Model Railroader not taking V scalers seriously?

[magickmaker]

I'm posting this here simply cause well it doesn't fit much anywhere else. However it does deal with Trainz on several levels.


If you happen to pick up the April issue of Model Railroader, you might notice a curious little "joke". This joke poking fun at an upcoming "game" which would allow a user to model a railroad in the comfort of their home without needing a basement. This "game" being a virtual model railroad of sorts.

Sound familiar?

Now yes, while they added some joking bits about scratch building, the question really remains if they realized just how similar to what V scale is, is what they described. I dunno why, but it hurt. I guess on some level I (as well as many V scalers I have talked to) have something of a dream of having one of our screenshots turn up in the trackside photos. Perhaps even another article about a V scale route. To date, MR has only had one real article about a route, and one other that was more of a discussion about MSTS and Trainz.

I realize now, that V scale will probably always be on the fringe of Model Railroading. That the acceptance I want (outside this community) will likely never come. I can live with that I suppose. I had always enjoied reading Model Railroader, but now I think I'd rather not. I mean, really why would I read it if there's nothing in there that I can relate to.

I sent a letter to rpo@mrmag.com that pretty much lined this out, garnering me something of a trite and canned response that basically said "it was a joke, you should know that." Yeah. Joke. Sorry guys, but I didn't see any humor in it. Maybe I need a good basement, a ton of disposable income (to build my route) and more free time than ever.

What were your thoughts on the article if you read it? Did it bug you like it did me, or not?
________
Laguna Heights Condo

 

[Ferrous]

I could tell you, but I can't find any MR's in either of the bookstores I usually visit. Go figger.

 

[Kiwi_Rail]

Just remember Trainz is "Virtual Railroading" not "Model Railroading"

 

[amigacooke]

As the magazine is supported by advertisers who make their money out of model railroading, perhaps it is not surprising that they will attempt to laugh off anything that has the potential to threaten their revenue streams.

 

[greatnorthern]

Critics (to use the polite word) you will always have. It's part of human nature, a buzz to some. In the end what really counts is what does it for you no matter what others say.
I don't read model railway magazines any more but I used to have a model railway which was 50 feet by 20 feet. The station took up most on one side and it all looked very realistic but it was very limited. Trains chased their tails, and when I built end to end layouts it was all over in about 5 minutes. I wanted to be able to drive for miles without seeing the same stuff every couple of minutes so when Trainz came along I saw the possibilities of a much bigger picture so I sold the model and upgraded.
I love travelling via Eurostar and on one layout I have I can travel from Gare du Nord to 20 miles north of Paris (more to come) or jump on a train to Louvres or Pontoise. On another I can travel from Skipton to Scarborough, another Exeter to Kingswear. All built by me and giving more satisfaction than any model.
OK not totally perfect - is anything? - but certainly bigger than any model railway and much more exciting. Yes, it gives me a buzz and if it does it for you stick with it no matter what the unbelievers say.

 

[Padster]

It's an April Fool's joke.

As rugrat correctly stated, Trainz is virtual railroading. We can jump in the cab and drive for miles and miles, whereas model railroading has limits and trains cannot be driven inside the cab. Therefore realism is lost, although there are plans to convert our beloved RailDriver to drive model trains. I think we should protest! I think the article in MR was just some gentle leg-pulling, and on the whole it is a good magazine with plenty to read:I have bought two editions so far and prefer it to Continental Modeller and Railway Modeller, both which seem to be glorified advertising brochures with a few articles thrown in.

Best wishes,
Padster

 

[johnwhelan]

Basically they haven't figured out a way to make money out of Virtual railways yet. You even see this in some UK sites that sell MSTS they tend to downplay Trainz as they make more money out of MSTS add-ons.

There are one or two electronic magazines dedicated to virtual railways, even one current one devoted to Trainz.

Cheerio John

 

[zatovisualworks]

As the magazine is supported by advertisers who make their money out of model railroading, perhaps it is not surprising that they will attempt to laugh off anything that has the potential to threaten their revenue streams.

Agreed 100 %. Virtual Railroading is a danger for model railroading manufacturers, the big ones or the cottage ones.

Since I started trainzing I haven't bought a single model item and used to spend a fortune on them. I am (was) a Z scale modeller, the smaller the more expensive.

The smallest side of Alberte :wave:

 

[Gandalf0444]

Agreed 100 %. Virtual Railroading is a danger for model railroading manufacturers, the big ones or the cottage ones.

Since I started trainzing I haven't bought a single model item and used to spend a fortune on them. I am (was) a Z scale modeller, the smaller the more expensive.

The smallest side of Alberte :wave:

I agree I was 1 scale up from you (N scale) and just 1 locomotive cost around 40-70 USD and if you wanted a steam locomotive,forget about it! 100-200 USD easily.I think HO is the budget scale,anything bigger then that can come at a hefty price as well.But let me tell ya ever since I started trainzing rather then trying to play with 2 tracks where the train chase their tails,I can have a full length layout,or even as big as a model RR as I want,since we don't have the restriction of room,which tends to be a problem for a lot of folks with what they can do with it. (espicelly if you have a layout then you have a kid,there goes your room so your stuck in the basement or can't use it at all:hehe: :'( )

 

[bendorsey]

I think the entire model railroad industry has been taking a hit from virtual railroading for some time (not that they will ever admit it). I have a 14-1/2 by 40 ft HOn3 model RR I haven't touched since getting Trainz and Gmax a few years ago. I'm seriously considering tearing it out and attempting to recuperate some of my investment. The reason? $$$. An 0-6-0T costs $495.00. K-36's and K-37's are $850.00 to $950.00. Cars are approaching $100.00 each. Kits are increasing at a rapid rate. Some in the $200.00 to $300.00 range (admittedly, extreamly well detailled craftsman kits). The hobby is pricing itself out of the range the average fan.

Ben

 

[Pendolino]

Even Italian magazines have published a handful of pieces about V-scale, mostly neutral, some of them utterly denigratory. I remember a ridiculous article stating that V-scale is much less cheap than "real" railroading, because the game is cheap, but it needs a good PC to run it, with a price tag around 1,000 Euros (approx. 1,500 USD).

Then I see that the HO model of a E.464 (a simple, modern electric locomotive) costs 350 Euros...if I add half a dozen matching commuter cars I have already bought one half of the PC.

Some years ago, I met the editor of one of the most popular Italian magazine and I asked him why they do not devote at least one page per issue to V-Scale, and he frankly stated that they if they
had done it, they would have lost the advertising that keep the magazine alive...

P.S. Railroad Modeler Craftsman published a couple articles about Trainz: one about a narro gauge layout in Colorado and one about the use of Trainz as a tool to design a layout and to test its operations before building it.

P.S. #2
I fully agree with bendorsey for this sentence:

The hobby is pricing itself out of the range the average fan

 

[atsfrr3000]

I'm posting this here simply cause well it doesn't fit much anywhere else. However it does deal with Trainz on several levels.


If you happen to pick up the April issue of Model Railroader, you might notice a curious little "joke". This joke poking fun at an upcoming "game" which would allow a user to model a railroad in the comfort of their home without needing a basement. This "game" being a virtual model railroad of sorts.

Sound familiar?

---SNIPPITY SNIPPUMS---

I'm guessing you missed the date on the article then?

 

[zatovisualworks]

Trainz and Model Railroads/Railways! I like this thread a lot.

I wish some model manufacturers read it to see why former model railroading enthusiasts like me (and many others as I can read here) are out of their business now. If they don't brake prices down, soon it will become a hobby for millionaires (maybe it is right now).

The millionaire side of Alberte :wave:

 

[magickmaker]

You know, when it comes to model trains itself, I think Trainz has actually gotten me back into the hobby. Working on my "garage" version of the Voodoo railway, made me start thinking about other things. Now I'm working on an O gauge railway (more of a scene which I will run trains through) set in the BR days. I've even ordered a 500 dollar (+ or -) brit locomotive to start me off.

Class 37 (my favorite brit loco) in case any one wonders.
________
Laguna Bay II Condo

 

[Ferrous]

HO is the budget scale

If there is such a thing as a "budget scale", then yes. It seems odd at face value to call a scale "budget" when one needs $70 just to buy a decent GP-9 (but it DOES look AWESOME, and it's better than the alternative "Dead-Like"...).

...let me tell ya ever since I started trainzing rather then trying to play with 2 tracks where the train chase their tails,I can have a full length layout,or even as big as a model RR as I want,since we don't have the restriction of room...espicelly if you have a layout then you have a kid,there goes your room so your stuck in the basement or can't use it at all...

Or if you ARE a kid and are restricted to your room and the play room for temporary layouts (which people tend to step on, breaking off every last $#%! switchstand on your Lionel collection--no, I wouldn't have any firsthand experience with this :hehe: ), or you have to haggle your way into a little corner of the basement amidst piles of Dad's old junk that he won't throw out (seriously, I know your Apple II speakers probably still work given how well you take care of things, but shouldn't those be in, I don't know, a museum or something? ). Additionally, as a kid you may or may not have regular income that your parents may or may not let you use at your disgression. As bendorsey said,

The hobby is pricing itself out of the range the average fan.

Seriously, when it costs so much to buy a simple diesel switcher (let alone a decent-sized steam engine... ), it tends to turn one away from the hobby. I know that's what's happened to me not only with model railroading, but also with LEGOS (a dime a piece? Are you #$%&@! kidding??), and so I now do most of my hobby stuff on the compy, Trainz and LEGO (MLCAD is WAY better than LDD, fyi ), excepting my volunteer service at the Train Museum as a car host/docent.

In short, don't expect me to be leaving for a while. You can start worrying once I turn 18 and can get behind the throttle...

 

[Gandalf0444]

If there is such a thing as a "budget scale", then yes. It seems odd at face value to call a scale "budget" when one needs $70 just to buy a decent GP-9 (but it DOES look AWESOME, and it's better than the alternative "Dead-Like"...).
Well compared to N-Scale where its usually 1.5 times as much as a locomtive of the same exact type just in HO....N scale is pretty detailed for its size however its simply to much money to run,if you want an Amtrak P40/2 you better get ready to shell out an upwards of 100 bucks,but if you want one in HO you can get one for a little less then that.

 

[QR1408]

I started model railways around 1970, with a US N scale layout. In 1980 I switched to Fleischmann German N scale because of better running qualities. Built a layout about 1.5 x 4 metres. Also ran Roco etc. Made a lot of scratch-built building for this. Sold all this off in 95 for Fleischmann HO. Since then haven't made a layout, as I bought TRS when UTC arrived. Now I can build route for CN, SP, QR or wherever and run real length trains along 100km or more of track. All this for the cost of one model steam loco on the space of a desktop. Have some Berliner Bahnen TT scale equipment which I may perhaps make a small layout for someday.....
WillB

​

 

[JCitron]

For me Trainz has become my replacement hobby. I have an extensive N-scale layout that is now tucked away in boxes. First of all the cost is way too high as other have said here. It's pretty sad when you have to pay $100 for a GP40-2 w/o the Kadee MicroScale couplers.

The second reason is I have evil cats that steal stuff. I've found my trains in the kitchen, and it wasn't my nephew stealing the stuff. And finally sadly I have Parkinson's which means I can't stand for too long as it bothers my back, and I end up with a strong tremor that is so bad, that I end up dropping things all over the place. There's nothing like trying to paint a building, and end up slobbering the paint all over instead of getting that nice fine line along the roof edge, or watching one of the $100 locomotives hit the floor because of an arm twitch.

The hobby industry should embrace this aspect of the hobby because it has kept people who would have completely exited from the hobby still in it. I still go to hobby shops and look at the real models, and I still buy books from them for ideas for use in Trainz.

John

 

[leeferr]

The train has left the station and the model railroad magazines are still standing on the platform wondering if the train's on time. I was an avid model railroader would hope to be again someday when I have the room. There's nothing like hands-on for me, but I'll never quit the virtual railroad.
The major train magazines need to figure out that there's a place in the periodical world for V-scale.

 

[RooRocz]

I'm posting this here simply cause well it doesn't fit much anywhere else. However it does deal with Trainz on several levels.


If you happen to pick up the April issue of Model Railroader, you might notice a curious little "joke". This joke poking fun at an upcoming "game" which would allow a user to model a railroad in the comfort of their home without needing a basement. This "game" being a virtual model railroad of sorts.

I did a little research into this. Apparently these "jokes" of which you speak are but short stories or ironic depictions of a situation communicated with the intent of being humorous.They are not meant to be taken seriously, and this particular one fell on a day here in the US and many other parts of the world known as "April Fool's Day", in which people exchange these "jokes", often at the expense of others, but with no actual harm in mind.


tl;dr

You're taking this way too seriously, man. Lighten up a bit. I thought it was awesome when I saw the article, especially the part about the ninjas.