Advice for a new Route Builder

tdstaylor

needs more caffeine!!!!
Good evening/morning/afternoon, everyone. :wave: I'm in the process of building my 1st serious route. I plan on having it be fairly diverse, but try not to get in over my little n00b head! :p I hope to have 2 fairly large cities, a rural village, maybe with a narrow gauge line connecting to a nearby lake, a mountain pass, and some American Midwest style countryside. Some thing I would like to know are:
What are "must have" assets, textures, etc. for the environments listed above?
What are some good methods for creating decently modeled grades?
What advice do you have for a newbie to texturizing a route properly?
I am fully willing to learn, as I really would like to see this project finished. Annnnd... Maybe I'll post some screenshots of it as I get farther along, and if you like it, I just might release it... ;)
Thanks in advance everyone! :wave:
 
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I'm going to get my daily exercise by jumping to some conclusions. First, I assume you are planning to use TRS to build something in model railroad scale. Second, based upon what your wrote of your plans, I think you're already over your head.

Here's what I'd do to pursue your goal:

1) I'd spend some time with paper and pencil, and think about where you want the elements you are contemplating: how big are the cities, and how far apart are they. If you're planning to represent real cities (as in another thread, where the progress in replicating the prototype route from Chicago to Milwaukee is being detailed), what are they? If you're doing prototype cities, this will have some impact on your grades.

2) Once more of the details are fleshed out, I'd spend time working on very small parts of your route--a board or two. Learn how to manipulate the landscape sculpture tools to your best advantage, learn what they can do well; what they can do, but not very well, and what they cannot do at all. Experiment with texturing, and see what you like best. If you do this on one board, and aren't happy with the result, it's no great loss to discard the effort and start over, and if you save you work progressively (that is, save your work when you have the next part just the way you want it), it's easy enough to go back to a previously saved version, load it again, and start form some point later than the beginning. This will give you the opportunity to experiment with the available environmental textures and decide which ones you like, and which you don't, and which ones will work for a different purpose than perhaps the creator intended.

3) When you have a number of the smaller bits completed, stitch them together with intermediate boards, and you're on your way.

As far as how to do grades, there are multiple ways, depending upon what grades you're talking about, and from the information provided, I don't see enough data to form an opinion as to the best way to suggest.

ns



picking places that you know about where they'll go.

What you propose is a good overall goal,
 
Good evening/morning/afternoon, everyone. :wave: I'm in the process of building my 1st serious route. I plan on having it be fairly diverse, but try not to get in over my little n00b head! :p I hope to have 2 fairly large cities, a rural village, maybe with a narrow gauge line connecting to a nearby lake, a mountain pass, and some American Midwest style countryside. Some thing I would like to know are:
What are "must have" assets, textures, etc. for the environments listed above?
What are some good methods for creating decently modeled grades?
What advice do you have for a newbie to texturizing a route properly?
I am fully willing to learn, as I really would like to see this project finished. Annnnd... Maybe I'll post some screenshots of it as I get farther along, and if you like it, I just might release it... ;)
Thanks in advance everyone! :wave:

mjolnir is right it does sound like a bit of a stretch for anyone to do a layout like that much less someone new to it. I myself am new to it to so i speak from experience. The tendency is to want the grad multi gauge layout but i agree with the advice given to take it one board at a time and play around with stuff to see what happens. I found a site called virtual railroader that had a very helpful set of trainz basics for track laying as it applies to grades, turnouts, signaling and other things of that nature. As far as scenery goes i would say play with the terrain tools in your surveyor and see what happens. Eventually you'll get there. Just remember that the best way to eat an elephant is one bite at time.
 
First of all...a DEM is not a neccesity...although it does make for easy prototypical mountains...but it makes gradients a major chore, as they are like that of a rollercoaster. Flat baseboards are a great way to get going.

Choose a track that you like: MP Wood, MP Rusty, and MP Tunneltrack Dark are great good old standby's. I have chosen: "Track Pack 2A" which contains: WRRW TK2A Dark Ballast by Slavedriver available on USLW. Once you find a low poly 2m-4m bendable track that makes good switches, find a matching ballast. I prefer to lay track and skip all the trees and buildings untill last. As for downloading each and every roadname SD45...you'll never need all of them, nor use them all. Choose a roadname or color loco that you like and use it as a test locomotive, and concentrate on laying track, perfect radius circle curves, and gradients.

Get to know your Trainzoptions file, and use the line(s): -freeintcam, and -surveyorfov=55 (changable up to: =185).

Use tools like "45 Degree Triangle" and "Radius Gauge 100m-600m" for perfect tracklaying.
http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showpost.php?p=506202&postcount=60

MB Quad Mainline is a great preliminary track spacing and yard layout tool, simply delete it later and replace tracks one by one with the track of your choice. Close spacing of yard and mainline tracks, where ballast touches ballast, and forms an overlapping figure " 8 " makes tracks look prototypical.
http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showpost.php?p=502743&postcount=59

Selecting " Auto Place Switches Levers-OFF" and by laying your own desired third party switch stand levers it is a great way to get past the default Auran switch levers, and lay fantastic looking track.

Most of all "Back Up" your route periodicly by "Save as a CDP" and store it somrwhere like on a RW-DVD, memory stick, or an external hard drive...just in case your route after 4 years of hard irreplaceble work goes Kablooie and dissapears into cyberspace !
 
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I am still a rookie and have came a long way from my 1st layouts.

have a note book on your desk taking notes on laying track and always us track markers,
Looking at this forum you can get some great idea's and see what you want to do.

Play with the survevyor tools and get friendly with them.

Start small and work in small areas at a time. use brief drawing on paper to follow a plan. Plan out towns,streets ,rivers,bridges,stations,industry. lay all track on a flat board 1st. then make your land feutures and bridges rivers etc..
 
Start off slow*like something small so uou can have the feel for things then go big like how some are doing the NEC,NJT etc.I wouldn't recommend MP wood tracks because people over use them like in most pics I see I see those tracks.It gets on my nerves but don't get me wrong those are some damn good tracks realistic and all but people over use them.Use some other track I would recommend tracks from uslw.net or the DLS.Goood Luck tho
 
One thing that really helps is to make a flat schematic of what cities, yards, etc you want in which order and their relative distance from each other.

For example:


Anytown -- Nextville ----------------------Summit City --------Endtown

Each dash is a mile or such.

Next, make a schematic for each city or station site:

Summit City
/----------\ __________________--------------
W ------------------------------/----------------------------------East
\------------------/


Also, you may want to do a relative grade profile schematic



Station 1 then up 2% for 3 miles to Station 2 then level for 4 miles and then down 1.5% for 2 miles to Station 3, etc.


That's my two cents :)
 
I'm currently working on my 1st serious semi-prototypical layout, The Southern Kansas Division. I listed what the concept would be, where it would be, and what the railroad would do for a living. Once you can answer those 3 questions, you're ready to draw a simple schematic of the railroad.

I decided that the SKD would be joint trackage between Augusta Kansas and Flynn Oklahoma for the Burlington Northern & Union Pacific, with a small division yard located half way along the route at Hackney Kansas. Interchange with the Northfolk Southern takes place at Hackney yard as well. I included just one town within each sub division.

Being a long time old fashion model railroader, I decided right from the start that I would go with 3 visible staging yards representing the various terminus's.

I then listed the few online industries that I would service, the types of trains I would run, and what operations I wanted.

One thing I decided from the start was that there would be no grades, all trackage is at 0.

The SKD runs a total of 35 boards, and has been a joy to create. Operation is more then I could have hoped for, and the scenery makes the virtual layout come alive.
 
As an experienced route builder, I'd like to add my few points too.

First of all I agree with the other people here. Start off slowly and gain some track-laying and landscaping exerience. When I first started, I downloaded some of the really super AAAAA+++ routes by the GFisher and many other experienced route builders. I opened them, modified them, and learned many of their procedures for track laying, signal placement, texturing, etc.

There's nothing wrong with building a small or large model railroad-type layout. These can be fun to build and a lot of fun to drive. However, since most model railroads are small, you don't want so much content in a tiny area that your computer hardware glows bright red and your system performance drops to that of a '286 (I'm kidding about the glowing part, of course!) A large model railroad too has the same inherent issues, in addition to its larger size. Most large model railroads I've seen are usually jam packed with random bits of different scenes that don't always appear to be connected consistently.

These issues can also be a problem when building a large realistic route, and this requires a lot of planning and the bigger it grows, the more work it is to test. My current route is about 150 miles long now. I started it back in early 2005 and it has gone through a couple of revisions since then. When testing, it can take a whole day or more to go through a session as I drive along looking for trackside errors such as floating roads (I really hate that), misplaced objects, errant track direction markers, even bad track joins, which the AI drivers will warn rather generically about. You'll find that even testing a small route requires multiple switches between Surveyor and Driver as you find things to fix and then continue on your way along the lines.

Once that section is "completed", I will move on to the next, which can be nothing more than a baseboard or two more. In the process of building my route, I have also merged other peoples routes and connected them to mine. This process causes a whole new enigma as industry-enabled tracks disconnect from the line that feeds them. There are other things too such as matching heights, textures, trees, roads, etc. so they blend into the rest of the route in such a way so that it appears that this is one continuous landscape when in driver mode.

Now when building a route, whether it's a model, a ficticious route, a representation of a shortline, or section of a Class 1, you need to keep in mind the purpose for the original. The late John Armstrong (1920 - 2004) mentions this in his books on model railroad layout design. One of his recommended boosk is "Track Plans for Realistic Operation", available from Amazon.com, is a good read for information on this. To set a purpose for your route, come with a story about the industries, the railroad companies, the geography, time period, etc. In the real world, a railroad doesn't run for the fun of it, unless of course it's owned by a wealthy person who owns 1:1 scale trains and the trackage to run them on. This will yarn that you weave will give your railroad more meaning as you build from one city or town to another, and connect one industry to another.

This will also help with another point I am going to make. Consistentcy. You want your railroad to be consistent all the way from point A to point B. The landscape can vary, but you don't want huge mountains next to a big city, or ancient cities next to a modern one with modern steel mills in the middle of them. There's no one stopping you from doing this, but in reality it kind of looks stupid. With the consistentcy factor, this will keep you on-track with a particular plan, your yards will look a lot better, and your industries and cities served by the railroad will fit into place.

One of the biggest helps in layout and building a route, is reading, research, and observation. If you can, look up online topgraphic maps. Topozone is one excellent place. www.topozone.com Microsoft's Bing and Google Earth are also good for looking at fairly current satellite and isometric views of various places. Bing has the Bird's Eye view for many areas of the US and Canada. With this feature, you can view freight yards, streets, mainlines, etc. in enough detail to even see people on the street. Now you may not be building a realistic route, but it's still good to look at the maps and reasearch industries. This will give you track-layout ideas and the industry-types will give you a heads-up when planning on freight service.

Another important aspect of route building is having fun. When the process becomes a chore, move on to something else such as driving other peoples routes, or even your own, map reading, and just plain going out and away from the computer. I find that I go through spurts where I will build like crazy then dry out. During the dry periods, I'll make observations about areas that I travel in. Recently, for example, I saw a nice looking industrial park. I'm not sure if there was rail service or not, but I made a nice fascimile of the park and I added in a loop track to serve the warehouses and industries. In my industrial park, there are some warehouses and some smaller industries that require rail service. There are a couple of plastics companies, a food distribution warehouse, and a lumber yard. All of these require service of some kind. The area as I remembered it also had some retial stores like a WalMart and others so I added in a couple of shopping plaza-like places and a couple of malls and restaurants.

And finally the most important thing is Backup your route! Please, oh, please back it up and make multiple copies of your backup. There will be long periods of building and things happen to computers. You don't want your efforts to end up in bit heaven, or wherever they go when something happens to data.

Anyway, there's a lot of information here, and I'm sure the others here will have more to say.

John
 
While in general agree with what JCitron wrote, I have a different perspective on a couple of points. First,

Consistentcy. You want your railroad to be consistent all the way from point A to point B.

While consistency across the route from A to B is generally to be recommended, a certain amount of inconsistency can be explained in the story of your route and the businesses it serves. For example, during any given period, railroads generally had standard designs they applied to items they constructed. Since most railroad lines were constructed at about the same time, the bridges in a route should have a similar "look and feel". But, if it happens that there is a particular style of bridge that you really like, you can create consistency in your imagined history. For example, suppose you really like the appearance of a movable bridge, but you don't have any stream on the railroad big enough to warrant one. I know of two bridges, one in the Pacific Northwest, and one in Illinois, where, at the time the bridge was built, the streams were considered navigable, and thus required moveable bridges, but where subsequent changes removed the navigation.

Second, for most every rule, there is an exception (or several). I can think of a number of exceptions to

The landscape can vary, but you don't want huge mountains next to a big city ancient cities next to a modern one with modern steel mills in the middle of them. There's no one stopping you from doing this, but in reality it kind of looks stupid. With the consistentcy factor, this will keep you on-track with a particular plan, your yards will look a lot better, and your industries and cities served by the railroad will fit into place.
without trying very hard at all: Boulder, Colorado Springs and Denver; Chattanooga, Tennessee in the US; Hong Kong, China; Geneva, Switzerland; and Rome, Italy all spring to mind immediately. It's true that if you're modeling railroads in the US or Australia, that there are very few "ancient cities next to modern ones", but this situation is relatively common in Europe. Again, the key to this is consistency. If you want, for some reason to have an ancient city in the middle of a larger modern one, your story needs to provide a logical reason why this happened.

As to the location of steel mills, at one time, steel mills were in the middle of, or at least very close to large cities. The historic US steel mills in and around the Chicago area are classic examples of this; but sometimes there are business in areas where they seem to make little sense. Most modelers would not consider Wilton, a small town in Eastern Iowa, between Davenport and Iowa City, to be a likely site for a steel mill, nonetheless there is quite a large one there, converting scrap metal to constuction material.

One last thing to mention: the "KISS" principle is a major consideration in the construction and operation of real railroads. Where model railroaders will add complicating factors for the sake of adding interest, real railroads will eliminate complicating factors wherever possible, simple is always less expensive to build and maintain than complicated. In times of doubt or uncertainty about whether to use some complicated item, or a simple one, choose simple, every time.

ns
 
While in general agree with what JCitron wrote, I have a different perspective on a couple of points. First,



While consistency across the route from A to B is generally to be recommended, a certain amount of inconsistency can be explained in the story of your route and the businesses it serves. For example, during any given period, railroads generally had standard designs they applied to items they constructed. Since most railroad lines were constructed at about the same time, the bridges in a route should have a similar "look and feel". But, if it happens that there is a particular style of bridge that you really like, you can create consistency in your imagined history. For example, suppose you really like the appearance of a movable bridge, but you don't have any stream on the railroad big enough to warrant one. I know of two bridges, one in the Pacific Northwest, and one in Illinois, where, at the time the bridge was built, the streams were considered navigable, and thus required moveable bridges, but where subsequent changes removed the navigation.

Second, for most every rule, there is an exception (or several). I can think of a number of exceptions to

without trying very hard at all: Boulder, Colorado Springs and Denver; Chattanooga, Tennessee in the US; Hong Kong, China; Geneva, Switzerland; and Rome, Italy all spring to mind immediately. It's true that if you're modeling railroads in the US or Australia, that there are very few "ancient cities next to modern ones", but this situation is relatively common in Europe. Again, the key to this is consistency. If you want, for some reason to have an ancient city in the middle of a larger modern one, your story needs to provide a logical reason why this happened.

As to the location of steel mills, at one time, steel mills were in the middle of, or at least very close to large cities. The historic US steel mills in and around the Chicago area are classic examples of this; but sometimes there are business in areas where they seem to make little sense. Most modelers would not consider Wilton, a small town in Eastern Iowa, between Davenport and Iowa City, to be a likely site for a steel mill, nonetheless there is quite a large one there, converting scrap metal to constuction material.

One last thing to mention: the "KISS" principle is a major consideration in the construction and operation of real railroads. Where model railroaders will add complicating factors for the sake of adding interest, real railroads will eliminate complicating factors wherever possible, simple is always less expensive to build and maintain than complicated. In times of doubt or uncertainty about whether to use some complicated item, or a simple one, choose simple, every time.

ns

Of course there are exceptions, but sorry for my unclear explanation caused by a lousy telephone call that managed to get in the way. There are ways of incorporating industries and mountains into the scheme of things, but the idea is to do this logically. A better example would be a canyon the size of the Grand Canyone with a city next to it. That would be more rediculous than the mountains.

Steel mills in the cities, that was probably a bad example. I agree there were and still are steel mills in the cities, and some are still active until the NIMBYs drive them away. The area where I live was once the home of shoe and textile mills. These are long gone and have been replaced by fancy condos and industrial parks. (The NIMBYs buy the condos next to the tracks then complain about the train noise. This is another story for another day...). The reason, story, etc. will justify the existence of an industry within the city limits or nearby to give the railroad a purpose. John Armstrong's book goes into excellent information on this aspect of railroading.


The thing is, as you say. KISS. This goes a long way with lots of things.


John
 
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