Baseboards

[Maddox61]

:hehe:

There's always MMMG...

MMMG.....?


Ok, Cheat codes. Don't think it will help in my situation.
Unless they got one that is MMMGD&RG. That sure would be greate.:hehe:

 

[Maddox61]

My Trainz History

A bit overwhelmed, aye?

I gave in and purchased TranzDem nearly a year a go. It's worth it's purchase of about $35.00. I used to do things like you were before, but gave up with MicroDEM because there were too many steps to create a route terrain. With TranzDem and the tutorials, you'll be up and running quickly.

John

A bit overwhelmed?

Let me give you all a little history on how this all got started.


About 5 months ago, my grandson found this program on the internet and could not live without it. So I went ahead and got it for him through Amazon.

After I recieved the game and tried to load it for him. I found out that it would hardly run on my WindowsXP that only had 1gig of ram.

While learning that I needed a better system, I also found out that I could create 3D models and load them into Trainz. Wow, was I surprised. I could build the models that my grandson could play with.

So I started learning how to run Gmax since the only alternative was a $1,000+ program called 3D max.

Fallowing this I found that I was going to need a program such as Photoshop. Another expensive program, till I found out about Gimp.
So I spent a while learning how to run gimp. I read and studied there entire tutorial so that I could create bump maps and textures.

While learning to create models using Gmax, I ran across Blender. Oh boy, we fell in love, since the keyboard has always been my best freind.
So now I spend the time learning to use Blender.

Now with Blender, You have a lot of rendering software out there, Cycles, LuxRender and more. So I loaded Cycles and Luxrender and had to learn how to use them.

Now that I have complete all the tutorials in CG Cookies web site, I deside that it was time to get back to Trainz.

So knowing that my system is too slow for Trainz to operate right, I go out and pic up a new PC to run Trainz on. W7/64bit/4gigs ram and still realy too slow. But I can live with it for now.

Now I reload Trainz, works ok.

But,

Lo and behold, The way we use models in Blender don't count in Trainz. So I had to learn how to get the model loaded into Trainz. (IE. creating the config files.)

Now, after all this and 5 months later, my grandson has done forgot all about the game and it has become an obsession for me.

So, now it was time to create my first layout. Yes!!! The pot of gold at the end of the rainbow, the just reward, the light at the end of the train tunnel, the.................wait.............NO...............I can't adjust the elevation of a grid by hand on a layout with over 50 miles of track.:'(
So I find out that I can create the elevation using a tool called MicroDem and Hog.

Now I download MicroDem and Hog using the tutorial on wewain Trainz Fan Site, read completely through it, twice, and had many problems since most everything for Trainz is now outdated.
But, with the help of all of you, I can now download a DEM along with the Tiger files from http://www.geocomm.com/ , load them into MicroDem, create the images, open Gimp and create the .tga file needed for Hog, open Hog and create the mapfile.gnd needed for Trainz, open Trainz, create a new layout, open the CM and replace the mapfile with the one created in Hog.

And thanks to you guys, I can do this now in about 5-10 minutes. That is of course if I do not merge any DEM in MicroDem.




Now I am at this point. The route I want to create has a total of 45 DEMs that I had to download from Geocomm. And when I started merging them together in MicroDem, I found 1 DEM missing right in the center of the route.

SO now I start frantically searching for the missing section of my DEM.
With no luck I turn back to the forum.

Now I think I am finding out that I can not get that section using MicroDem.
Probably the only section in the US that is missing and it so happens to be right in the middle of my map:'(

So now, I must get another program called TransDem, that I undertand is another huge learning curve, so that I can get the one section I need and finaly get started laying some rails.

Keep in mind, I am retired/disabled and my disability prevents me from leaving the house. So I spend more than 8 - 10 hours a day 5-6 days a week on my PC.
Example: I got started today around 9:00am, it is now 11:45pm. So I have put in almost 15 hours today alone. And the crazy thing is, all I work on is Trainz and models for Trainz. Check the times on my posts. I can honestly say I have put in over 1,200 hours learning modeling and Trainz in the past 5 months and have yet to lay one piece of track.

Can you feel the my pain.

This is why at times I wll seem to get a bit frustrated about "Well, you need to try this program." Then after about 10 minutes of stress, I try the program anyway.:hehe:
And as alway, I am still open for suggestions.



So, this is my life story for the past 5 months. Exciting right.
But atleast it keeps me sane.

So thanks again for all the help you guys have given me. Believe me, it don't go to waste. And one day, I will be able to help others to repay the favor.


Oh, And thanks for reading my book!

Merrill

 

[Maddox61]

TransDem

As for TransDem.

I have no doubt that it is a greate program.

However, I have 6 children, 4 son-inlaws, 1 daughter-inlaw, 15 grandchildren and 1 greate grandchild. And with Christmas coming, spending money on TransDem for myself is just out of the question.

So, I will keep trying to figure out a way to do this, if I have to do it by hand.

I may get stressed at times, but I refuse to give up.

Thanks again,

Merrill

 

[Dermmy]

MMMG.....?

Make Me a Map George.

Alt + MMMG (or is it Ctrl+?) will create a random map. Kids toy, and why 'George'? The answer to that is lost in the mists of time!....

I'm still kinda confused about the 'missing bit' in the middle of the DEM? The 'quads' you are downloading cover the entire USA, no 'gaps'. The site you are using lists DEMs by County, generally if a quad straddles two counties it is listed under both, but I have on a couple of occasions found a 'missing bit' listed on the page for an adjoining County, might be worth checking...

Andy

 

[JCitron]

Well Merrill, all I can say is welcome to the world of Trainz and all that comes with it.

As you've found out, you've probably just scratched the surface. Now with your whole world taken over by this great way of life, you'll be learning a ton of stuff as you go along. What's cool is you can do whatever you want with the program, taking it to the n-degree of complexity.

I've recently just discovered the great useful tool called TranzDEM. It's only taken me 6 years to get here! So for about $32.00 or so, it really is a great time saver. I don't use all the features in this program. I have very little time to do what I'd like to do, so I've learned the barest minimum to make it work right now, and will delve in deeper when my time permits. Anyway, I simply download the orthographic images from the National Tile Server along with their corresponding DEM file. I then fix 'em up and import them into Trainz for merging together, which I'm doing now for Down East Maine.

Anyway there's so much to this program called Trainz that we don't call it a "game" here. This is really a way of life. There are stories of guys getting divorced because they got too involved with the program. Whether this is true, I doubt it, but it's funny to think about!

Anyway, think of this as a giant model railroad. You have your baseboards, which require building whether by hand, or by mergers, or by DEM files. You then have your model building, which is similar to scratch building where you need to cobble up something to fit the spot, so you get out the scrap box and dig out the bits and parts to make that custom building to fit that corner of your route/layout, whatever you want to call it.

The other aspects, which you've probably not even thought of include the programming and scripting, which makes everything come alive. This is akin to the wiring and controlling of your model railroad. Wait until you get into these. You'll have things running automatically, and you'll be in there tweaking under the hood to make it even better.

So what am I getting at? Seriously take your time. Enjoy the ride because there's no rush with this program. You're subscription isn't going to run out, and all it will do is frustrate you. Step back and breath once in awhile. It's funny I spend most of my time in this program when I get home from work, but I will step aside and practice the piano too. (I was actually a music major once, but live in the IT support world instead). I find that these other things give my mind a way to solve little icky things in Trainz that I've been working out.

So as I was saying, have fun. This is good thing that's happening with you. It's keeping your mind occupied as you puzzle through the different aspects of the program. Imagine staying home with nothing else to do. That's what would happen without Trainz!

John

 

[Maddox61]

Make Me a Map George.

Alt + MMMG (or is it Ctrl+?) will create a random map. Kids toy, and why 'George'? The answer to that is lost in the mists of time!....

I'm still kinda confused about the 'missing bit' in the middle of the DEM? The 'quads' you are downloading cover the entire USA, no 'gaps'. The site you are using lists DEMs by County, generally if a quad straddles two counties it is listed under both, but I have on a couple of occasions found a 'missing bit' listed on the page for an adjoining County, might be worth checking...

Andy

I have checked with http://www.geocomm.com/ and they have listings in there help pages from people as far back as 2002 asking about the missing files for the Royal Gorge. I don't know if it is a copyright problem or if it is the elevation itself.

The area that is missing has a canyon that is about 300m across at the top and is almost 300m deep. I aint sure that the depth does not have something to do with it being missing.

Here is a pic of the area I need. And was the motivating factor for my choosing this layout;

You can see the cable suspended tracks just above the platform. The cables are attached to the 2 beems that are drove into the rocks, that cross the river. No other supports. Amazing!

 

[Maddox61]

Well Merrill, all I can say is welcome to the world of Trainz and all that comes with it.

As you've found out, you've probably just scratched the surface. Now with your whole world taken over by this great way of life, you'll be learning a ton of stuff as you go along. What's cool is you can do whatever you want with the program, taking it to the n-degree of complexity.

I've recently just discovered the great useful tool called TranzDEM. It's only taken me 6 years to get here! So for about $32.00 or so, it really is a great time saver. I don't use all the features in this program. I have very little time to do what I'd like to do, so I've learned the barest minimum to make it work right now, and will delve in deeper when my time permits. Anyway, I simply download the orthographic images from the National Tile Server along with their corresponding DEM file. I then fix 'em up and import them into Trainz for merging together, which I'm doing now for Down East Maine.

Anyway there's so much to this program called Trainz that we don't call it a "game" here. This is really a way of life. There are stories of guys getting divorced because they got too involved with the program. Whether this is true, I doubt it, but it's funny to think about!

Anyway, think of this as a giant model railroad. You have your baseboards, which require building whether by hand, or by mergers, or by DEM files. You then have your model building, which is similar to scratch building where you need to cobble up something to fit the spot, so you get out the scrap box and dig out the bits and parts to make that custom building to fit that corner of your route/layout, whatever you want to call it.

The other aspects, which you've probably not even thought of include the programming and scripting, which makes everything come alive. This is akin to the wiring and controlling of your model railroad. Wait until you get into these. You'll have things running automatically, and you'll be in there tweaking under the hood to make it even better.

So what am I getting at? Seriously take your time. Enjoy the ride because there's no rush with this program. You're subscription isn't going to run out, and all it will do is frustrate you. Step back and breath once in awhile. It's funny I spend most of my time in this program when I get home from work, but I will step aside and practice the piano too. (I was actually a music major once, but live in the IT support world instead). I find that these other things give my mind a way to solve little icky things in Trainz that I've been working out.

So as I was saying, have fun. This is good thing that's happening with you. It's keeping your mind occupied as you puzzle through the different aspects of the program. Imagine staying home with nothing else to do. That's what would happen without Trainz!

John

Yah your right, This is what keeps me sane.

It has been a lot of fun. but with anything that we must learn, at times they tend to get under our skin. But that goes with anything like this.

Nothing good comes without a price right?

It has been a learning experience. And as for the scripting. I try not to even think of that just yet. What a scary thought.

Well, I need to catch some Zs. Been on here now for 16 hours today. My fingers are sore.

Matter of fact, mt PC is less than 2 months old and the letters are all worn off the keys.:hehe:


Thanks

Merrill

 

[cascaderailroad]

WoW ... I'd be totally a skeered' driving across that bridge ! ... Are big rigs allowed to cross it ? Imagine base jumping off a that ... Owwch Oooch Ooof ... all the way down, banging off of the rock walls.

 

[scratchy]

Nah that'd be wayyy to scary :hehe: I think its a 3 car limit at any time, pretty fun when ur on it as well, the whole bridge bouncing around.. Literally stumbled across this bridge while in the states a couple months back, amazing place. Throwing snowballs off and trying to hit the railroad 1000ft below

 

[HiBaller]

... Throwing snowballs off and trying to hit the railroad 1000ft below

Woops! If anyone had caught you it is a $500 fine for just that. Even snowballs at terminal velocity can punch through an aluminum roof. Imagine how much damage could have been done if it were a rock. A big enough one could crack a tie.

Bill

 

[Maddox61]

Nah that'd be wayyy to scary :hehe: I think its a 3 car limit at any time, pretty fun when ur on it as well, the whole bridge bouncing around.. Literally stumbled across this bridge while in the states a couple months back, amazing place. Throwing snowballs off and trying to hit the railroad 1000ft below

Yah,

I remember the bouncing.

My sis lives in the springs. Her, my wife and I set out there on the bridge for a while just standing there waiting for cars to pass by. Could hardly stop laughing.:hehe:


Fantastic pic by the way.



Merrill

 

[cascaderailroad]

Just playing around in the gorgeous Gorge !

http://i525.photobucket.com/albums/cc339/cascaderailroad/Screen_001-25.jpg

 

[Maddox61]

Just playing around in the gorgeous Gorge !

Ok, So was that created with a DEM, If so, where did you get the data, or did you do that by hand (since a DEM would have given you smoother edges)?

If you did this by hand, how long did it take you?

I did one board by hand. No problem. Only took a couple hours using an image with the contour lines.

The only problem would be, I need to do this about 250 times. And I realy don't wish to spend an entire year trying to create just the board.


I like the cube looking cut outs between the tracks and the river bed. That gives it that real rock look, right?:hehe:



Merrill

 

[cascaderailroad]

I was just tinkering around with this, and this took me @ an hour ... but could be done in 15 minutes with practice.

Doing it by hand would take forever, and would not be accurate at all ... So a DEM would be best for this rugged terrian.

Where exactly is this area that you want ... from where, to where.

I do not know how to make DEM's.

 

[clam1952]

I've doing some internet scouring, it seems for some reason that Dem is not available, very odd, I did find an old post by someone who actually had it, links were dead though. Tried the wayback machine but nothing there, It must exist somewhere though.

If you look at Google Earth the imagery isn't very good, I suspect that might have something to do with it.

Incidentally I found a setting in Microdem where you can set the pixel size that might solve the 9.8 9.97 problem, I've tried it on a small DEM, just need to check measurements. Theory is that should correct the size for hog so the pixel size is 10.

 

[Dermmy]

LOL - I also did some scouting - that must be the only missing quad in the entire USA! My guess would be that because the canyon is so deep and narrow if the shuttle didn't fire the laser from directly over-head the data would be hopelessly compromised, so the issue would be whether not having it or not made all that much difference.

Merrill you may not be aware, but Microdem/HOG will cheerfully make the route with the 'hole', assuming the Tiger data is complete. I guess it depends on how many boards need to be done by hand whether it is worth it or not.

It might also be worth looking at seamless data (see geophil's post below) to see whether that bit is missing there also...

Andy

 

[JCitron]

Merrill,

Check out this here:

http://viewer.nationalmap.gov/viewer/

This may have what you are looking for, albeit in 1 arc-second, as Andy said.

I've been using this for my own project recently, which isn't quite as challenging as yours.

Good luck, and have fun!

John

 

[Dermmy]

John the USGS Map Viewer has been updated recently and I haven't been able to get it to load in IE, Chrome or F'Fox. It could be my very slow conexn, have you had more luck? It is the only source I know to identify which Quads a route requires...

Andy

 

[geophil]

One cause for confusion is the term DEM (Digital Elevation Model). By definition, this is a digital geo data resource, a kind of cartographic map, with only one feature: elevation. A DEM has nothing to do with Trainz at all.

Trainz route builders sometimes say DEM when they actually mean a DEM-based but otherwise blank Trainz route.


Now back to DEM sources for the Royal Gorge.

As I said a couple of times before, the standard DEM for the 48 continuous US states is named NED, the National Elevation Data. It is available from USGS Seamless Server: http://seamless.usgs.gov/website/seamless/viewer.htm

Seamless means tailor-made. Pick your area and the server produces your personal DEM file.

For the Royal Gorge you get 1/3 arc sec, but not 1/9. For best results choose GeoTIFF format, since this is the only one with floating point vertical resolution. (Applies to TransDEM. For the MicroDEM/HOG process you would need the Piglet utility to benefit from GeoTIFF.)

 

[clam1952]

John the USGS Map Viewer has been updated recently and I haven't been able to get it to load in IE, Chrome or F'Fox. It could be my very slow conexn, have you had more luck? It is the only source I know to identify which Quads a route requires...

Andy

It's stuck on loading here and I have a reasonably fast connection, the screen says its been updated and is faster? Probably means they are actually working on it at the moment.