The hardest part of Surveyor: sitting people down!

[JonMyrlennBailey]

I like to use the station bench: it fits most of the various sitting people figures I use very well. However, if I try to put the sitting farmer figure in it, his butt is floating above the bottom of the bench. If I sit him lower, his boots sink into the train station platform.

I could raise the bench but then the feet of the bench would then be floating above the cement!

I don't mind if people's feet dangle above the ground while sitting upon station benches like those feet of the little Victorian boy and some short woman figures.

Trainz people-figures creators and those creators who make chairs and other seats for human sitting should get together and get some sort of scale standard between the two so people can fit on the furniture you are trying to seat them on.

My favorite figures of people in Trainz are: the farmers in blue overalls, Willie the Gimp (a driver figure), black people, porters, railroad workers, the two boys kicking the soccer ball back and forth, animated old ladies walking back and forth, soldiers, Victorian women, and the cowboys. The younger cowboys with mustaches look like the they have the face of Burt Reynolds. Those older cowboys with gray beards look like Kenny Rogers.

 

[captainkman]

Hold the Shift or Control button when adjusting the height of the figure to make it adjust in smaller increments. Both of those keys have their own increment.

Kieran.

 

[llebrez]

The problem for me is that when you want to adjust the height of the person, you also adjust the height of the platform (non spline platforms, of course). I takes some fiddling to adjust objects that are to go over these platforms.

 

[BuilderBob]

The problem for me is that when you want to adjust the height of the person, you also adjust the height of the platform (non spline platforms, of course). I takes some fiddling to adjust objects that are to go over these platforms.

Place the object on an open portion of the route, adjust the height, then move it onto the platform, bench etc. We badly need a height text box and height get/set tool in the advanced tab (like for splines) so that a bunch of assets can have their height set exactly before moving them into place.

 

[JonMyrlennBailey]

We also need a tool for minute movement of objects horizontally (x and y axes) along the map which numerical values could be punched in also.

Many building objects don't roll longways as to change pitch so they sink in on one end when put on a grade (sloped) surface.

Yes, some objects sink on splines like platforms so I have to place it on bare ground to make the initial height adjustment first or just hunt with my mouse to "dig" it out or blindly probe for it to raise it from underneath the concrete while in Height Adjust mode.

Grading unpaved (non-spline) sloping roadways or trails SMOOTHLY using various Topo tools continues to be a work of art seeming to require a master's degree in civil engineering or architecture. Of course, perfectly-level surfaces (track, splines, bare ground) are always much easier to work with in Surveyor.

 

[BuilderBob]

We also need a tool for minute movement of objects horizontally (x and y axes) along the map which numerical values could be punched in also.

No. You adjust objects in minute steps horizontally by simply clicking a fraction off the asset existing position. Then then jump to that new position. Much easier than dragging. If you still have problems your mouse sensitivity is set too high.

Many building objects don't roll longways as to change pitch so they sink in on one end when put on a grade (sloped) surface.

Objects like buildings should not roll - they should sink at one end. If the building does not extend far enough below ground level to be placed on a slope, then put it on a partially-sunk platform. If the asset should roll and currently does not allow rolling, that's a simple change to the config.

Yes, some objects sink on splines like platforms so I have to place it on bare ground to make the initial height adjustment first or just hunt with my mouse to "dig" it out or blindly probe for it to raise it from underneath the concrete while in Height Adjust mode.

Can't figure that one at all - you only need to find a bare patch of ground when objects that are logically connected are placed on top of each other and it becomes difficult to select a 'lower' object. That problem doesn't apply to splines because they will be in different layers.

 

[dnevans8]

This is one instance where the use of layers can be a big help. Once you have placed your stations create a new layer and make it the active layer. Place all your station furniture and people on that layer and when you want to adjust them later make their layer the active one and only those things on the layer will be selectable. You might need to place them away from the station initially so that you can adjust their height to be above the platform height.

This method can also be used for placing other objects close to or in buildings where adjusting there position once place is difficult.

 

[cascaderailroad]

Although tedious, I get them adjusted to 0.02 increments using shift/ctrl key. Sometimes you have to look directly straight down, or from a slight angle to get proper placements. If the track is on a gradient, you have to level the ground under the platform with a temporary piece of track, and smooth spline.

Improvements on TS12 are done, as it will be unsupported soon, and no more SP's will be released ... Doubtful any improvements will ever be done in T:ANE to adjust building/people heights.

Roll tags you can add to any static asset config file, but it will only roll in one direction, and not the other

height-range -5,5 (for +/- 5m height ... you can use any numeral)
rotate-yz-range -1,1 (for 1 degree of roll ... you can use any numeral)
rotstep 1 (for increments of 1 degree rotation ... you can use any numeral)

 

[llebrez]

Great! That is what I ended doing. And then you get everybody right at the proper position. One day.. You do (or is forced to do) an extended data base repair. And flop! some of the people sink or float. Same for some track assets, they displace slightly from were they were. And back to having fun.

Place the object on an open portion of the route, adjust the height, then move it onto the platform, bench etc. We badly need a height text box and height get/set tool in the advanced tab (like for splines) so that a bunch of assets can have their height set exactly before moving them into place.

 

[BuilderBob]

Great! That is what I ended doing. And then you get everybody right at the proper position. One day.. You do (or is forced to do) an extended data base repair. And flop! some of the people sink or float. Same for some track assets, they displace slightly from were they were. And back to having fun.

If the system tells you to do a database base repair there is a reason - something got corrupted. If something is changed after the repair then that is probably what got corrupted and needed repairing - your route in this case. There is no promise that the repair will succeed exactly, but a few misplaced items are probably preferable to going to a backup copy of your route.

 

[johnwhelan]

I like to use the station bench: it fits most of the various sitting people figures I use very well. However, if I try to put the sitting farmer figure in it, his butt is floating above the bottom of the bench. If I sit him lower, his boots sink into the train station platform.

I could raise the bench but then the feet of the bench would then be floating above the cement!

I don't mind if people's feet dangle above the ground while sitting upon station benches like those feet of the little Victorian boy and some short woman figures.

Trainz people-figures creators and those creators who make chairs and other seats for human sitting should get together and get some sort of scale standard between the two so people can fit on the furniture you are trying to seat them on.

My favorite figures of people in Trainz are: the farmers in blue overalls, Willie the Gimp (a driver figure), black people, porters, railroad workers, the two boys kicking the soccer ball back and forth, animated old ladies walking back and forth, soldiers, Victorian women, and the cowboys. The younger cowboys with mustaches look like the they have the face of Burt Reynolds. Those older cowboys with gray beards look like Kenny Rogers.

People come in different sizes and there are different bench heights. I suggest that if you wish things to match then you start here: https://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Trainz/Tutorial_for_Blender#Newcomers_start_here or one of the other fine Blender tutorials.

Cheerio John

 

[llebrez]

If the system tells you to do a database base repair there is a reason - something got corrupted. If something is changed after the repair then that is probably what got corrupted and needed repairing - your route in this case. There is no promise that the repair will succeed exactly, but a few misplaced items are probably preferable to going to a backup copy of your route.

I have not had a database repair in a long time. But one day you have to go away and close the program before the program closes properly: Next time you open it, there you have it. Normally no harm done, but since this is not an exact science, as you say, a few things could move. Picture this: I set my points a little back from the spline circle of the switch. I do this so some cars will not derail due to the switch changing or reverting to original state before the last car passes. My whole World is trouble free doing this. But after an extended data base repair, some of the points move to the exact center of the spline! And then you get the surprise of a last car derailing (You don't see the circle in driver, so the surprise comes after examining the point in surveyor). Hence I try not to do database repairs just in case.

 

[cascaderailroad]

I find that placing junction levers, right at the extreme outside of a turnout spline point (not on center), a little unbelievable, sounds like an urban legend, to me

 

[JonMyrlennBailey]

Sometimes I will put a spline down as a concrete slab as a station platform or a station parking lot. Sometimes ground needs to be tamped down under the spline surface so it does not protrude above it. Because I can't see the ground underneath a flat spline to gauge its depth, often this tamping with Topo Plateau or Topo Down functions will leave deep 'sink holes' under the spline that are not visible when the spline is covering them up. Putting people, dogs, static vehicles, porter carts, etc. on slabs over these hidden sink holes will cause them to sink below the slab and sink low enough so they are invisible from the top if the sink hole is deep enough. Static objects normally like to attach themselves to the ground surface or train board, and will even penetrate the surfaces of splines to do so, unless they are certain objects like 'platform people' that tend to hover above the ground (train board) by default.

 

[JCitron]

Sometimes I will put a spline down as a concrete slab as a station platform or a station parking lot. Sometimes ground needs to be tamped down under the spline surface so it does not protrude above it. Often this will leave deep 'sink holes' under the spline that are not visible when the spline is covering them up. Putting people, dogs, static vehicles, porter carts, etc. on slabs over these hidden sink holes will cause them to sink below the slab and sink low enough so they are invisible from the top if the sink hole is deep enough. Static objects normally like to attach themselves to the ground surface or train board, and will even penetrate the surfaces of splines to do so, unless they are certain objects like 'platform people' that tend to hover above the ground (train board) by default.

This is quite annoying and one of the reasons why it's not always good to tamp the ground underneath if you don't have to. For thick surfaces, I use a modified YARN Road. I disabled the traffic and changed the textures to Andi06's Cobblestones. This is thick enough to run tracks through if I want buried tracks in the surface and thick enough too to work like a cellar under the buildings and other things I need to boost up. When placing objects on a spline, I will adjust them elsewhere and then move them into place. I just wish, and we've asked for this more than a couple of times in the past, for the option to lock the height of fixed objects once and apply that to a bunch of assets or to a group of assets. This will save time when we need to adjust a group of people or anything else.

User Scottish made some groups of people that are made up of the same people that appear on our platforms. There is a bug with Trainz though which makes them a pain to use. If you need to move them, you need to undo then redo to get them to display in their new position. The assets work fine otherwise, it's just the adjustment thing that's a pain.

John

 

[JonMyrlennBailey]

The trouble with adjusting some objects off the spline, John, is that, unless the spline is perfectly level, zero slope, the height of the people (or cars) may vary depending upon where they are to be placed on the spline. The spline may be a graded or sloped platform (or parking lot), higher at one end and lower at the opposite. The people (or vehicles) along the length of the platform ( or lot) will have varying heights where their shoe soles (or tire treads) touch the cement surface.

I just place on object on the platform and if it does not appear right after the mouse click to place it, I know it is buried below. I just use the mouse pointer to probe for it (fish for it???) and drag it upward on Adjust Height. Kind of like a soldier probing for buried land mines with his bayonet in the ground. With practice this has not been too hard for me to do.

When viewing the map in the grid-lines mode (wireframe view), you can see things buried underneath the ground surface unless a spline surface, like a thick slab, is covering them up. I have seen at least one tree completely buried on a particular Trainz route that was left there by the route's original creator inadvertently by accident.

Building a train station or a freight loading platform on a graded portion of track has its own special considerations. Ideally, we would like to build a station on level ground if we could. Those train stations with the track piece built in and the passenger animation only work on level track/level ground since their is no roll adjustment for them. Many also have no height adjustment. They and some steam engine water tanks have spline points to become joined to and integrated with the main line's track.

 

[cascaderailroad]

For the most part, prototype train stations sit on pretty much level ground, so in Trainz, where an animated asset (stations, water towers, coaling towers) that has built-in track spline point junctions, that area should be leveled flat.

I really never had any problem with assets heights and gradients

See my route: https://www.cubbyusercontent.com/pli...95884a3ed12789

 

[JCitron]

There is no way to grab the buried asset other than fishing for it under the splines.

Cascaderailroad, who has now moved to Wales from the Antarctica because his iceberg melted, is right. Most stations are on the level ground anyway so your ground under the splines should be level underneath.

 

[cascaderailroad]

You can use wireframe mode, but a buried asset will usually not affect framerates ... In the TC1&2 Harlem Line, a house sits right on the tracks, near the end of the line.

Summers in Llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwyrndrobwllllantysiliogogogoch are warmer, and it is easier to speel

It is approaching Spring in Antarctica, but no Daffydill's are popping up

 

[JCitron]

Here's a place to fit on one of those name signs.

Lake Char­gogg­a­gogg­man­chaugg­a­gogg­chau­bun­a­gung­a­maugg.