Geez, you must be older than dirt!
Floridian High Speed Train Project is dead!!
- Thread starter ish6
- Start date
Geez, you must be older than dirt!
:hehe: :wave: ... Hi Ed,
I was watching on the history channel episodes they had about the US presidents, and what they accomplished during their time, and there was only 1 president that had no debt on his plate -- he did it by, as I recalled, not burrowing from the treasure reserves, thus taking the taxpayers money and putting it for what was needed -- he also avoid all interest groups, which was the key for him, etc ... and I few other things as I recalled!
Ishie
norfolksouthern37
what's a normal map?
yea thats fine and all but that wasnt really what i said. plus there is no reason every government project has to be over budget, if the government was at all responsible with the money that isnt theirs they wouldnt have that problem.
what i was saying is if they cant put a line between some useful points on the map then they may as well not do it. itll just be a waste of money.
what i was saying is if they cant put a line between some useful points on the map then they may as well not do it. itll just be a waste of money.
... As a Floridan resident, and for those who have driven from Tamp to Orlando on the I-4, know the heavy heavy traffic jams, especially getting close to Orlando!
As for everything else, money is money, and everyone always going to cry for more ... there will never be enough money ... even Warren buffer cries on CNBC, not to mention the government ... Generally speaking, when I took Public Administration in urban planning in college a long time ago, every single project we talked about, from highway development to urban residency projects, was came over budget when it was all said and done ... Our Governor (which I voted for) thinks that such a project should made under budget restrictions, which is a fantasy, because cost and labor is what directs cast and effect -- of course the project will be over budget, but at least ground would have been broken, and somehow it would have been done, because you can't turn back the clock -- even if it would have taken more years, which it would have in the long haul!!
Ish
norfolksouthern37
what's a normal map?
its plan didnt go from tampa to orlando, it went from almost tampa to almost orlando. when you dont even join up with the other major infrastructure whats the point? you dont want to travel to somewhere outside of tampa in the traffic and then ride the train to orlando to have to switch modes of travel again. i could see accepting it if it joined the major terminals or airports but it doesn't, making it more of a political show than anything useful. a big waste of money.
all im saying is that it needs a better, more useful route. that is the only way to really start to show the usefulness of hsr in this country, not make something that wont be used and be held as an example of how we dont need this crap.
all im saying is that it needs a better, more useful route. that is the only way to really start to show the usefulness of hsr in this country, not make something that wont be used and be held as an example of how we dont need this crap.
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Gandalf0444
FVRR member
All well and good except Phase II seems REALLY redundant.
...newbie...
You forget that the locations may not seam appropriate to you, but the Orlando International Airport is the 'almost Orlando' facility...all fly-ins for Disney World use that Airport, otherwise they are renting a car & driving from Tampa. Phase-2 was Miami. The 168-mph trains were assigned to these projects....made in America.
The trip time from Tampa to Orlando was only projected to cut 30-minutes, unless you get tied up in one of those horrendous collisions...you may never get there...there is nothing worse than hearing about a family of four wasted on I-4...story at eleven...
Florida's primary income is tourist related my man, service organizations(like trucking), are second, phosphate only really helps Polk & Hillsborough counties, with a small portion in Manatee & Hardee counties. Citrus isn't as big a player as was, a lot of concentrate comes in 55-gal plastic liner drums, in TEU's from South American groves owned by the same canners as are in Florida(Minute Maid, Tropicana, etc).
Tying Tampa & Orlando via Lakeland was to expand the abilities of tourists to see more of Florida than just Orlando, Disney World, Gatorland, etc.
I lived in the bikini state from 1965 to 1992, twenty-seven years. I last visited Lakeland two years ago, went to Clearwater to the beach(Big Pier 60). I-4 was six lane & no less an adventure than ever was. As I predicted back in 1982, they finally put a twelve lane section of I-4 through the I-285(malfunction junction) interchange. The growth from Lakeland to Tampa was amazing, as well as the addition of hundreds of new subdivisions around those towns.
Yes, I am familiar with the "festival of whores known as the Florida Legislature," a comment taken from a book written on the subject. In fact I just read where the governor took $78m he saved from another project & diverted it on his own campaign...
Florida's population grows bigger every day, regardless of the economy, in fact only one year did it slow down(the next big earthquake in California, that will change everything...again).
The State of Florida has no personal income tax, that sets the stage for the
'secondary' industries like cleaning, tropical fish stores, several Home Depot stores in every major city, trucking, foliage, produce, cattle, building trades, railroading, etc.
The only suitable reason for me of not building HSR in Florida is owing to the National Debt...but other states may get the money that Florida's governor threw back!
This venture began back in 2000, died, restarted in 2009, put aside now...but it's going to happen...in the next 20-years you will ride to Miami faster than a speeding hurricane!
You forget that the locations may not seam appropriate to you, but the Orlando International Airport is the 'almost Orlando' facility...all fly-ins for Disney World use that Airport, otherwise they are renting a car & driving from Tampa. Phase-2 was Miami. The 168-mph trains were assigned to these projects....made in America.The trip time from Tampa to Orlando was only projected to cut 30-minutes, unless you get tied up in one of those horrendous collisions...you may never get there...there is nothing worse than hearing about a family of four wasted on I-4...story at eleven...
Florida's primary income is tourist related my man, service organizations(like trucking), are second, phosphate only really helps Polk & Hillsborough counties, with a small portion in Manatee & Hardee counties. Citrus isn't as big a player as was, a lot of concentrate comes in 55-gal plastic liner drums, in TEU's from South American groves owned by the same canners as are in Florida(Minute Maid, Tropicana, etc).
Tying Tampa & Orlando via Lakeland was to expand the abilities of tourists to see more of Florida than just Orlando, Disney World, Gatorland, etc.
I lived in the bikini state from 1965 to 1992, twenty-seven years. I last visited Lakeland two years ago, went to Clearwater to the beach(Big Pier 60). I-4 was six lane & no less an adventure than ever was. As I predicted back in 1982, they finally put a twelve lane section of I-4 through the I-285(malfunction junction) interchange. The growth from Lakeland to Tampa was amazing, as well as the addition of hundreds of new subdivisions around those towns.
Yes, I am familiar with the "festival of whores known as the Florida Legislature," a comment taken from a book written on the subject. In fact I just read where the governor took $78m he saved from another project & diverted it on his own campaign...
Florida's population grows bigger every day, regardless of the economy, in fact only one year did it slow down(the next big earthquake in California, that will change everything...again).
The State of Florida has no personal income tax, that sets the stage for the
'secondary' industries like cleaning, tropical fish stores, several Home Depot stores in every major city, trucking, foliage, produce, cattle, building trades, railroading, etc.
The only suitable reason for me of not building HSR in Florida is owing to the National Debt...but other states may get the money that Florida's governor threw back!
This venture began back in 2000, died, restarted in 2009, put aside now...but it's going to happen...in the next 20-years you will ride to Miami faster than a speeding hurricane!
Institute an income tax and pay for tourists to go see mickey mouse yourselves. Hard to ask for tax dollars for high speed rail to help your tourism when you make no attempt to put some money up yourself.
Also may want to read up on what comes with accepting federal money for this. Might change your mind on why the money wasn't accepted. A lot of strings attached to that money.
Also may want to read up on what comes with accepting federal money for this. Might change your mind on why the money wasn't accepted. A lot of strings attached to that money.
No, to state taxes....
Florida's share of HSR was $300M. That was the matching amount.
State taxes are just another way to screw people out of money with no accountability...that's another reason besides the climate why people go south.
All the states get federal monies, so why tax people twice for their hard earned pay?
I tried to find if the FL-HSR $2.8B was a grant or a loan. If it was a grant, it doesn't have to be repaid, but if it was a federal loan, the interest would be low.
I think the sham the FL-Gober pulled was over future expenses, like maintenance, etc.
Folks, 46-states, including TN, have spent more than the get in sales tax, state taxes(not TN or FL), property taxes, highway taxes, business taxes, federal taxes(IRS), Medicare, Medicaid & Social Security. For TN it is over 15% more, for FL over 21%.
Practically no one has spoken of this, everyone wants to be a sociologist of transportation of the consumer...deficits are my reason why it isn't needed now.
The ruling factor is about jobs. When people are working, they pay taxes already established & by maintaining a budget, we then know what we can afford(just like with individuals).
This is why I don't worry about the US-American economy: too many people have tasted what it's like to make billion$. Whether it's in oil, technology, transportation, manufacturing, entertainment, mining, tourism, or whatever, they want to make more money...period!(But don't call it greed, that's not necessarily so). Don't threaten them with taxes or you kill the goose that lays the golden egg every time!
Supply & demand rules costs...you can't just shut down a refinery because you jacked the price of gas to $4-gal...the price will come down, depending on demand...then go up depending on demand.
Florida will nevertheless continue to demonstrate the need for commuter rail by expansion & modernization, then the city transit systems need to be connected by high-speed ground transportation.
It's also needed by many other states. Florida blew it this time, but these facts are becoming more obvious as time goes by...on Further...!:hehe:
Florida's share of HSR was $300M. That was the matching amount.State taxes are just another way to screw people out of money with no accountability...that's another reason besides the climate why people go south.
All the states get federal monies, so why tax people twice for their hard earned pay?
I tried to find if the FL-HSR $2.8B was a grant or a loan. If it was a grant, it doesn't have to be repaid, but if it was a federal loan, the interest would be low.
I think the sham the FL-Gober pulled was over future expenses, like maintenance, etc.
Folks, 46-states, including TN, have spent more than the get in sales tax, state taxes(not TN or FL), property taxes, highway taxes, business taxes, federal taxes(IRS), Medicare, Medicaid & Social Security. For TN it is over 15% more, for FL over 21%.
Practically no one has spoken of this, everyone wants to be a sociologist of transportation of the consumer...deficits are my reason why it isn't needed now.
The ruling factor is about jobs. When people are working, they pay taxes already established & by maintaining a budget, we then know what we can afford(just like with individuals).
This is why I don't worry about the US-American economy: too many people have tasted what it's like to make billion$. Whether it's in oil, technology, transportation, manufacturing, entertainment, mining, tourism, or whatever, they want to make more money...period!(But don't call it greed, that's not necessarily so). Don't threaten them with taxes or you kill the goose that lays the golden egg every time!
Supply & demand rules costs...you can't just shut down a refinery because you jacked the price of gas to $4-gal...the price will come down, depending on demand...then go up depending on demand.
Florida will nevertheless continue to demonstrate the need for commuter rail by expansion & modernization, then the city transit systems need to be connected by high-speed ground transportation.
It's also needed by many other states. Florida blew it this time, but these facts are becoming more obvious as time goes by...on Further...!:hehe: