brendansbiz
choo choo twain!
What is happening on this thread?
Trainz-build numbers below 3.7 are no longer supported....
- Thread starter Paulsw2
- Start date
brendansbiz
choo choo twain!
hahahaha thanks nick
In TS12 31688 I still don't get it why that infernal daddeamon starts up when my PC is offline. Why isn't a routine build into the code that checks for: "OK, I am offline, therefore do not start tadddeamon". When this devilish program starts needlessly, it virtually stops or holds up everything from working in TS12 until it does its routine to check (what it checks for is and letting me know, DLS is not accessible and other cr*p. etc.), all of which is senseless as I am sort of permanent offline and DO NOT WANT TO GO ONLINE. I use that PC for content creating only, I bought a tincan boxed version of TS12, which needs validating and authorization only once to be online, when I installed that damn thing.
Why is that taddeamon still going through all this routine, even when later shutting down TS12 31688, to check for this and that, trying to validate this and that (well, hello, I am OFFLINE, how can you validate if I am offline, you stupid taddeamon?), to update the data base, when I saved any of my testing content, window, route, asset etc. already which should automatically be saved to the database when saving whatever needs to be saved in game? Or at least when shutting down my PC without taddeamon trying to go online and let me even wait longer to finally shut down TS12.
I hope the release version of TANE is not going the same way when I am (permanent) offline with my PC after the initial required validating and authorization of my ordered boxed copy of TANE after installing it.
Cheers
VinnyBarb
Why is that taddeamon still going through all this routine, even when later shutting down TS12 31688, to check for this and that, trying to validate this and that (well, hello, I am OFFLINE, how can you validate if I am offline, you stupid taddeamon?), to update the data base, when I saved any of my testing content, window, route, asset etc. already which should automatically be saved to the database when saving whatever needs to be saved in game? Or at least when shutting down my PC without taddeamon trying to go online and let me even wait longer to finally shut down TS12.
I hope the release version of TANE is not going the same way when I am (permanent) offline with my PC after the initial required validating and authorization of my ordered boxed copy of TANE after installing it.
Cheers
VinnyBarb
Hi Vinny,
A daemon is a background process that handles other multiple tasks, an overseer of sorts. TADDaemon works independent of the network, although it does go out and check the database online and handles the network login functions to the database, however, it does not need the network to operate. Its main job is to ensure that the various components in Trainz can access the database simultaneously, and without it you couldn't access the various Surveyor menus while browsing in Content Manager at the same time, or download multiple assets at the same time.
Most databases have this kind of function and a manager to go along with them. Microsoft has the MS SQL Manager, and Oracle has one for their database. They all do this kind of thing; with TADD having only a tiny fraction of the functions found in the bigger databases. The main application which interacts with TADD is TrainzUtil.
For every data sort, Surveyor Menu access, search function, file open and close, write, read, and query, TrainzUtil kicks in. The big pauses you see are TrainzUtil kicking in as you access the files. Keep in mind that every time you access something in Surveyor. These big pauses are TrainzUtil doing stuff and then TADD gets blamed for the big pause when actually it's the scripts in TrainzUtil taking their time doing the background stuff before TADD then reports the action.
In the old days of Trainz, before the implementation of TADD, you could not do this, let alone even download stuff in the background while using Trainz, or be editing content while downloading at the same time. With TADD being the go-between, the manager of the database processes, you may see the write-lock messages about access violations, but that is expected if two processes try to access the database at the same time.
Just today, for example, I was cloning and modifying content in Content Manager while I had Trainz running and I was editing a route in Surveyor. Once I fiddled with a bridge (removed the tracks), I then swapped from the tracks tab to buildings and then back to tracks to refresh the database, and my assets was there. While this occurred, TrainzUtil kicked in quickly to write stuff to the database while I committed the asset, TADD kicked in a Write message, and then when I accessed the menus, TrainzUtil did a quick flash and TADD updated the status.
I think I've got this straight... This is based on my observations of the process and my very long experience with database operations.
John
It could be that the Marsz route contains multiple copies of the same asset where as your Metro route contains lots of dissimilar assets. What's happening is simple data caching here. If you use the same asset over and over, Windows, and TADDaemon too may have indexed the assets, meaning they have pointed to it because it was used before. If you then grab the same asset and place it multiple times, the OS and program know where it is and don't have to keep searching the disk, database location, and everything else in the world to find the asset.
Now your Metro route may contain lots of tiny little bits and pieces which are different and require the program and OS to keep searching over and over for them. The overhead is greater because anything that involves a disk, whether it's an SSD or not, requires accessing the slowest component on a computer system. The information for this route's components is in memory, just like the Marsz route, but there's just so much cache space and that gets flushed if new content needs to be loaded. You keep loading up new components, then you keep flushing the cache. A cache is like a tank or sink, and accessing a disk is like using a teaspoon. If you go back to the tank for the same thing, it'll already be there, but if you keep needing to go retrieve a teaspoon of stuff every time, it eats up time, thus the reindexing (pausing), searching, fetching, then displaying. This is why it's best to use lots of the same components, such as trees for example, rather than many different ones, when filling up an area. Cities are difficult because the models are all different, unless they are the same mesh but only load up different textures.
John
You don't need a faster disk, you need a faster internet connection. I've been told time and again that TADaemon doesn't phone home while the game is running, so I hallucinated this;
TADDaemon isn't REALLY using half of the CPU to check for updates on the DLS while the game is running, it must be something in my system. Never mind the evidence, that's the official party line.
TADDaemon isn't REALLY using half of the CPU to check for updates on the DLS while the game is running, it must be something in my system. Never mind the evidence, that's the official party line.
Hey John ...
I see --- very interesting and informative, sir!
Another question if you don't mind ... since you're testing windows 10, and I am going to assume that you have a top-notch graphic card, does train load very faster then usual, even with all of these things running in the background?
John, I know I've been asking you lots of questions about trainz these passed months from large routes to pc stuff, and the reason for this is that I'm about speed! ... I've upgraded the power supply due to the new graphic card, and double the memory for this computer -- Believe or not, sir, it all came out cheaper then buying a new pc! LOL Windows 10 will be a free upgrade, so I'm good in that department, by years' end. Internet speed is 40mb, so I'm good there too! TANE will ONLY be use for route building, where as T12 for creating and testing contents! -- All of your answers these passed months have provided provide me with peace of mind... in other words, I know what to expect from TANE! (I never put too much in the beta-versions) --- I think the internet is great for one thing: knowledge, and good folks like yourself enlighting those who are curious! -- Anyhow, well, that's why I've been asking all of these questions of you, sir! --- Thanks a bunch! Ishie
norfolksouthern37
what's a normal map?
You just might have cause for concern except that TADD has other operations to perform; it isn't as if the sole purpose of the program is to 'phone home'. John very nicely described what it does above and it will still be operating at some percentage of your CPU even if your internet connection is completely severed.
BuilderBob
New member
Why do you think this is happening when TADDaemon is phoning home? Is there some problem with your internet connection that puts an enormous load on the CPU? The condition that you are showing looks a lot more like a asset validation running because the database is damaged (perhaps due to a disk error) than it looks like an internet connection problem.
First off, this version of TS12 never had any new items from the DLS installed and was validated only once when originally installing it. I use that version ONLY for testing new content, NOTHING else. The reason I was asking, I did not use this TS12 31688 for a couple of months as I did not look into my 3DS Max for the same period and hence never needed to install new created assets for testing. At that time, always being offline, TS12 started up straight away, opened menus/side tags straight away, was not clunky and when closing it without restarting windows was even faster as part of the memory was still filled with TS12 (as I understand this).
Recently, last week or so I got my Mojo back regarding 3DS Max creating, I created a new asset, started TS12 to install it for checking (while I was online) and suddenly all hell broke loose re validating hundreds of items plus repairing database (which never needed to be done before when offline) and giving me all sorts of errors. Once N3V Games fixed that server causing these troubles, I went online again to refix whatever needed to be fixed by validating and database repair again and TS12 came up clean (so to speak). I went permanent offline again but since then I have this clunky operating of TS12, lugging to open itself, CM, in Surveyor after placing a new asset just to turn such around the sun to check the effect of normal mapping, where it stops up to a minute or more until I can access any of the turn, delete, adjust height etc. icons. In other words not as smooth as I was used to operate TS12 before the great validating server hiccup a few days ago.
Any thoughts on that and THANK YOU for posting ALL your tips and informations for us mere mortals to learn from?
Cheers
VinnyBarb
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I had the same. It has to do with asset version checking. Yes there are components of TADDaemon that go out to the Trainz database on the DLS. This is also part of your logging in process. When it connects to the database, it's checking versions of your installed assets versus what the online database has. If there are updates available for download, it will update them. The problem last week was due to the so-called content "fixes" that were done. This caused the version checking and validation services to go haywire.
Tony actually mentioned this a page or two ago and now that I think about it, it makes perfectly sense. Even if you have a clean install, with just the basic built-in content installed, you'll see this occur as the versions are verified.
John
!had the same thing as Vinnybarb. I did a fresh install of SP$ fully patched and it was working well. I only added 2 routes, UMR2015 and PLL Potteries and was still ok.
After the trouble over the weekend when I tried to run it, it started validating after taking ages just to get a start screen. I left it alone to finish as there were a lot of assets from UMR. When I started it again took ages to load the start screen then when it started everything was running like a slide show.
My Pre SP1 runs really well with no stutter or lag, so it is not my system.
Anyway I binned SP4 for the third time and will not try again.
Cheers,
Mike
After the trouble over the weekend when I tried to run it, it started validating after taking ages just to get a start screen. I left it alone to finish as there were a lot of assets from UMR. When I started it again took ages to load the start screen then when it started everything was running like a slide show.
My Pre SP1 runs really well with no stutter or lag, so it is not my system.
Anyway I binned SP4 for the third time and will not try again.
Cheers,
Mike
TS12 still loads up yucky, chunky graphics. That problem sadly hasn't been resolved with the OS update. That's graphics throughput in the program its self.
John
I tried to take a logical approach to a problem and analyze the issue before screaming and yelling about it. Although, I have to admit that the screaming and yelling usually happens first before I sit down and pull the thing a part. The problem here is people have already made up their mind that the problem is network-related, but it's not directly. That issue is validation, downloading of database updates and data. The reset is local disk access. If the users spent some time watching their hard drive light they'll see what I'm talking about, or better yet load up Process Explorer from TechNet. That can load up graphs showing what's going on where and when.
John
John I have had TS12 just sitting on my comp the past three and a bit years doing nothing. Unusable for me. All the Service packs and updates fixing some things but breaking more....I have just given up . I use TRS2010 still and I hope TANE is every bit as good as some folks are saying it is. Changing all of Pofig's speedtrees because of an updated speedtree creation tool for TANE? Well that is just another nightmare.