We're not REAL Model Railroaders--- are we?

I gave a presentation at a historical society about modelling the local railroad in V-Scale last year. There was quite a bit of interest, but there *are* tradeoffs with physical modelling.
Physical fragility is replaced with data crashes / corruption / accidental deletion. The low incremental cost of V-Scale is balanced by the high startup cost of a decent computer. Track and physical maintenance is replaced by computer maintenance.

I'm not sure how hobby shops could support our segment of the hobby. More plans, perhaps? Run Blender / GMAX clinics or classes? RR-related peripherals (raildriver, others?). Resell / demo payware? Sell 3D models that can be imported into various train sims? Many of these items might be just as easily sold online; other than the ability to demo various items w/o chance of piracy.

Curtis

Edit: And yes, I have several half-completed LEGO models on my desk ;-)
 
....I'm working on a Lego railway too. I'm building it using the Enlighten Brick series, a Chinese Lego product. I get track packs for $15, trains for $20.....

Thanks Captain, that sets the price for my soon to be released Virtual Lego payware pack :hehe: !

And back to the subject of Model Railroads.....

I was a diehard model railway man, and 1 to 1 scale railwayman, for many many years and (IIRC) in late 2005 bought Trainz 2006 at a model railway exhibition held at Alexander Palace (London) with a view to using it as a "planning tool" for my embryo garden railway. 6 years later and the garden railway is only half built (just the indoor bit) and I spend my hobby time on Trainz (2010 at the moment).

The standstill on the model railway front was, in part, due to the company (LGB), who produced the majority of items for G Scale (approx 1 to 22.5 scale), going bust. There is a long, sad story about this but the net result is prices for G Scale stuff - which was never cheap to start with - have gone through the roof. I have just paid a quick visit to Ebay to check the latest, here are some examples of track:
  • 3 way point (minimum radius) GBP £152 plus shipping.
  • Double slip GBP £176 plus shipping.
  • And best value size for size is ..... drum roll ......41mm (that's about one and a half inches) of straight sectional track at GBP £92 (but that is including shipping from the US!).
As for locos and coaches? Well, check for yourself, just go to "Ebay UK" then on the site search for "LGB".

I reckon this is something like a 300% increase in price over 5 years. If smaller scale models have gone up by this percentage then there is little wonder the 'physical' model railway hobby is in decline.

Maybe the model shops should start thinking about providing more services and generally catering more for "Virtual" scale modellers if they want to stay in business.

I would like to say that I have the greatest respect for all the people who continue to model 'real' model railways, long may they continue to do so. I would also ask some of those in the V scale modelling world who whinge about 'having' to part with £30 or 40 a year for the hobby should have a look around at the prices of 'real' model railways and consider who is the lucky one....

Whatever ever you like to do, enjoy it, and remember - "Our last garment is made without pockets" - (Italian proverb).

Cheers
 
I gave a presentation at a historical society about modelling the local railroad in V-Scale last year. There was quite a bit of interest, but there *are* tradeoffs with physical modelling.
Physical fragility is replaced with data crashes / corruption / accidental deletion. The low incremental cost of V-Scale is balanced by the high startup cost of a decent computer. Track and physical maintenance is replaced by computer maintenance.

I'm not sure how hobby shops could support our segment of the hobby. More plans, perhaps? Run Blender / GMAX clinics or classes? RR-related peripherals (raildriver, others?). Resell / demo payware? Sell 3D models that can be imported into various train sims? Many of these items might be just as easily sold online; other than the ability to demo various items w/o chance of piracy.

Curtis

Edit: And yes, I have several half-completed LEGO models on my desk ;-)

I agree Curtis, this can be an issue, but the computer maintenance aspect of V-scale hobbies is something to consider. Given the cloud-technology, and the resources today for not just online backups, but also onsite backup solutions, this has become the lesser of the two evils. It's more of an environmental issue than anything. The personal computer today is a far cry from what it was a decade ago when we started in this hobby. The hardware is far more stable, if the computer is maintained properly, and kept in a decent environment, it can run for many years. At my former employer, we ran old Proliant Servers from Compaq. Not HP, Compaq! These machines were still operational a decade after they were purchased. They ran 24 x 7 /365, and barely had problems other than an occasional hard drive, which was replaced easily due to the RAID 5+1 setup. These machines were running in a cooled computer room which was kept at 65F year round.

Now having said that... Leaving it running in a non-airconditioned room or display case, is not a good thing for the equipment. Sadly, many museums have limited resources and, if your historical society is like many around here, they're staffed by volunteers on a part-time basis. This leaves the building in a rather poor condition inside. This is not only bad for the computer, but also for anything else that maybe on display. Musical instruments, for example, require an environment similar to that for a computer to be maintained in good condition.

The Frederick Collection www.frederickcollection.org houses 24 antique grand pianos. They have low temperatures in the winter, and a cool dry environment in the summer. The temperatures during the summer are in the 70s, and in the 60s in the winter. The Frederick's are onsite daily to maintain their collection. I don't see happening that at my local historical society either, which houses some antique Edison recordings that are now disintegrating due to the poor environment they are kept in.

John
 
After about 50 years 'real' railway modelling, producing many very small layouts (maximum 16 feet long, all portable), at times a new one each year to have something different for a regular local exhibition, I was presented with TRS2004 five years ago - and can now make not just the layout of my dreams, but more than one (and therein lies a problem since I have started too many new routes, trying different ideas and techniques).

But I would never go back to wood, MDF or softboard. card, plastic, glue, plaster, coloured flock ... Not when I can sit comfortably indoors whatever the weather and enjoy Trainz, whether adding to a route or creating a model in GMax.

And I still consider myself a real modeller ...

Ray
 
As a boy and into my late teens I had a small model railway on a board but always hankered for something bigger but space was the thing. Now much later I have the accomodation but the thought of all the work using the whole room then the modern day cost of the build and supplying everything became a trifle daunting. Then I discovered train simulation. However I still mused but weighed up something that would set me back a four figure number of pounds to the give away comparison of purchasing Trainz! So now I can build things that I know about and have proper running instead of round an oval or whatever. I am sure many with actual layouts are happy with that but I found it too restricting. I have built a system that is based on factual and if I want I can add closed lines as often as I want and no restriction of a wall!
 
Then there is the incresed risk. For example, static electricity.

To My Lionel TMCC Dash 9, it just makes it act funny, nothing which a few button presses can fix.

To a drive, a bit of data can become all messed up, and there goes one payware loco.

And it over the same time span can cost almost as much.

And a JR loco you can't touch, no matter how good it looks. My Lionel TMCC Dash 9 can be touched and felt, giving you a better sense of how awesome a GE Dash 9 is.

(Man, I want to run it so bad.)
 
I have toyed with the idea (excuse the pun) for a while of building my own HO layout. If I rearranged my hobby room I could build something on a 3 metre by 10 metre layout. I often buy Model Railroader magazines and drool over the nice expensive locos and wagons but wonder about the cost of rails, turnouts, signals, DCC stuff, buildings, cars, etc etc. Then you have to choose what era, steam or diesel, freight vs passenger. Very expensive. Then would I get bored with just one layout vs unlimited in Trainz12?
Peter
 
Holding an $800 Lionel engine in my hands (yeah, I'm an O-guager) is a very different experience than playing with trainz. I love both, but they're just two very different ways of enjoying the train hobby. The fact that you're completely unlimited in trainz (other than hard-drive space) is very appealing to many people (myself included), but that rewarding feeling that you get when you get that lionel loco after you've been saving up for a long time is hard to beat...except the feeling that you get when you can buy an awesome loco from jr for $10:hehe:
 
Scale? Because if it's not, you were overpaid.

I have a 400$ scale Dash 9 that is my pride and joy.

Along with a PWC Trainmaster an a Jr. Hudson.
 
Oh yeah, course it's scale...I wouldn't dream of paying that much for a traditional engine lol:hehe:

Yeah, I got that, a Legacy WM GP-7, a CSX SD80mac, an old PW 4-4-0 that my grandpa gave me, and the polar express..I operate TMCC for all but the 4-4-0

And that BNSF Dash-9 sounds sweet..what makeis it? Oh, and the trainmaster...wow....what color is it in?
 
CN actually. Made by Lionel. It has that awsome GE noise.

Give me a few minutes to find the photo's of the locos.
 
I ventured into a model railroad hobby shop recently and the young man who worked there came running over to me and asked, "Do you have a model railroad?" I replied, "I sure do! But my model railroad is on my computer." Well, his head (and mood) dropped when I started explaining how I design and build my model railroad with Trainz Railroad Simulator. He walked away (rather quickly) before I could finish talking about Trainz. The rest of my visit I was basically given the cold shoulder while he talked to some other customers who were "real" model railroaders (HO scale, N scale, etc.).

This isn't the first time I was ignored in a model railroad hobby shop when I explained my model railroad was Trainz--- even by customers. I realize, I probably won't be buying a $169.00 HO scale SD70ACe or a bunch of scenery items like buildings, trees, vehicles, track, etc. etc. Money talks, as they say. But I do buy books and other stuff there so, hey, we all share a love of trains so why can't we TRAINZ people be considered REAL model railroaders, too?

Anyone else have a similar experience?

Cheers,

Dave
Sure we are.. Im 10 and i can build a full scale route based in chicago.. (its fairly easy as in 123 and no millon dollar railroad as in just tracks,buildings and cars.. But to make a 150 car freight train thats a thousand dollar process to get the cars.. Im looking in to KATO Nscale stuff for a under the bed layout.. (on casters) or on top of my dresser but thats going to run us a thousand dollars for locos,tracks etc (but virtually anything can go on it N SCALE wise) So.. i say Yes.. we are
 
The OP is an old question but still valid.A "Real" model railway is truly a work of art but it has it's limitations; you need vast amounts of space, money and SKILL - you can just bung a bunch of kits together but nobody "who knows" will be impressed. The best you can hope for is a small country station with unrealistically tight curves, level crossings that don't work and passengers who stand frozen on the platform. You can't get into the driving cab or experience anything past going round the same oval or maybe a bit of shunting!
With Trainz however you have to learn about station layouts, signalling, geography, gradients, vegetation..........and computers. My knowledge of computers has increased hugely since I tried to get the ideal setup.
I know where "Real" modellers are coming from but in some ways they are just Luddites afraid of change.
 
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