything was fine, however, a start the next day was nothing more than clicking and buzzing! This drive happened to be the one where I had my active Trainz install running! I was able to restore, however, I had some corruption without knowing it that didn't show up until I was copying the data back from the backup device to my internal hard drive.
I also had an odd situation with a BIOS issue and large hard drives that would remove a hard drive from active status when the drive is under load. This happened to have been a drive that I had Trainz installed on. This also caused lots of corrupted assets.
3) Installing CDPs...
Whenever installing CDPs, such as content from Jointed Rail, a very lengthy period of validations occur. I've seen upwards of 48,000 items at a time being revalidated and this process takes about 4-5 hours at 0.75 seconds per validation, and doesn't include the added "write to database".
4) Opening assets for edit...
Related to some data corruption, I have a route that crashes and in the process of checking assets, I opened some for edit. There were some that couldn't be read, which I suspected and the very process of opening these up and then committing triggered the validation, and a big one too. I replaced about 20 corrupted items, which I think go back to the bad hard drive still, and ended up deleting and redownloading or installing them from backups. Opening the corrupted data, by the way, caused CM to lockup completely, white screen ghosting, however TADD was doing its thing in the background. At one point I ended up killing CM, but not TADD and restarted CM again without problems. After the restart, I shut it down normally and let TADD close when it was done validating and received the queue request to shutdown. After that I started CM again, and the validation process proceeded where it left off and CM was laggy as expected.
5) Old version JA files...
Due to some old routes I wanted to work on, some of which date back to my earlier forays of route building, I needed to install my built-in content files from TRS2009 and TRS2010.
This install, plus the ensuing EDR, caused a major revalidation which took upwards of 12 hours. The numbers were in the 100,000 range.
I would like to add that when this kicks in, nothing is usable. The menus in Trainz TS12 its self are slow to react as CM/TADD/TrainzUtil are eating up the resources. This explains the very bad performance and the lock ups in game. The CPU and disk system is busy with the validating and will eventually release some resources to other tasks, however, it's main focus is the validation process.
What can we do?
View the database processes. Set this up in the options off of the launcher as this gives you the opportunity to see what is going on, and why the performance is horrible. If a validation process kicks in, let it finish. Find something else to do otherwise the program performance is zilch.
Thoughts and conclusion
I agree that something has changed with the logic, as I mentioned above when the service pack is in place. Hopefully the developers will look at this during T: ANE development and we'll see a more efficient data handling component in the program.
John
I am one of those victims of validations and have been for some time. I have, however, discovered that there are numerous causes to this and in part this I my own doings, hardware related and version related.
1) TS12 SP1 HF4, aka 61388....
There definitely has been a change somehow in the database management. I feel that this logic is more sensitive to updates and content handling, and triggers a validation sequence whenever something is done with content.
I have seen this when opening and closing content for edit, installing new content via CDPs, adding in the old JA files from TRS2010 and TRS2009, and removing obsolete items.
2) A failing hard disk or other computer component which causes the system to burp.
Recently, I've had a to replace a hard drive. The drive wouldn't start one day, and prior to that there were bouts of just slow performance. No diagnostics on the drive showed errors, and even SMART reported everything was fine, however, a start the next day was nothing more than clicking and buzzing! This drive happened to be the one where I had my active Trainz install running! I was able to restore, however, I had some corruption without knowing it that didn't show up until I was copying the data back from the backup device to my internal hard drive.
I also had an odd situation with a BIOS issue and large hard drives that would remove a hard drive from active status when the drive is under load. This happened to have been a drive that I had Trainz installed on. This also caused lots of corrupted assets.
3) Installing CDPs...
Whenever installing CDPs, such as content from Jointed Rail, a very lengthy period of validations occur. I've seen upwards of 48,000 items at a time being revalidated and this process takes about 4-5 hours at 0.75 seconds per validation, and doesn't include the added "write to database".
4) Opening assets for edit...
Related to some data corruption, I have a route that crashes and in the process of checking assets, I opened some for edit. There were some that couldn't be read, which I suspected and the very process of opening these up and then committing triggered the validation, and a big one too. I replaced about 20 corrupted items, which I think go back to the bad hard drive still, and ended up deleting and redownloading or installing them from backups. Opening the corrupted data, by the way, caused CM to lockup completely, white screen ghosting, however TADD was doing its thing in the background. At one point I ended up killing CM, but not TADD and restarted CM again without problems. After the restart, I shut it down normally and let TADD close when it was done validating and received the queue request to shutdown. After that I started CM again, and the validation process proceeded where it left off and CM was laggy as expected.
5) Old version JA files...
Due to some old routes I wanted to work on, some of which date back to my earlier forays of route building, I needed to install my built-in content files from TRS2009 and TRS2010.
This install, plus the ensuing EDR, caused a major revalidation which took upwards of 12 hours. The numbers were in the 100,000 range.
I would like to add that when this kicks in, nothing is usable. The menus in Trainz TS12 its self are slow to react as CM/TADD/TrainzUtil are eating up the resources. This explains the very bad performance and the lock ups in game. The CPU and disk system is busy with the validating and will eventually release some resources to other tasks, however, it's main focus is the validation process.
What can we do?
View the database processes. Set this up in the options off of the launcher as this gives you the opportunity to see what is going on, and why the performance is horrible. If a validation process kicks in, let it finish. Find something else to do otherwise the program performance is zilch.
Thoughts and conclusion
I agree that something has changed with the logic, as I mentioned above when the service pack is in place. Hopefully the developers will look at this during T: ANE development and we'll see a more efficient data handling component in the program.
John
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I have alleviated this by making sure that exception for the folder I installed on is defined in antivirus, software protection, etc. Also, installation in a root folder, not the default, seems to help things. I actually went one step further, separate partition on SSD. In the last 6 months, one time it had to do database audit, QDR, with no impact on anything.
Paul
Paul
gearhead2578
New member
Couldn't help adding my $0.02 here. Most of you guys that posted here have been around Trainz as long or longer than me, I see John, Justin, Ron, Shane...the usual suspects (I waited a year to come back to forums after the big crash of '06). Remember CMP? what was the Plus? Plus headaches? Plus a big hammer for smashing the keyboard out of frustration? We've come a long way since then. Content Mangler is like an old man, it doesn't move very fast - and when it does move, you have to have patience. Either way, it's better than it used to be and 99% of the time runs great if you leave it alone and let it do its thing. Go get a cup of coffee, see what the family looks like today, whatever - just have patience. Maybe it's easier said than done for some of the younger folks, seems like today the world is tailored to their instant gratification lifestyle. But then again, my phone still plugs in the wall....
Mike
Mike
shaneturner12
Tutorial Creator
Yep - I definitely remember CMP. To be honest, at least in TRS2006 pre-SP1, that was a lot worse than what TS12's Content Manager is like now. Sure TS12's one likes to freeze at annoying times, but it's better than it being unstable and crashing (kind of like what TRS2006 did to me quite often in the form of Fatal Errors).
Shane
Shane
THAT IS NEVER a good idea, but a measure of LAST RESORT--especially with Data base software. //F
If you think you have problems with it, See the We've Been Had thread--and all that trouble was happening to a career IT professional and others-- One thing that came out of that is Compatibility settings matter. Sounds unlikely that you are, but if you are running Windows 8, goto all the Trainz .EXE files and hit [ALT]-[ENTER] and set them to run in Windows 7 compatibility mode. If Vista, Try XP-SP3. Regardless, any Windows OS after XP, click on the exe's and shortcuts you use and set them to run as administrator. // F
It sometimes does Paul. Get in the habit of using [CTRL]-[SHFT]-[ESC] (Opens Task Manager) Set it so it stays open when minimized (ALT+O = Options toggle). LMB on your CM, then RMBh > Goto Process (bottom in Win 7). Watch the CPU column for a while, both TADdaemon and CM or Surveyor. If TrainzUtil is showing activity, and TADdaemon is showing activity, things are alive, but you are likely in a validation situation.
It is quite possible Trainz is detecting a corrupted asset, and trying to resolve the matter. If this is happening on the same route, or a route is shutting down (crashing) try these steps:
- IN each of the dependencies steps, you may (Will likely) get a message: Are you sure you want to calculate the dependencies for XXXX assets? Say Yes, and wait it out. CM will be busy (Ask the task manager CPU column! Sort on it.) Title bar will say "CM 3.7 is not Responding", or the like.
- View the route+session's dependencies in Main View.
- Click inside the Kuid window (normally looks blank, but there's a list in there), [CTRL]-[A], [CTRL]-[C].
- Open an scratch file in your favorite text editor, paste that CSL to safeguard it.
- Click on an asset in CM Main View, [CTRL]-[A], RMBh > View dependencies...
- repeat 1-2, add a comma to the end of the safed list, paste in the dependencies.
- repeat 4 and 5, and (1-2) until you run out of new dependencies.
- Your list in the editor now should hold all the assets and dependencies that may have a problem.
- A screenful at a time work your way down or up and systematically tell CM to validate (View errors and warnings).
- If nothing shows up, do that again, but open for edit a screeful at time, using a drag and drop to the PEVtool images2tga. When they're opened, you're likely to see errors, esp. in built-ins, hence you can first exclude those by adding that filter with the kuid list (implicit AND) and toggling the right pane to FALSE.
- If cleaning up the non-BI's, you'll be able to treat the other state by setting that to TRUE.
Agree that patience and good judgement is needed. Microsoft's resource center has a freeware utility Procexp (Process Explorer) which is far more useful to see what is active and not--things are displayed in a tree grouping with sub-processes under so you can see what belongs to which Apps. Task Manager hides quite a few things. Another nice feature on that is the ability to suspend a process or kill it, and you can rely on it to get all the pieces instead of creating an instability if you kill a process in Task Manager. // Frank
This is cogently put -- the issue has been aired to a fair the well, and TANE work has stopped any effort to fix this Trainz situation which is spoiling the experience for those of us with more than basic Trainz skills. Heck of a way to appreciate your customers. //F
I couldn't agree more... of course one time I suggested that back last October Windwalkr blocked me for a month as being 'unduly disruptive'--that was over the sound issues, iirc. Ditto on other long standing complaints. Let them eat tickets until they start NOT ignoring the user base and our needs. // Frank
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Some Good System practices
The blocking of post write monitoring of ALL Trainz directories can also be very important--as often as Trainz goes write crazy, and as a computer engineer I wanted to re-emphasize and endorse your methodology. Another thing to mention is Windows cache and Temp files ought be on a different HDD than Trainz, as disk to disk transfer is FAR, FAR easier on the hardware as well as much faster than asking one drive to write to different places on itself. THAT is what causes 'Thrashing' as the heads have to seek, operate, seek, operate, seek, operate... and that repositioning really strains their tiny little motors and the attached lever arms, et. al. but also imposes seek delays that can significantly slow the operations. Ideally, Windows and Aps on one HDD, Trainz and other big consumer aps (solid works, Blender, things which don't run concurrently much, or at least not such that one is busy when the other may also be simultaneously) on another. TEMP and Cache on a third... a back up drive. // F
This sort of resolution,by the way, would be amenable to a far faster resolution if they were inloading binary modules instead of this hybrid data storage scheme with compressed files in chumps. The binary file would have an error check code (like the internet data a packet) which can be reassessed on a speedy read-in, and if it indicates data corruption, TrainzUtil could be tasked to rebuild that asset from the Hash folders with the source materials. Secondly, any non-locally modified asset in the JAs or from the DLS could have a check header record--a short 'characteristics table' stripped off the top of said binaries (object files) and could be downloaded as a 'on need' and while validating check resource. These would be on the order of size as an internet data packet, a few hundred bytes, so any such check-read validations would be very efficient and fast. I hear TANE will have a new made over DLS 'whitepages'... this sort of capability should be planned into it. We pointed out last July that the current data storage model relying on our source code and failing to preprocess was antiquated, inefficient, and well... was less than optimal, so cross your fingers Chris Bergman & Sons Co. has been back-burner working it since. // F
OTOH, The CM's do run far better than CMP, even after SP1, that one shuts down on me at times. (I've got 4 different CM's loafing running whilst 'loafing' here. Back to work!) // Frank
This is all good practice, save for running Trainz on an SSD -- those can only take so many read-write operations then break, and Trainz is constantly using, closing, and messing with the HDD files, so while fast, back up to a HDD early and often! I'd write a little batch file using Xcopy to copy over any changed files in UserData and add that to the windows scheduler. Xcopy is both very fast, fairly smart, and very reliable and been around almost forever now. (It's almost a perfect utility!)
The blocking of post write monitoring of ALL Trainz directories can also be very important--as often as Trainz goes write crazy, and as a computer engineer I wanted to re-emphasize and endorse your methodology. Another thing to mention is Windows cache and Temp files ought be on a different HDD than Trainz, as disk to disk transfer is FAR, FAR easier on the hardware as well as much faster than asking one drive to write to different places on itself. THAT is what causes 'Thrashing' as the heads have to seek, operate, seek, operate, seek, operate... and that repositioning really strains their tiny little motors and the attached lever arms, et. al. but also imposes seek delays that can significantly slow the operations. Ideally, Windows and Aps on one HDD, Trainz and other big consumer aps (solid works, Blender, things which don't run concurrently much, or at least not such that one is busy when the other may also be simultaneously) on another. TEMP and Cache on a third... a back up drive. // F
I didn't 'get' that on our phone consults. This suggests CM is just in suspense -- waiting for an answer of some sort from the handlers ('Dynamic Duo'), TrainzUtil (operations) +TADdaemon (communications), or maybe it missed a response and goes into an endless, wait for answer state, looping mindlessly and never able to move on. It may be, That long validation and all that communication needs to finish, but the new CM being a separate process is spawned without the need to wait. The first CM, if you do as John Weylan reports above and wait overnight, may eventually get an answer and re-enervate. We know TADdaemon has an activity monitor, it may well be CM has become so dependent upon it, that such locks occur when there is something-fishy-in-the-data-base, and they aren't quite there yet in making it work the last 2% of what's needed. Since the Dynamic Duo are also active during the run-time GUI's, an anomaly whilst running those could also explain some of the freezes and crashes in those GUI modes. (And John you have had that happen before the HDD failed... Veddy, veddy, interesting.)
This sort of resolution,by the way, would be amenable to a far faster resolution if they were inloading binary modules instead of this hybrid data storage scheme with compressed files in chumps. The binary file would have an error check code (like the internet data a packet) which can be reassessed on a speedy read-in, and if it indicates data corruption, TrainzUtil could be tasked to rebuild that asset from the Hash folders with the source materials. Secondly, any non-locally modified asset in the JAs or from the DLS could have a check header record--a short 'characteristics table' stripped off the top of said binaries (object files) and could be downloaded as a 'on need' and while validating check resource. These would be on the order of size as an internet data packet, a few hundred bytes, so any such check-read validations would be very efficient and fast. I hear TANE will have a new made over DLS 'whitepages'... this sort of capability should be planned into it. We pointed out last July that the current data storage model relying on our source code and failing to preprocess was antiquated, inefficient, and well... was less than optimal, so cross your fingers Chris Bergman & Sons Co. has been back-burner working it since. // F
The only thing suspicious about John is whether he's awake or sleep walking. To be serious, the Plus is the ability to sort and such. One reason I didn't go into CMP much was it crashed a few times on me and I didn't need the grief. So I surveyed a lot, drove a little. And finally decided I ought upgrade--that surely the downloading issues that had my son swearing when he was 14 were resolved in a product family that had been around so long. HAH!
OTOH, The CM's do run far better than CMP, even after SP1, that one shuts down on me at times. (I've got 4 different CM's loafing running whilst 'loafing' here. Back to work!) // Frank
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I would also point out that nobody has mentioned system resources yet....
I have *newish* 3rd Gen Quad Core i5 running Win8, NO vid card, 8GB of Ram (of which Trainz can only ever use half being 32 bit as I understand things). Runs All aspects of Trainz very very well, until I try to load a few billion polys too quickly in surveyor in which case Trainz itself will crash to desktop (Im sure a vid car would fix this), but TadDaemon usually won't crash as a result. CM never crashes unless I'm eating lots of RAM with other programs, and I let CM run pretty much 24/7 even when I'm running TRS12 (For reasons below).
That said, I rarely have issues with CM. Sure once in awhile it does the same shtick I've seen it doing since TRS2006. Your old friend, the (Not Responding) message in the top.... Mind, I also have roughly 100K assets out of the the entire known quantity of ~350K (This last number will vary for everyone as it changes daily with whats uploaded to the DLS, and how many non-DLS assets your CM is aware of at any given time). I will attest to the fact that, More assets slows both CM and Trainz'12 down. When I first installed Trainz and copied everything out of 06 (My main version at the time), EVERYTHING was a breeze. Practically no wait times for anything.... Now, I only had about 25K Assets then too though.... I've had TRS2012 for a little over a year (I think), got it literally a week before 61388 hit the net (Bought it on impulse at Half Price Books). In the intervening time since, the wait times for anything from a DB rebuild to just opening my frickin menus in surveyor went from non-existant to up to a full minute at times (Notably the first time in any session in Surveyor while the DB loads what it needs to).....
In all this time, I've only run 3 DB Rebuilds, and never a full/extended one, only quick ones and each one was due to the same asset being faulty. The most common recurring problem that has appeared in CM though due to lack of resources? The text in the Search Bars at the top go funny and hard to read if I let the CM run when Im running too many other things, and refuse to reset until I restart CM.... I am Constantly DLing off the DLS (I refuse to pay a yearly fee for a FCT, flat out, so I do it all in 100MB Increments and manage what it DLs, all at no greater then 11-12/kbps), and am also constantly downloading from third party sites. I have to believe that my managing my content gathering this way alleviates alot of resource managing by the CM....
So that all said, to those having problems, what resources do you have to give CM, how many resources does your CM need (Is it getting enough to manage the size of your DB?), and how are you managing your resources?
Also, IDK if its been said yet, though the clues have been posted already. The reason why TADDaemon and CM can be force quit for months on end and then suddenly stop can happen for a couple reasons.
1:You have now encountered a faulty-ish asset (Just enough to cause problems, not enough to send up big red flags, theres one asset I know of in particular that does this, and because it was frequently used about 5 years ago or so it keeps cropping up in my DB despite my best attempts to obliterate the little bugger whenever I find it) and it needs to be found and removed (Though the DB Rebuilds you all seem to be doing as punishment should fix this particular issue).
or
2: (The more likely reason) Everytime you force quit your CM or your Daemon, you're playing roulette. As you do this, you're interupting DB management... Thats bad... Thats like hard powering down a computer running Windows2000 or earlier before Microsoft got really good (And annoying) at Multiple Backup techniques during operation (Which btw eat something like 100 times more Ram now as a result. Thank Idiot Proofing for higher OS Resource Requirements as much as anything else). You kept doing it, eventually you'd be asking for an HD Reformat because you're leaving pieces of unfinished Process all over the place, and as this accumulates the more difficulty the system has trying to manage it. Neither Windows2000 nor Trainz was built with 'unintended use' in mind(Read Contrary to what any tech savvy person would ever do, like overload available resources, or intentionally breaking their DB by Force Quitting). With Trainz DB this is even more important to realize, because every process you interrupt is dealing with at least one asset. Each asset thats left mid-process has the ability to be broken as a result, not because its legitimately broken or can't be fixed in a DB Rebuild, but broken because the now 2 jagged uneven halves of it are sitting in 2 different places in your folders, or was part way through being written into another asset etc etc. NOW, every time you try to load THAT asset, it causes a crash... CM or Trainz.... Then multiply that by EVERY ASSET that gets into this state everytime you force quit CM... If you have 50k plus assets, it might be awhile before you notice the issues. Tack on the fact that the DB is capable of restoring some amount of this on its own with out a DB rebuild, and you can carry on happily abusing your DB for some time in some cases if you're careful.... But eventually it'll catch up to you.... Before I had this computer back in TRS'06 I had very similar situations to what many here have complained of, and yes sometimes I could go months Force Quitting CM or TADDaemon and not need a rebuild, but as my DB got bigger notably, sometimes I would FQ Once and need a Rebuild (Particularly if I made the mistake of doing it to TADDaemon while it was running through Trainz).
So again, I would point out the questions:
What resources do you have for your Trainz Install to use?
How many resources is Trainz likely to need (IE how big is your DB)?
What are you doing to manage to those Resources for Trainz?
Hope this helps somebody, as even if it helps nobody, anybody could use it....
Thanks for reading if you have,
Falcus
I have *newish* 3rd Gen Quad Core i5 running Win8, NO vid card, 8GB of Ram (of which Trainz can only ever use half being 32 bit as I understand things). Runs All aspects of Trainz very very well, until I try to load a few billion polys too quickly in surveyor in which case Trainz itself will crash to desktop (Im sure a vid car would fix this), but TadDaemon usually won't crash as a result. CM never crashes unless I'm eating lots of RAM with other programs, and I let CM run pretty much 24/7 even when I'm running TRS12 (For reasons below).
That said, I rarely have issues with CM. Sure once in awhile it does the same shtick I've seen it doing since TRS2006. Your old friend, the (Not Responding) message in the top.... Mind, I also have roughly 100K assets out of the the entire known quantity of ~350K (This last number will vary for everyone as it changes daily with whats uploaded to the DLS, and how many non-DLS assets your CM is aware of at any given time). I will attest to the fact that, More assets slows both CM and Trainz'12 down. When I first installed Trainz and copied everything out of 06 (My main version at the time), EVERYTHING was a breeze. Practically no wait times for anything.... Now, I only had about 25K Assets then too though.... I've had TRS2012 for a little over a year (I think), got it literally a week before 61388 hit the net (Bought it on impulse at Half Price Books). In the intervening time since, the wait times for anything from a DB rebuild to just opening my frickin menus in surveyor went from non-existant to up to a full minute at times (Notably the first time in any session in Surveyor while the DB loads what it needs to).....
In all this time, I've only run 3 DB Rebuilds, and never a full/extended one, only quick ones and each one was due to the same asset being faulty. The most common recurring problem that has appeared in CM though due to lack of resources? The text in the Search Bars at the top go funny and hard to read if I let the CM run when Im running too many other things, and refuse to reset until I restart CM.... I am Constantly DLing off the DLS (I refuse to pay a yearly fee for a FCT, flat out, so I do it all in 100MB Increments and manage what it DLs, all at no greater then 11-12/kbps), and am also constantly downloading from third party sites. I have to believe that my managing my content gathering this way alleviates alot of resource managing by the CM....
So that all said, to those having problems, what resources do you have to give CM, how many resources does your CM need (Is it getting enough to manage the size of your DB?), and how are you managing your resources?
Also, IDK if its been said yet, though the clues have been posted already. The reason why TADDaemon and CM can be force quit for months on end and then suddenly stop can happen for a couple reasons.
1:You have now encountered a faulty-ish asset (Just enough to cause problems, not enough to send up big red flags, theres one asset I know of in particular that does this, and because it was frequently used about 5 years ago or so it keeps cropping up in my DB despite my best attempts to obliterate the little bugger whenever I find it) and it needs to be found and removed (Though the DB Rebuilds you all seem to be doing as punishment should fix this particular issue).
or
2: (The more likely reason) Everytime you force quit your CM or your Daemon, you're playing roulette. As you do this, you're interupting DB management... Thats bad... Thats like hard powering down a computer running Windows2000 or earlier before Microsoft got really good (And annoying) at Multiple Backup techniques during operation (Which btw eat something like 100 times more Ram now as a result. Thank Idiot Proofing for higher OS Resource Requirements as much as anything else). You kept doing it, eventually you'd be asking for an HD Reformat because you're leaving pieces of unfinished Process all over the place, and as this accumulates the more difficulty the system has trying to manage it. Neither Windows2000 nor Trainz was built with 'unintended use' in mind(Read Contrary to what any tech savvy person would ever do, like overload available resources, or intentionally breaking their DB by Force Quitting). With Trainz DB this is even more important to realize, because every process you interrupt is dealing with at least one asset. Each asset thats left mid-process has the ability to be broken as a result, not because its legitimately broken or can't be fixed in a DB Rebuild, but broken because the now 2 jagged uneven halves of it are sitting in 2 different places in your folders, or was part way through being written into another asset etc etc. NOW, every time you try to load THAT asset, it causes a crash... CM or Trainz.... Then multiply that by EVERY ASSET that gets into this state everytime you force quit CM... If you have 50k plus assets, it might be awhile before you notice the issues. Tack on the fact that the DB is capable of restoring some amount of this on its own with out a DB rebuild, and you can carry on happily abusing your DB for some time in some cases if you're careful.... But eventually it'll catch up to you.... Before I had this computer back in TRS'06 I had very similar situations to what many here have complained of, and yes sometimes I could go months Force Quitting CM or TADDaemon and not need a rebuild, but as my DB got bigger notably, sometimes I would FQ Once and need a Rebuild (Particularly if I made the mistake of doing it to TADDaemon while it was running through Trainz).
So again, I would point out the questions:
What resources do you have for your Trainz Install to use?
How many resources is Trainz likely to need (IE how big is your DB)?
What are you doing to manage to those Resources for Trainz?
Hope this helps somebody, as even if it helps nobody, anybody could use it....
Thanks for reading if you have,
Falcus