We're not REAL Model Railroaders--- are we?

[kittycraft]

Sorry if someone has said this, but aardvark1,a older version of Model Railroader showed a guy who built his large HO Layout just with Trainz.
It was how I got into Trainz, but of course, I lost it.

 

[Red_Rattler]

According to YOUR side of the story, you CLAIMED that he ignored you. How can you say that he ignored you, when you said he came "running over to me"?

Some might say it is a "model railroad/railway, but all ALL simulators are are just lines.

If you didn't like the shop's service, why not let the manager know, or let the manager know that he MAY be shopping elsewhere?

This MIGHT be the shops's view (not that is their view, just an example)
Perhaps they may have had a disagreement with the company, and from what I can see, the disagreements with the company are more than reasonable.

granted, they still like me because i still pay for their highly overpriced products (Not trying to be a drag, but as the only shop in town, they can get away with it),

Have you ever said something similar to?, "That's price is too expensive (or possibly, that's too overpriced), so I regret you are going to loose a sale.

To me there is no comparison, that actual model in no way could ever hope to reach the level of realism that we are able to put into models for Trainz.

Details that physical models can only dream about. True prototype fidelity. The ability to drive engines from the engineers point of view

I must be seeing things, as I thought Mrscsi & Martinvk said that their is no comparison & physical models can only dream about" While not "exactly" driving from the cab, let's test the cab view statement shall we? Search for a video titled "HO Scale Streetcar Cab Ride HD". (I think that's the one)

 

[CaptEngland]

The Model RR industry is in a slump in sales.

At a Model RR Convention, I overheard two table owners: "Hows sales ?" "Yesterday I was lucky to make $50 ... today, nothing ... everybodys picking things up, getting greasy fingerprints on them, breaking them, and walking away without buying". "This is the last year for me, I'm going broke".

It's no wonder hobby shop owners shun Trainz ... it is driving away sales, and the few customers that do manage to come into the store.

Here in the UK, we seem to be in a new dawn at the moment with no end of interest in model railways. This could be due to new build steam locomotives and also so many of the old lines being reopened. I just went to a model show yesterday at loughborough and brought three scale drawing books from PDH drawing services. I got talking to the owner of the business and he was most interested in what we as a hobby was using his drawings for. Also good is the railway magazine industry in the UK as now in Leicesters WH Smith they have had to make a complete self full of magazines just about Railways (that does not include models as that has it's own self!).

Regards.
CaptEngland

 

[Euphod]

I don't consider myself a REAL Model Railroader even though I've built several, and have one in progress now. My skills are not on par with a REAL M.R., nor is my dedication level. Like most hobbies, soon only the rich will have the time and the funds to pursue the pass time...

 

[martinvk]

HO Scale SD7 Cab Ride HD

cool cab ride yo got so small camera?
edvardsz1 1 year ago

Thanks! I actually use a regular sized HD camcorder mounted on a modified flat car being pushed by a locomotive.
v12aston 1 year ago

not exactly in the cab but OK, it looks neat.

One thing that defeats most attempts at realism when they move is their lack of mass. They move like they weigh next to nothing. My father used to put some lead shot in the cars to give them some mass but too much and the loco wouldn't have the traction to move them.

Not to belittle their efforts but each kind of modeling scale has its positives and negatives. Pretending that one has only positives while the other only negatives is not a true picture. There are trade offs and compromises at each scale. We at V-scale have some advantages but also some disadvantages.

One of the biggest is the lack of subtle variety. Build 20 scratch-built cars, builds, etc and they will have small but perceptible differences among them. Place 20 cars, buildings etc in a map and they will be identical down to the rivets and graffiti. The other problem is that V-scale objects are too perfect. Imperfections cost polys and nobody want too many of those.

Back on topic: we are modellers, just working in a different medium.

 

[backyard]

....imagineering...

I have been a railfan all of my life since I was 4-years old...:wave:

There is something in railroading for everyone, because it reflects a timeline for the study of History.

If you visit a museum and sit in the cab of a locomotive, passenger car or caboose, you may imagine yourself at control of, riding or working on the railroad of choice.

If you model trains, you are at the throttle doing the same. Back in the '20's, '30's & '40's, there were model railroad empires build from nothing using practically everything. It was called Scratchbuilding, and the fun was just as hard to find as we have it today creating, texturing, animating and operating practically the same equipment being produced back then...all required to stimulate the same feelings of railroading.

I purchased my RailDriver from Central Tennessee Hobbies here in Cookeville, TN in support of my Local Hobby Shop. Visits to the shop also provide occasion for conversation with people from all walks of Life.

I ceased participation with online model railroading groups because of the fact that by continuing their hobby, there is an enormous amount of ability to create practically every locomotive, car, etc ever built, why bring in an alternative not asked for?

If someone wishes to restrict their railfanning experience to what they can purchase, that is their choice!:hehe:

 

[JCitron]

The real physical modelers represent a different group than we were back when we were growing up and had model railroads. Today many modelers are, for the most part the very wealthy, and collect trains the way they collect the limited edition wine bottles and other collections. This is also the same crowd that buy Steinway Model D grands (8'11-3/4") pianos for their living rooms because they are a Steinway.

This is also why the models are so expensive. Kato and other manufacturers cater to this crowd rather than to the general public where there would be more money flowing, although the per model profit would be a lot lower. Instead they make limited runs where the cost per unit is higher, and they can get their return on their mold investment much faster.

I too have always been interested in trains, or anything that runs with steel wheels on steel rails. When I was growing up, my dad and I built a couple of N-gauge railroads. My first layout was a 2' x 4' that fit under my bed. I had that one for about 7 years then upgraded to something more substantial.

Much later, when I finally bought my own house, I built an L-shaped 3'x6' x 3'x6' layout. This fit in my bedroom along the wall, and had cabinets underneath where I stored books, railroad parts, etc. It ran well, but I got the usual complaints about the plaster mess, glue smell, etc.

Then the inevitable happened. I noticed one day that I had trouble painting some plastic models. Being a clutz is part of my nature so I attributed that to me being, well just goofy because I kept dropping the models. Then one day it happened. In the process of rerailing my very expensive D&H Alco RS-3, I dropped it. It fell about 3 feet to the hardwood floor and became scrap. The body cracked and there were bits and pieces all over! It wasn't just me being cloddy, it was worse, and now the physical models are history.

It was around that time that I discovered Trainz TRS2004, and my collection remains boxed up in my closet. Do I miss the real models? I sure do, but with my tremor and uncontrolled hands, I cannot trust myself to get back with the physical models again. It's too expensive and I don't have the money to burn. Then yet at the same time, I really like the fact that I can run a real 100-car freight train and not have to cut the length down to 10 cars so that the caboose isn't facing the engineer. I can build the railroad of my dreams without the maintenance, without the worry of dropping the model on the floor, or blobbing the paint and mucking up a scratch-build because my hand decides its time to twitch or the fingers open up randomly.

As far as talking about V-scale with other modelers, I get both interest and the big shun. I tell them of the virtues, such as planning and building the layout in the computer first. They like that part, but then they're also afraid of it at the same time. Why are they afraid? I think it has to do with being something new. V-Scale is computer-stuff and many of the modelers I've spoken to are not into computers, and are afraid of this medium.

John

 

[mrscsi]

I must be seeing things, as I thought Mrscsi & Martinvk said that their is no comparison & physical models can only dream about" While not "exactly" driving from the cab, let's test the cab view statement shall we? Search for a video titled "HO Scale Streetcar Cab Ride HD". (I think that's the one)

You're kidding right?

You're actually going to compare attaching a camera to a wobbly HO scale train car to riding in the cab of one of the new JointedRail BNSF Macs?

Try this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4bV0vf1Aoco

The computer actually works, the wipers actually work very well, you can go from one seat to the other, I will contend without a doubt riding around in that locomotive in Trainz is far more realistic than attaching a pinhole camera to an HO scale train car.

 

[sawyer811]

Just one? I can think of 3 off the top of my head in the KC metro.

I was at the one in Grandview about a year ago. I jokingly mentioned to the owner that he would probably kick me out if he knew I was modeling in V-scale. He was pretty nice and said they welcome anyone who is interested in modeling trains.

Though I can understand how a small shop owner might feel threatened by our virtual hobby.

Hmm, i must have gotten the one guy who doesn't like V-scale there

now that You mention it, i do remember the one down in the west bottoms, Doc's Caboose? I don't know of any others to be honest. But you are right, most of them are pretty nice to V-Scale modellers.

 

[kws4000]

Of course we're all real! Or is it the Matrix?????

Electrons are real, photons are real, and so are electomagnetic fields. You just really can't touch them.

About the best real modelers are those who run live steam and ride'em. But we can do that too, can't we? Just minus the physical labor, minus excessive investment (but I don't know about some people), plus excessive eye-strain...

 

[JCitron]

Of course we're all real! Or is it the Matrix?????

Electrons are real, photons are real, and so are electomagnetic fields. You just really can't touch them.

About the best real modelers are those who run live steam and ride'em. But we can do that too, can't we? Just minus the physical labor, minus excessive investment (but I don't know about some people), plus excessive eye-strain...

And... sticky fingerprints all over models, glue-odor, plaster dust, solder burns and fumes, stabbed fingers from flex track.

Any other virtues of V-Scale?

John

 

[mrscsi]

And... sticky fingerprints all over models, glue-odor, plaster dust, solder burns and fumes, stabbed fingers from flex track.

Any other virtues of V-Scale?

John

Being able to build a 110 mile map that you can navigate in actual real-time…

Having it take up a miniscule amount of space (actual) on a 3 1/2 inch hard drive…

Being able to have 50 of them Or more, absolutely priceless

Frankly I couldn't figure a single reason to go actual versus virtual. I get just as much enjoyment in all phases of virtual Scale railroading, and can't think of a single reason why I would ever take up the actual model railroading…

 

[martinvk]

...

Frankly I couldn't figure a single reason to go actual versus virtual. I get just as much enjoyment in all phases of virtual Scale railroading, and can't think of a single reason why I would ever take up the actual model railroading…

Don't forget that back in the day, there were no computers so it was actual or nothing. And then the first computers were the size of barns and needed an army of acolytes just to keep them working so even if someone had written a train sim and if the computer was available and if you could convince the owner to let you use it for model railroading, you would soon be doing actual modeling. It was also the time when P-C was a line of power tools and not something to run a train simulator on. And then there is the natural stick-with-what-you-got attitude. Those that have invested a lot of sweat equity into their actual models will be hard to convince to chuck it all and join the V-scale side of the hobby.

But we are all ambassadors for our V-scale When you meet a physical scale modeller, don't lord it over them by belittling their methods. Show them how V-scale extends the hobby into new areas of realism not possible in brass and plastic objects. But be honest and also mention that a solid understanding of computers, while not a necessity, is certainly a big help in solving the problems that always happen. Offer to be that resource person if it would help them ease into it. Who knows, they might be able to show you a few tricks in placing scenery to get that special look just right.

 

[mrscsi]

Don't forget that back in the day, there were no computers so it was actual or nothing. And then the first computers were the size of barns and needed an army of acolytes just to keep them working so even if someone had written a train sim and if the computer was available and if you could convince the owner to let you use it for model railroading, you would soon be doing actual modeling. It was also the time when P-C was a line of power tools and not something to run a train simulator on. And then there is the natural stick-with-what-you-got attitude. Those that have invested a lot of sweat equity into their actual models will be hard to convince to chuck it all and join the V-scale side of the hobby.

But we are all ambassadors for our V-scale When you meet a physical scale modeller, don't lord it over them by belittling their methods. Show them how V-scale extends the hobby into new areas of realism not possible in brass and plastic objects. But be honest and also mention that a solid understanding of computers, while not a necessity, is certainly a big help in solving the problems that always happen. Offer to be that resource person if it would help them ease into it. Who knows, they might be able to show you a few tricks in placing scenery to get that special look just right.

While I never was into model railroading I have however built almost everything that can fly, hover, float or roll and I can understand what it takes and what's involved. In my post above I was only talking about me, and my views and I don't look down on anybody for doing whatever it is
they want to do.

 

[peghorse]

I am talking about me here but it does relate to hobbies/passion.
As a child, (9/10 perhaps), I saved & saved up pocket money for a PT Cox trainer motorised model, (plastic), aeroplane. One of those fly by string/hand control ones.
FINALLY I bought it and I was sooo excited \o/ We were quite poor and this was the most luxurious thing I had ever owned.
I went to the local huge park and set it up.. :udrool:
Then I started the engine and ran back to the manual hand control thingy:hehe:
(I didn't know anyone who had one or know anything about these).
It started to take off and all of a sudden, went into a flat out vertical climb, then at the top of its arc, dived straight down at full throttle
It then smashed into the ground and busted into about 30 pieces:'(

THAT is why I much prefer virtual stuffs.

 

[martinvk]

... In my post above I was only talking about me, and my views and I don't look down on anybody for doing whatever it is
they want to do.

My apologies, I was not targeting you specifically, just some V-scalers I've met.

 

[JCitron]

My apologies, I was not targeting you specifically, just some V-scalers I've met.

I guess you've found, Martin that V-scalers are just as passionate about their own hobby as anyone else is about theirs.

John

 

[Amtrak72]

I am currently planning a Lego train layout, and it is taking time!!! i am currently planning how the track is going to be laid out.

WHen i'm done with it maybe i'll post some pics!

 

[captainkman]

I am currently planning a Lego train layout, and it is taking time!!! i am currently planning how the track is going to be laid out.

WHen i'm done with it maybe i'll post some pics!

I'm working on a Lego railway too. I'm building it using the Enlighten Brick series, a Chinese Lego product. I get track packs for $15, trains for $20. Cheaper than actual Lego.

I hope to also build a larger layout and have some pictures of it, but I don't have a plan for scenery yet.

 

[Amtrak72]

I'm working on a Lego railway too. I'm building it using the Enlighten Brick series, a Chinese Lego product. I get track packs for $15, trains for $20. Cheaper than actual Lego.

I hope to also build a larger layout and have some pictures of it, but I don't have a plan for scenery yet.

Cool! My scenery is just going to be a city. It's going to go like this-

There will be 2 levels.

Level 1(bottom level)- train Yard.

Level 2(top Level)-oval train line and city in the center.

THe 2 levels will be connected by a track that will come from L1 and will elevate to L2.

i'm going today to buy some wood boards with my dad at Homedepot, for the layout!