Session vs. Route - Confusing

[sniper297]

Only real pitfall I see to the "edit route from session" is the fact that doing it that way you start out in the session layer instead of the route layer. As long as you're aware of it I don't see it as a major problem. In fact if the "Edit Route" button actually does create a new empty session each time, I use the "junction direction" tool to change the default switch direction so it don't automatically divert me off the mainline into a spur at 60mph if I save the route and not the session - and the settings I just made for the switches are in the session layer - that would explain why I keep running into dead end junctions at 60mph and wondering why the default switch settings don't "stick".

 

[schweitzerdude]

In response to colourlight -post #29

I never go to "edit route". Been down that road early on to my regret. I always go to my newest session, then edit session in surveyor, and then first thing select the route layer. I believe we can agree that this is "best practice", especially if you plan to have only one session for that route.

The problem is that, as sniper297 said, and I agree, is that at times (in TS2010) the "save" and "save as" do not work as expected and present options that are "grayed out". This is not due to user inexperience or user error, it is a software bug. I believe that good software design dictates that the options for "save" and "save as" should be the same at all times - I don't care whether you have changed your route, your session, both, or neither.

 

[sniper297]

Here's the main stumbling block I keep tripping over;

Editing the route via "Edit Session" choosing the main session, I change the junction directions so they're all straight on this line, then merge session layer into route layer and save - this time all the switches are straight. Okay, so set up a test session with a scoot, save as "straight", now change the junctions to a zigzag pattern so the switches will alternate back and forth from the outer main to the middle and back. Try to save as, get the "new route and session" with the option to just save the session grayed out. Is it possible to have more than one default switch direction setup in different sessions on the same route?

 

[celje]

...In fact if the "Edit Route" button actually does create a new empty session each time, I use the "junction direction....

sniper
It does not create a new empty session (see A1.1,#5. mark ''Do not save Session'')

regards
celje

 

[pware]

sniper
It does not create a new empty session (see A1.1,#5. mark ''Do not save Session'')

This is where there is confusion over the terminology.

Sniper297 is correct when he says that Edit Route creates a new blank session every time. He means that any session-layers you may have already created in the Layers tool will be deleted and replaced by a new "session-layer" that will be empty. Of course that new session-layer will not be saved (and your original session destroyed) if you select the "Do not save session" option. But this, to me, is an added complication to the process that can easily go wrong if you forget to set the "Do not save session" option.

Peter Ware

 

[celje]

Hello pware

I said a couple of times, working with layers demand precision ( accuracy, exactitude), one wrong step and all is gone.

regards
celje

 

[pware]

After only a few days I received a response to my help desk ticket on this issue. Specifically I mentioned the confusion that the Edit Route and Edit Session options are causing and suggested that removing the Edit Route option might eliminate this confusion.

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The 'Edit Route' option is intended to allow the route to be edited, without modifying the sessions associated with the route. This also ensures that all modifications to the route are in the Route Layers, rather than the Session Layers (Surveyor will automatically select the session layer when using the 'create'/'edit' session options).

You may find that, when you save, you are asked to save a session. In most cases, overwriting the session will be fine (or not saving the session at all). This occurs because some objects in the route layers (mainly industries, but may also include other scripted objects) will save their settings to the Session. If you have not modified these settings, then you do not need to save the session.

To remove one or the other would lead to more confusion, since people would either be saving consists to their routes (these would appear in *ever* session then), or will be modifying their route in the session layer (any items in the session layer would then only appear in that particular session).

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I think, and I stand to be corrected, that this means you can use Edit Route provided you do not alter anything in the session layers and/or do not save or overwrite the session. The problem here, of course, is that it is not always obvious, without opening the Layers tools, what is in a route-layer and what is in a session-layer. That problem has been a theme of other threads.

The last paragraph confirms some of the discussion that has occurred in this and another thread.

Peter Ware