PC Upgrade?

[FLWBStrainman]

I have been running Trainz 2006 on a custom built PC, and it runs pretty well. It usually gives me no problems, but I've been loading one of my custom routes with scenery, and the performance seems to lag slightly. Also, the background is a little blurry and pixelated. Here are my specs:

AMD Athlon 64 x2 +4800 Brisbane
2 GB memory DDR2
Onboard GeForce 8 series (8200)
260 GB HD
DVD-RW

Any suggestions on possible upgrades?

 

[johnwhelan]

I have been running Trainz 2006 on a custom built PC, and it runs pretty well. It usually gives me no problems, but I've been loading one of my custom routes with scenery, and the performance seems to lag slightly. Also, the background is a little blurry and pixelated. Here are my specs:

AMD Athlon 64 x2 +4800 Brisbane
2 GB memory DDR2
Onboard GeForce 8 series (8200)
260 GB HD
DVD-RW

Any suggestions on possible upgrades?

You have a dual core cpu but TRS2006 will only use one. TC3 would make better use of both cores, TRS2009 even better but there are some issues with TRS2009 at the moment. To improve performance for the least amount of dollars upgrade to TC3.

video card

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-geforce-gtx,2270.html

Look it up on the last page. ATI have the most powerful cards with the least drain on the power supply at the moment but removing all traces of the nVidia drivers might be messy. See what nVidi have got but watch the demands on the power supply.

Memory, TRAINZ can use upto 2 gigs, the operating system likes .5 gigs so increase the momery if you can slightly. 512mb would be nice but memory is cheap these days so 3 or 4 gigs would not be unreasonable. There isn't any reason performance wise to go above 2.5 gigs though.

A UPS on the front end? Saves brown outs and makes everything a bit more reliable.

Cheerio John

 

[robbiehanson]

John,

The Nvidia video is also the chipset--cannot remove it, so he may as well go to ATi anyway.

I'll recommend an HD 4650, it's fast enough to run TRS2006 at 1920x1200 while not requiring over 350w or so power supply.

 

[johnwhelan]

John,

The Nvidia video is also the chipset--cannot remove it, so he may as well go to ATi anyway.

I'll recommend an HD 4650, it's fast enough to run TRS2006 at 1920x1200 while not requiring over 350w or so power supply.

That's not the issue. The problem is currently XP has nVidia video drivers installed, the issue is cleaning all traces of them completely out if you don't then you get problems running an ATI video card, same the other way changing from ATI to nVidia. My normal method when changing brands on a video card is to reinstall the operating system but that's a bit heavy handed even if it works. There are tools out there that are reputed to clean out all traces but I've never used them.

55nm and ddr5 are in my view worth having the 4890 is reviewed on tomshardware.com and technically I'm very impressed with it. But for more novice users getting rid of the traces of old drivers maybe more trouble than its worth so going nVidia avoids the problem.

However check your power supply you may need to upgrade yours to take a new video card.

Cheerio John

 

[robbiehanson]

John, my previous computer had a GeForce 6150LE chipset which also functioned as the onboard video. It used the same driver for both. I attempted to remove it, but every time I did it also caused some pretty massive issues. The computer ran fine with both that and a Radeon X1950 installed--no driver issues.

Remember, he has onboard video, so the video drivers must be installed or the OS will throw a fit.

 

[Euphod]

It usually gives me no problems, but I've been loading one of my custom routes with scenery, and the performance seems to lag slightly. Also, the background is a little blurry and pixelated.

I would be more concerned about "What have I added to or changed about my PC lately" then upgrading. If it usually gives you no problems, then something must have changed. Perhaps a piece of content is dodgy, or you have crossed a threshold with the addition of too much content. Scale back the content and see if it goes back to running well. If so, look at the latest content you installed...any errors or missing dependencies? If it's just too much content, then consider the new graphics card.

 

[tomurban]

PC Upgrade

Perhaps this should be a new post, however, I think it fits here as well. While doing ebay research to find a PC to run Trainz 2006, I stumbled on to some used off lease IBM computers for around $100 (US). Specs vary but they typically come with a 40 Gb HD 512 MB of Ram and CD or DVD ROM drive with on board graphics. I purchased one for $129 (US) using buy it now equipped as follows: Intel P4 @ 3.0 Mhz, 80 GB HD, 1 GB DDR2 memory (2 GB Max on the SFF desktop) DVD/CD combo drive, 2 PCI expansion slots (one is PCI express) 8 USB ports and high speed ethernet port. This machine runs Trainz 2006 including CMP and the DLS silky smooth. Even the built in Toronto Midlands Route which is very graphics intensive runs smoothly. So if you are budget minded (or cheap like me) go on ebay, type IBM ThinkCentre in the search window and pick one out. They are also available on some non US sites to save shipping costs if you are a non US member.

I have no connection to ebay or IBM. I just know a good deal when I see it.

Regards to all, tomurban

 

[tomurban]

Just an added note to above Post.

Many of these computers come with a fresh install of WIN XP PRO. (Mine Did), mouse and keyboard. Others only provide an XP Install Key. No other software is provided in most cases. Most are small desktops plus a few large towers with a lot of expansion room. These are rugged well built machines designed to run 24/7 in commercial and industrial applications.

tomurban

 

[SuperFudd]

Do get an Nvidea video card. I expect a medium range card would be a huge improvement over a built in video. Don't overload your power supply.

 

[tomurban]

Good point SuperFudd. The on board video is the 915g Intel chipset using 128MB of system memory. It also supports open GL which is important for running Trainz. I did update the drivers. When I ran the Trainz diagnostic utility, everything passed with ease. Power supply is rated at 230 watts. As equipped my IBM draws 73-75 watts (it fluctuates) connected in series with a watt meter. This may leave room for a small video card such as the NVIDIA 8400GS with 256MB. I am considering installing 8400GS just to see how much difference it makes.

However, as shipped it does quite well with Trainz with smooth running consists and back round fill.

Regards, Tomurban

 

[tomurban]

While running Trainz earlier today (Driver Mode) I made an observation that may be helpful to other users. I still have my IBM ThinkCemtre plugged into a Watt Meter and as reported in a previous post power consumption is a nominal 75 watts. However, when running trains in driver mode power consumption increases to 130+/- watts, an increase of 55 watts or almost 75%. No other program or game I have installed comes close. This helps to illustrate that Trainz consumes more PC power than most of us realize. Hope this information is helpful to someone.

 

[SuperFudd]

Ouch!
Only a 230 Watt supply.
I worry about my 300 Watt supply. My video card is only an e-GeForce 6200. It uses less power than most. It doesn't even have a cooling fan, yet the box says you must have at least a 300 Watt supply.
My new computer will have at LEAST a 500 watt supply.
Most boards use so much power they need a seperate power connector. The edge connector can't supply enough current. Mine does not use an extra connector.

 

[saintjimmy]

If you really wanted to get good performance in a card without a separate power connector, the highest you could go is something like an nVidia 9500GT or an ATI Radeon HD 4650 or 4670 (9500GT and 4650 come in low profile/small form factor cards, too).

Here is a link to a 9500GT low profile
Here is a 4670
And here is a low profile 4650.

The 4650 with DDR3 is the faster low profile card, but if you have an nVidia card already, then best go with the 9500GT. The 4670 is the fastest card without a separate power connector right now, without question.

Hope this helps,
Kyle

 

[tomurban]

Ouch!
Only a 230 Watt supply.
I worry about my 300 Watt supply. My video card is only an e-GeForce 6200. It uses less power than most. It doesn't even have a cooling fan, yet the box says you must have at least a 300 Watt supply.
My new computer will have at LEAST a 500 watt supply.
Most boards use so much power they need a seperate power connector. The edge connector can't supply enough current. Mine does not use an extra connector.

The 130 watt total current draw results from running Trainz through the on board Intel 128Mb graphics. This leaves a 100 watt cushion and a 50 watt cushion would probably be OK. Question is how much graphics power can I safely install to gain any improvement over the on board graphics? Would an ATI Radeon X600 be too much for the 230 watt power supply? Does it support open GL? I was not able to find out very much on the ATI website. They probably consider X600 obsolete by now.

tomurban

 

[tomurban]

Found some info under for X600 under Radeon. I was looking under ATI which did not have much. I found out that it does support open GL. No information on power supply recommendations though. Perhaps if someone has an X600 box it would most likely be listed there.

Thanks, tomurban

 

[johnwhelan]

Found some info under for X600 under Radeon. I was looking under ATI which did not have much. I found out that it does support open GL. No information on power supply recommendations though. Perhaps if someone has an X600 box it would most likely be listed there.

Thanks, tomurban

The newer technology draws much less power. The really new stuff is 40 nm 55 nm is sort of mainstream, yours is probably 65 nm so if you can use them the newer ATI video cards will probably fit your power supply better.

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/radeon-geforce-graphics,2296.html

Cheerio John

 

[tomurban]

Thanks for the feedback John. I Did some research on the recommended RADEON HD 4670. Product info on RADEON website seems conflicting. Product overview states board draws less than 75 watts under full load. However system requirements tab states 400 watt or greater PSU is recommended. Also, various consumer reviews on the 4670 were not encouraging. Complaints were mostly about overheating, fan noise and fan failure after a few weeks of use. TOM'S HARDWARE GUIDE indicates unit selling at $65. Best buy price (on line) is twice that amount. Can you shed some light here?

Thanks, tomurban

 

[johnwhelan]

Thanks for the feedback John. I Did some research on the recommended RADEON HD 4670. Product info on RADEON website seems conflicting. Product overview states board draws less than 75 watts under full load. However system requirements tab states 400 watt or greater PSU is recommended. Also, various consumer reviews on the 4670 were not encouraging. Complaints were mostly about overheating, fan noise and fan failure after a few weeks of use. TOM'S HARDWARE GUIDE indicates unit selling at $65. Best buy price (on line) is twice that amount. Can you shed some light here?

Thanks, tomurban

newegg.com have one for $64.99 other stores may sell for more.

I'd look at the 4770 with ddr5 memory. In newegg one of the reviews mentions Low power consumption of 80w at load. It's more expensive but power for load its much better. $100.

Your power supply has a rating on it that may or may not be trusted. An Antec power supply will meet its rating with no problem. Some of the no names may not. If you have a dig in tomshardware.com under power supplies you'll probably notice that one test they did an Antec 500 watt actually out performed a 650 watt no name. Antec's aren't the only high quality power supply manufacturer.

If you are running 130 watts with the built in graphics than I think we can discount that by 20-30 watts for the graphics chip if it can be disabled in the bios puts you about 180 watts with the 4770 IBM tended to overspec their power supplies I think you might get away with it. An Antec 430 watt is $60 at newegg but may or may not fit in the case.

Cheerio John

 

[tomurban]

Thanks for the assistance. I have to mull this over for a while.

Best regards, tomurban