Train dimensions etc

beavi501

New member
Hi i just started out with gmax but i am wondering how to go about creating real life Diesel Multiple Units, trains etc. Basicly i just want to know if there are any technical drawings available which have dimensions on them so that i could create a model from these.

Richard
 
Model Railroader Cyclopedia Vol 2 has at least 100 different diesel plans to HO scale. Lots of pictures as well. Think it runs about $75 or so but you might find a used one on e-bay.

Ben
 
DMUs are a bit modern for me but dig on the internet there are books around. What sort of time period are you looking at?

Are you thinking of using Blender or GMAX? Have you done any 3D CAD stuff before?

Cheerio John
 
type of CAD software

No not done CAD before starting to try use gmax but would like to maybe obtain technical drawings etc to work from. If i cannot find any that is fine i will try create something else
 
A loco is the most difficult thing to make. If your just starting out in Gmax may I respectfully (but strongly) suggest you pick something else for your first item? Also there are a goodly number of excellant tutorials available for download. You will have much better success if you run thru them first and then work your way up to a loco. In any event welcome to the wonderful world of Gmax and Trainz.

Ben

P.S. I've often wondered how many potential content creators have given up in disgust due to frustration because they tried to make a loco first.
 
No not done CAD before starting to try use gmax but would like to maybe obtain technical drawings etc to work from. If i cannot find any that is fine i will try create something else

Realistically I'd start with a basic van or wagon. They are fairly simple yet quite demanding. That will get you past the config.txt file side of it and how the attachment points work.

I'd also start in Blender not GMAX, its easier, fewer limitations with a slightly less steep learning curve. It doesn't have the same tutorials at the moment but there are a fair number around, and you can be useful and beta test what we are doing on the Blender project.

http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showthread.php?t=25255

If you're interested send me an email to jwhelan0112 gmail.com and we can discuss what sort of wagon / van you want to attempt, and how to tackle Blender. Most of my plans are UK. If you look at the web site below my name you can see the sort of thing we create.

After the wagon / van then I suggest moving on to coaches, DMUs etc.

Cheerio John
 
Thanks for input. I understand what you say about locos being very difficult so i will see if can find tutorials for building simple wagons first.
Richard
 
I would recommend going here http://www.worldoftrainz-downloads.com/~garyp/gmaxtutorials.htm and doing the multi-textured bok and lighted house tutorials first to get comfortable with G-max. Then I would go here http://tafweb-trainz.co.uk/tutorials.html and do the building tutorial to learn how to create more complicated structures and complex textures and the tree to focus more on using alpha textures. I would recommend creating your own texture for the building tutorial and follow plans for a building in the area you want to model. Then you'll have your own unique project, and not just a copy of someone elses work.
After a few buildings to practice, you should be comfortable enough with G-max to go to World of Trainz http://www.worldoftrainz.com/Pages/Tutorials.htm#TRS2004 and try the flat car tutorial. There are a lot of good tutorials here. Another good tutorial is Gerard's Simple Loco. http://publish.uwo.ca/~gerard/trainz/tutorials/
And if you get stuck on the WoT Bogey/Truck tutorial and can't get the wheels to turn, go here http://www.44090digitalmodels.co.uk/ and look at the "Primus" tutorial to get a different view on wheel animation.

:cool: Claude
 
I would recommend going here http://www.worldoftrainz-downloads.com/~garyp/gmaxtutorials.htm and doing the multi-textured bok and lighted house tutorials first to get comfortable with G-max. Then I would go here http://tafweb-trainz.co.uk/tutorials.html and do the building tutorial to learn how to create more complicated structures and complex textures and the tree to focus more on using alpha textures. I would recommend creating your own texture for the building tutorial and follow plans for a building in the area you want to model. Then you'll have your own unique project, and not just a copy of someone elses work.
After a few buildings to practice, you should be comfortable enough with G-max to go to World of Trainz http://www.worldoftrainz.com/Pages/Tutorials.htm#TRS2004 and try the flat car tutorial. There are a lot of good tutorials here. Another good tutorial is Gerard's Simple Loco. http://publish.uwo.ca/~gerard/trainz/tutorials/
And if you get stuck on the WoT Bogey/Truck tutorial and can't get the wheels to turn, go here http://www.44090digitalmodels.co.uk/ and look at the "Primus" tutorial to get a different view on wheel animation.

:cool: Claude

Good suggestions if you go the GMAX route but knowing the limitations of GMAX and after seeing many people give up in frustration, I think about 5% of the people who try GMAX actually end up creating something. Bob and Chris are just starting to use GMAX but its taken them probably five years to get were they are now and I think they are still on the fairly simple scenery stuff. I really think if you are starting fresh its better to go Blender.

Cheerio John
 
Start in Blender? Heck no. I started in gMax, I find it way easier to use and more practical. I could barely make anything to look a discus in Blender and thats simple to make.
 
Start in Blender? Heck no. I started in gMax, I find it way easier to use and more practical. I could barely make anything to look a discus in Blender and thats simple to make.

I'm not familiar with your work, I couldn't spot anything on the DLS, perhaps you could point me to some examples?

The issues are much more to do with the future. In comparison to Rail Simulator and other recent SIMs Trainz needs to use some advanced texture features such as texture baking which are not available through GMAX to let it compete with the other SIMs. You could purchase 3DS to get access to these features in Trainz but that is a trifle expensive.

There are quite a few things that the jet engine is capable of that the free GMAX is not capable of producing.

Creating in any 3D CAD environment is a major investment in time. If you are starting now then make the investment in Blender which is at least supported in Vista. Also I've seen the frustration that people go through learning GMAX. There is at least one major steam loco sitting on the DLS that has a very visible error in the drive wheels that suddenly appeared in GMAX and the creator has been unable to get rid of it. Personally I've had to start something over because an error has crept into my GMAX mesh more than once. Also there are exporters to other Train SIMs available for Blender should Trainz go under.

I'd like to see more high quality content on the DLS and Blender can use more of the Jet engine than GMAX ever could, besides still being in development. What I would prefer not to see is yet another person try GMAX and give up. That way we get no new content on the DLS.

Perhaps a comment from Paul Hobbs might help. "There you see the 'advantages' of working with software that is being actively developed... At least with GMax you don't have to worry about the tutorials getting out of date. Having said that I really think that Blender is the way forward."

Cheerio John
 
I use 3ds now. Check www.eastcoasttrainz.com forums. My stuff is all over the place.

Looks like we are agreed that GMAX is probably not the ideal way to go forward. Not all of us can afford 3ds which is why all the work on Blender has been taking place. Since you have been creating in 3ds why not drop a few items onto the DLS where they can be easily found?

Cheerio John
 
John,

I have been following the thread on using Blender and now have it running on my computer. Learning curve is steep, but I have worked thru several of the tutorials from the blender site. I think I am ready to create a simple piece of rolling stock such as a box car.

Are there any tutorials for the creation of a box car using this Blender? Or will the Gmax tutorial give me what I need?
 
John,

I have been following the thread on using Blender and now have it running on my computer. Learning curve is steep, but I have worked thru several of the tutorials from the blender site. I think I am ready to create a simple piece of rolling stock such as a box car.

Are there any tutorials for the creation of a box car using this Blender? Or will the Gmax tutorial give me what I need?

Basically what you need to do is create a box than add the attachment points. I'd create a simple box first, get it positioned the correct height above the track, put a texture on then add the attachment points. Once you have that working then go back and add detail.

Much of the process is the same, the need to do research, the need to plan / create a texture, the need to create or clone a config.txt file, I always clone a working one then modify it by the way.

Getting the texture applied in a way that works with the exporter seems to be the stumbling block at the moment for one or two people, including myself. I've done it twice now on the block and on the running number plane and they work fine but on a UK wagon I need buffers and I'm having a little difficulty putting the texture on them. Mind you I've been side tracked with the garden recently.

Currently as far as I am aware there are no Blender tutorials directly applicable to Trainz showing the attachment points yet, so I suggest using the simple loco tutorial to get the attachment point names and positions. You can use existing bogeys that have been created in GMAX or 3ds etc. Trainz doesn't care.

I'd also use the Blender notes in the wiki book on Trainz and post in the community blender exporter thread at the moment. We're at the stage where technically it works and some models have been created but we haven't built up a large body of expertise.

Have fun

Cheerio John
 
I'm not saying gMax is good. I wanted to be able to use the more available plug-ins, tools, if I didn't get 3ds I would hae preferred gMax over anything. Trust me I've tryed everything.
 
I'm not saying gMax is good. I wanted to be able to use the more available plug-ins, tools, if I didn't get 3ds I would hae preferred gMax over anything. Trust me I've tryed everything.

So what you are saying then is in your opinion people who are starting should go through the GMAX learning curve knowing that the product is limited and they will probably want to switch to something else later?

I used to use the words "Hello I'm a programmer and I'm here to help you. Trust me." when I went into a meeting sometimes to lighten the atmosphere.

Based on my own experience and working with a group of creators we've found that GMAX does odd things from time to time which leads to frustration. Especially when you modify an existing item that has unseen errors in the GMAX file. You have to know to avoid using mirror and a number of other features.

Currently we don't have the same tutorials for Blender in Trainz as exist for GMAX but there are good tutorials about the interface etc around and you don't need that many components of Blender to create a scenery object or rolling stock item. The basic problem is just working out which sub section you need.

I look forward to seeing your creations on the DLS.

Cheerio John
 
uk rolling stock & carriages (Information required)

I have started making basic rolling stock such as a basic flatcar. I would like to make more specific rolling stock ie. uk rolling stock working from technical drawings containing dimensions etc. could anyone tell me where i would find such information?
 
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