Community Poll (UKTS...again)

[Vern]

http://forums.uktrainsim.com/viewtopic.php?f=26&t=110825

More than a little shocked (and I have said so) to find no-one from the Trainz scene nominated. Can't say as I ever saw the original request for nominations but, while my personal view is that no one individual should be singled out for adulation, if we are doing it then there are plenty of people from Trainz past and present who should be on that list.

 

[IsambardKingdomBrunel]

No suprise to me Vern. Trainz has always been vilified and poked fun at by the majority of the brain dead on UKTS.

Mike Simpson at #1 i whole heartedly agree with.

Without his various tools both MSTS & RW users would have a lot harder job modifying both sims.

Particularly RW, you can't even substitute a loco in a scenario with the default scenario editor.

It's left to RW Tools and Mike to provide the solution.

 

[fran1]

Not being picky but I saw kevin martin (kevmt) name mentioned, so we're not completely ignored/sectioned/vilified. Such is life.

 

[BLACKWATCH]

And the iceman2117 is also on the nominee list, you should check out some of his screenies on the UKTS forums.
decapod is also on the list.

 

[Vern]

@fran1 & Blackwatch

Fair does, though I was thinking along the lines of Greg Lane for kicking it all off, or someone like Rob Shaw who has been there from the beginning. Then you have jankvis with his 1000's of foliage items, or the Darjeeling team. Not forgetting Mike(10) Banfield, Paul Hobbs and the other TC3/S&C partners.

But like I say when you try and pick names out it's unfair to single one person out for particular merit.

 

[IsambardKingdomBrunel]

Decapod is more MSTS than Trainz.

Iceman is also being recognised for his work with RS, not Trainz.

When Trainz is 99% ignored i think you are clutching at straws naming a few isolated individuals.

 

[sniper297]

Couple observations;
1. Popularity contests in general are rather juvenile.
2. A UK popularity contest would naturally include a bunch of people that us Yankee Doodles never heard of. Mike Simpson and Paul Gausden are well known to people on both sides of the pond for their MSTS utilities, if it hadn't been for railsim/railworks I never would have heard of Kevin Martin (he helped me convert two MSTS models for Railworst), and since I have zero interest in foreign routes or rolling stock I never heard of any of the other guys.
3. I suspect the guy who started it all is a don'tworks footy fan since he mentions RW tools from Mike Simpson without mentioning the years and years of work that went into Route Riter before that. If the contest was about who had done the most for MSTS then Mike would have it hands down. Runner up would be Bob Boudoin, who people in the UK probably never heard of.
3. Trainz has its own dedicated forum here, consequently the Trainz subforums on both UKtrainsim and the US trainsim.com don't get much activity, that's probably the biggest factor in ignoring Trainz. Until you buy the game and register at this forum, you're not really aware there's any activity - if you're judging by the number of posts at other places you would think it was a dead game with few people even remotely interested. This forum;

http://forums.trainsim.com/vbts/forumdisplay.php?75-Auran-Trainz

Was started when Trainz first came out, nine years later there's only 1135 threads. This one;

http://forums.trainsim.com/vbts/forumdisplay.php?108-Auran-Trainz-Screen-Shots

Was started at IKB's suggestion last August, only 21 threads, most by me, Phil Skene, and IKB (Redcoat1812 over there). Same thing with the UKtrainsim Trainz forums, not many posters, leaves the impression that not very many people are playing it.

 

[BLACKWATCH]

Couple observations;
1. Popularity contests in general are rather juvenile.

Which just about sums up the lack of interest in the UKTS poll by Trainz users, who having opted for the best of the train sims, are showing their maturity.

 

[lewisner]

"Which just about sums up the lack of interest in the UKTS poll by Trainz users, who having opted for the best of the train sims, are showing their maturity. "
__________________
:wave:

 

[Wessex_Electric_Nutter]

Obviously, my efforts and attempts to create some sort of value to Trainz is pretty much wasted, but oh well, life goes on, if Railworks and MSTS are the rulers to most people, so be it.
In the end, I believe the Aussie product has a stronger voice, because theres a larger multinational community that is unified into one place, unlike MSTS and Railworks, which seem to be less community orientated. I have to say, Kuju is doing some sort of attempt to address that.

 

[johnwhelan]

Note the number of posts for each sim in their forum. Trainz users don't live there very much they tend to use either this forum or UKTrainz so its a poll based not on all sim users but on a subset of users most of whom don't use or know Trainz.

Cheerio John

 

[Vern]

Looking through the list of candidates again, it does seem to be pretty much a selection taken from UKTS and with the emphasis on Reworks - the Rework (RW2) - with Paul Jackson and RSDerek both nominated from RSC. There's some significant characters from the US scene not mentioned, Ottodad (who's actually British) may be a bit noisy :wave: on occasion but there's no doubting his ability to get stuck in under the hood of MSTS and RW and come up with some interesting solutions to problems.

 

[Wessex_Electric_Nutter]

Note the number of posts for each sim in their forum. Trainz users don't live there very much they tend to use either this forum or UKTrainz so its a poll based not on all sim users but on a subset of users most of whom don't use or know Trainz.

Cheerio John

Point taken, but the thing is, if you are including Failworks AND MSTS, should you include Trainz? Should you include every other rail sim?

 

[sniper297]

Near as I can tell it started in the railworst forums by the guy who made RW decal, so it's bound to be a little biased. Again it's one of them things like Most Valuable Player, sometimes it's obvious but usually just opinions that don't really mean anything. For all you Yankee Doodles who were around in '85-'86, Super Bowl XX MVP Richard Dent - why? Okay, he got a bunch of sacks, put a lot of pressure on the Patriots QB, but without Frasier and Richardson covering the receivers 1 on 1 the safeties wouldn't have been able to add pressure with the blitz and Dent never would have gotten into the backfield. Walter Payton as MVP of the decade (or even the century!) I wouldn't argue, but who ever heard of his fullback partner, Matt Suhey, making the lead blocks that sprung Payton for all them yards?

No, to me the whole idea is idiotic and pointless, it's impossible to point to one guy and say he's the one who did the most for anything involving a team effort.

Oh yeah, Ottodad ain't actually British, he's Austrian, emigrated to the UK after getting chased out of Vienna by the Soviets at the end of WWII. He's polarizing, people either love him or hate him, but I always though his heart was in the right place - he enjoys the hell out of trainsims and wants to share that enjoyment with the entire world.

 

[Vern]

Point taken, but the thing is, if you are including Failworks AND MSTS, should you include Trainz? Should you include every other rail sim?

I would say, "yes". If it is intended as an all time roll of honour and not some self congratulatory exercise for UKTS. We should also be including people like Chris Sawyer and Sid Meier whose rail strategy games paved the way for transport simulation. Also the guys who put together Mechanik, which it's rumoured was the game that prompted MS to commission MSTS after Bill Gates or at least one of the suits played it.

 

[ex-railwayman]

Hmmm, I agree with Vern's original post, however, also in the UKTS library are BVE, HVR2, Steam Express and Openrails, all these sims have content available right up to October 2010, these don't seem to get any mention either. I think this poll is flawed from day 1, unless you involve every simulator on UKTS you'll never get any balanced feedback. There are far too many people around the world who have committed so much of their spare time to creating, helping and encouraging others within the various train simulator communities, you'll never get a balanced view. To us British veterans of the game, Alastair Dussart's name doesn't appear, but, we all know how much of a contribution he made to Trains when he was alive, no, there'll be too much resentment and squabbling over who has done the most/best, etc, it will harbour resentment amongst many and certainly cause disharmony within forums.
Not quite sure what effect this will have when they release the final voting figures, do any of us really care who gets to be top dog, it's not going to stop me playing all these games on my computer.....

Cheerz. ex-railwayman. Take care everybody. :wave: