Session rules - No description provided.

S

sniper297

Coconut God
I keep running into this, even the built in rules have a zillion lists of - well, stuff, sometimes the name gives a vague hint what it's for, but usually not. None of them come with instructions that I can find, usually it's just guessing or hunting around the internet to find a rule you had all along will do what you want if you know how to use it.

Tutorials exist here and there for some rules, what I want ot know is there a plain list somewhere of all the available rules with a brief description of what each one is supposed to do?
 
I am with you on this! Come on creators, at least include a read me file, in addition to the description, which should be mandatory. Come on Son!

Johnny
 
Yeah, I was griping about the clumsy tedious interface for adding instructions to AI trains - I REALLY REALLY miss the MSTS 2D map with its simple path editor - and Hert said;

"There is a way in trainz so that you only have to create a list of schedules then do "drive schedule". This way you dont need to create a billion different instructions for each train you can create it once then use it over and over again."

I've SEEN the "Drive Schedule" in the list, but since the AI trains are already on a schedule what's the point? Apparently there is a point, just gotta figure out what it really does and how to use it. I tried "Copy commands from" a couple times, never got it to work consistently. There are also rules that seem to be for the same thing, like "drive via" and "navigate via", "uncouple" and "uncouplez", what's the difference? Somebody must know what all these are and how to use them, a lot of them are built in.
 
Perhaps an easier moan is about the dark blue/green message background with black text. It seems perverse.

Somebody adopts a rule that "sounds" like it should do their task. They adopt it and by muddling around they get it right and thus recommend it for the next person that has a similar need. Then the cycle repeats with the next user spending their time decoding the intent and process.

There are many "things" in Trainz that are a mystery of either a lack of instructions or an appearance that only make you wonder what planet some came from. Wierd textures, low resolution assets, non-textured locomotives and totally saturated colors that really belong on a carnival poster. The "rules" are just one component where some talented person produced something that many cannot use.
 
Ain't it the truth. Well, I took a squint, there are several BMP files you can hack to change assorted buttons and the launcher screen, but that drab blue background for everything must be in one of the DLL files. Can't really get irritated about that at the moment, too busy being irritated by "Unable to plot route - junction is missing lever". Got a dozen AI trains running, WHO is unable to plot route? Sound off like you got a pair, all the other messages say the name of the driver or consist, why are you so bashful? Find the one that's stopped, check all the switches ahead of him, no missing levers that I can see. Manually set all the switches to his next marker for him and he still sits there, gotta order him to "continue schedule", now the imaginary missing lever is okay and he does what he shoulda done by himself. :sleep:
 
I will cook up some tutorials for you sniper. I will send them your way what format do you prefer?

hert:wave:
 
Hi Jim
It should give you a driver name next to the 'message'. You can then use the driver name to work out which driver is stuck. If it's not, then look in the driver list on the left for a driver with a '!' icon on their driver image.

For the rules, I'll see if I can get a copy of the old TRS2006 session and rules guide put onto one of the servers. It is old, but it does explain a few of the basic rules, and how to use them.

For the session rule, I've not really used this (apart from setting up an in-game timetable for me to follow when driving a prototype route at an exhibition - not really what you've got in mind!).

As to the duplicate driver commands... Some of these are simply duplicate rules made by different creators, and used by different session creators. Others are 'similar but different' commands.

For example 'Drive to' will tell a driver to drive from it's current location to a specific industry/trackmark. However, it will simply take the most direct route to the location, and complain if that doesn't work. It's easy for them to get lost, and go some odd directions because of this.

The 'navigate to' command will tell the driver to go from the current location to a specific industry/trackmark, however it will navigate using a more logical (hopefully) route. In theory, it should try to go around signals and junctions that it can't use when it plots it's route.

(If I've mixed the above up, I will correct it - I'll leave a note if I have corrected it :) ).

Uncouple and Uncouplez use slightly different methods to uncouple wagons. The first case can't be added from Surveyor, as it gives you a list of the current wagons in the train, which can't be read from Surveyor. It also won't work if you change the makeup of the train before the command comes into effect. Uncouplez simples uncouples vehicle # from the train (e.g. uncouple vehicle 5 - what vehicle this is may change throughout the session, hence you need to keep track of the makeup of your train when using this!). Hence it doesn't actually need to know what vehicles are in the train, and will work from within Surveyor. Both are useful rules, with the first being suited for use when you simply want to give commands as you go from within Driver.

If you are unsure about a specific rule or command, drop a post on the forums to find out what it does and how to use it.
 
How to use Schedule Rule

It seems very straightforward to me, therefore it must be very simple!:hehe: .

In the "Driver Schedule" Rule, make a new set of commands and save them under any name.

Then in Driver, insert the "Copy Commands From" command, and pick your set of commands from the pop-out menu.

The trick is to insert a Wait command before the Copy Commands From, or it might skip over them. I'm now also in the habit of putting in a Wait For command as the first command of the Schedule.

In a route where a lot of trains make the same journey, it saves a lot of time spent entering commands.

HTH,
Mick Berg.
 
but i cant evun SPEL roquett psyantist!

Might seem simple to you, but with no directions on use anyone who never used it before has to fiddlefaddle to see what does what.

51695578.jpg


This is the thing Dick was talking about BTW, for us old geezers squinting thru our greasy bifocals there just ain't enough contrast here. There needs to be SOME way to change the background color on all these menus. I'm GUESSING (lot of that in the absence of any instructions) you assign a set of navigate commands to a specific driver, then either assign that driver to the consists you want to drive that route and/or use copy commands from and pick that driver name? The styles are also a bit cryptic, "If there is a schedule running" is this intended to be used in surveyor to set up a session, or during a session to change something on the fly?

Lesssee, who else is in here, Zec, no, happened to two consists at different times, neither one prefaced the mayday call with his name, and looking to see who had a ! in the F6 driver list was the first thing I tried, wasn't there. In one case it actually was a missing junction lever, 44088 has a nasty habit of sometimes moving the closest switch lever instead of placing a new one when I make a new switch near an old one.

"The 'navigate to' command will tell the driver to go from the current location to a specific industry/trackmark, however it will navigate using a more logical (hopefully) route. In theory, it should try to go around signals and junctions that it can't use when it plots it's route"

I've been using Navigate To and Navigate Via simply because those are checked on by default, worst trouble for a long route I need 50-60 red triangles with all their associated trackmarks, and that blasted GUI interface makes it a long and tedious process. And having the little beasts pick their own route usually means diverge at every opportunity, see a crossover use a crossover to the wrong way track leading to a head on standoff with the guy who stayed on the correct track. Logic is often screwy too;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xJb_8UywoRA

I realize they call this type of thing "puzzle switches" for a reason, but the hither and yon logic is over the top. Also some type of rule that would make them wait a couple minutes at a red instead of trying to go around the signal immediately would eliminate the need for many many trackmarks. Even absent any other traffic, the route origin is USA which I presume means right hand running, but I've seen AI trains take a crossover to the left track merely because that being the wrong track means it's not signaled in that direction. Eliminate the right to left crossovers leaving only the left to right crossovers and the little screwball stops, changes direction, backs thru the left to right crossover onto the wrong track, then changes direction again to run forward on the left track simply because it has less signals facing toward him.

"What format", whatever everybody can read without needing microsoft office or other exotic stuff - RTF, PDF, HTML.
 
Zec Murphy said:
Hi Jim

For the rules, I'll see if I can get a copy of the old TRS2006 session and rules guide put onto one of the servers. It is old, but it does explain a few of the basic rules, and how to use them.
Click to expand...
I have to agree with Sniper, I am fed up of trying to interpret rules to see if they are what I need because of the lack of documentation. There should be a "standard" that if you post a rule then part of the D/L should be some document with at least a description of what the asset does and how to use it. For this reason I have been using SCS 2006 to script my own scenarios - it works well, it has a manual and examples. It is such a shame that multiplayer TS10 and TS12 cannot use this. I have gone back to 44088 until this is fixed.
 
Reminds me, I've gotten two different stories on this;

http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showthread.php?t=74143

A session rule needs a special tag to automatically add itself to the KUID table so that custom rules get automatically downloaded with the session. No it doesn't, any custom rule should automatically add itself to the KUID table for the session.

Whichever one is true it ain't happening here, I either gotta hack the config.txt to add the rule to the KUID table manually or post some kind of notice that the rule has to be downloaded manually. And it has to be done last thing before packaging, if you add the KUID for a rule manually it's listed as a dependency, if you edit the session in surveyor and save the changes it gets removed from the KUID table. How the hell anyone can say this is not a bug is beyond my comprehension, session needs rule to work correctly, rule not in KUID table doesn't get downloaded automatically with session, seven come eleven roll the dice if you already have the needed rules installed it works, otherwise sorry about your luck?
 
It appears from looking at several built-in rules, the colors used by the rule are defined in the script of the rules. Some could be changed if you are familiar with trainzscript, others the script is encrypted.

William
 
If you want to see the use of the schedule rule and schedule library I'd suggest getting the umr 2010 megaroute and a session called Millhurst Drop Off by william 0d0. Best to check it out in 2010.
He has set up schedules for trains serving many industry and many passenger routes. Using an copy from command you can append a schedule to any trains schedule.
Once you make a session with the library set up it can be used as a base and you don't have to rebuild the library for every new session. You just start with the base, rename and save as a new session.

Rob
 
sniper297 said:
Might seem simple to you, but with no directions on use anyone who never used it before has to fiddlefaddle to see what does what.
Click to expand...
Sorry, didn't mean to sound patronizing. When you've been doing Trainz as long as I have,:o you begin to get used to how things work, silliness included.

I absolutely agree that the black text on dark green background is ridiculous. I believe it can be globally changed but I'm not sure how.

Believe me, my bi-focals are every bit as greasy as yours!:hehe:

Mick Berg.
 
If I could only see well enough to find the Windex I could clean them enough to look for the Windex. :hehe: Not really patronizing, more like I walked into the middle of the movie and people are trying to explain what's going on while assuming that I saw the beginning. :confused:

Thanks Hert, downloading now. Other strange observations, rules Vs Commands Vs Scripts.

Slippery definitions - difference between "commands" and "rules", some commands are classified as rules in content mangler, others are commands apparently built into the standard default driver command rule. "Couple at Trackmark" is classified as a script, trying to find it under category "rules" is an excercise in futility.

List of commands built into default driver commands rule;

Autopilot command - ?

bellz - commands AI to start and stop ringing the bell.
Useage, place trackmark 1 at west end of yard, trackmark 2 at east end, add command to westbound train;
navigate via trackmark 2
bellz
navigate via trackmark 1
bellz
it toggles on and off, so that set would cause him to start his bell as he passes 2 and stop as he passes 1.

Change destination sign - dunno, I assume for passenger trains which have destination sign scripts.

Change direction command - what it sounds like. My current WIP has a bilevel push-pull commuter train that starts in the downtown station, runs forward to the end of the line, then gets the command to wait 1 minute, change direction, run the route back into the city in reverse.

Closenose - ?

Copy commands from - still sherlocking this one, but I have set up one AI train with a series of navigate instructions, then told the following AI train to copy commands from #1, and that works for preset AI trains. Dunno about trains spawned from portals, haven't tried it yet. Options are append and insert, haven't tried insert yet.

Couple - ?

Daylights - ?

Decouple - ?

Drive MC TramRoute - ? Presumably this is a "schedule rule library" for the tram route.

Drive schedule - been trying to understand this one, I keep getting partial information that assumes I even know where to start.

Drive to

Drive to trackmark

Drive via trackmark - been using navigate, need to find out exactly how these are different, why and when they should be used instead of navigate.

EW-Time and weather change - ?

Headlights on/off - ?

Hornz - similar to bellz, except it's a play one shot rather than toggle on/off. For grade crossings you need 4 trackmarks, tinker with the distances. Navigate via 1,2,3,4 with hornz commands following each navigate via trackmark;

Navigate via trackmark 1
Hornz
Hornz
Hornz
Navigate via trackmark 2
Hornz
Hornz
Hornz
Navigate via trackmark 3
Hornz
Navigate via trackmark 4
Hornz
Hornz
Hornz

Space about 50 yards apart, depending on speed, the triple hornz commands will sound like a long blast so you get the standard long-long-short-long for grade crossings.
I've played with this but not seriously, for one thing all the US grade crossings I've tried produce phantom crossing bells in odd places nowhere near any grade crossing, and adding all those commands is too much like work when you're still trying to dope out the navigation problems.

Instant load - I assume this differs from load in that the AI will load instantly rather than taking its time, haven't played with interactives much.

Load - see above, probably what it sounds like. Don't see much use except of trains with actual visible loads.

Locomotive start or shut down command - ?

Move to train -?

Navigate to - I use this for final destination portals, I think it's also for industries.

Navigate to trackmark - I use this for trackmarks at passenger stations or anywhere I want the train to stop. Navigate to trackmark station 1, Wait for 1 minute, then the next command.

Navigate via trackmark - difference from navigate to trackmark is it doesn't momentarily stop at the trackmark.

Notify - I use this for troubleshooting when running multiple AI trains, navigate via trackmark 43, 44, 45, notify, 46, 47, etc. Got the F7 announcement window open while running the session, the guy will announce having passed trackmark 45.

Openose -?

Pantograph state - ?

Pantz - no, I just checked, I remembered to put mine on.

Path command - ?

Razorback drive to - ?

Release junction - ?

Run around - ?

Run around Ex - ?

STW drive - ?

Terminate passenger train - ?

Uncouplez - ?

Uncouplez from - makes the AI uncouple from car number specified in the command, options are 0-20, with zero being the first car or loco behind the lead loco. Got a 2 unit MU or steamer with tender, Uncouplez from 1 will uncouple behind the second unit or tender.


Unload - presumably the opposite of load.

WaitFor - Specify a time period you want the AI to wait before executing the next command. Example navigate to trackmark station 1, wait for 20 seconds, navigate to trackmark station 2, wait for 20 seconds, etc.


Wait for trigger - ?

Wait until -?

Wait until minute - ?
 
I will try to help, my comments are in blue.
sniper297 said:
Autopilot command - Same as clicking drive but can be put into a driver command.

bellz - commands AI to start and stop ringing the bell.
Useage, place trackmark 1 at west end of yard, trackmark 2 at east end, add command to westbound train;
navigate via trackmark 2
bellz
navigate via trackmark 1
bellz
it toggles on and off, so that set would cause him to start his bell as he passes 2 and stop as he passes 1. (Correct you can use trackmarks to singnal bellz instead of a actual command like bell is.)

Change destination sign - dunno, I assume for passenger trains which have destination sign scripts. (Correct)
Change direction command - what it sounds like. My current WIP has a bilevel push-pull commuter train that starts in the downtown station, runs forward to the end of the line, then gets the command to wait 1 minute, change direction, run the route back into the city in reverse. (Correct, used for terminals)
Closenose - ? (No idea here)
Copy commands from - still sherlocking this one, but I have set up one AI train with a series of navigate instructions, then told the following AI train to copy commands from #1, and that works for preset AI trains. Dunno about trains spawned from portals, haven't tried it yet. Options are append and insert, haven't tried insert yet. (My tutorial covers this one)

Couple - ? (Can only use for whats on the map) For example say you have a train that spawns at a portal. It spawns travels to a local yard and drop 3 cars. Lets say you have a shunter train in the yard, it cannot use this command to couple to those 3 cars as they were not on the map in surveyor. You also must know the exact name of the car you want to couple.

Daylights - I believe this makes the AI use headlights in the daytime.

Decouple - Same as couple but to decouple (see above)

Drive MC TramRoute - ? Presumably this is a "schedule rule library" for the tram route. Yes, Modula City Tram Library

Drive schedule - been trying to understand this one, I keep getting partial information that assumes I even know where to start. Drives a defined schedule. I would say this is obsoleted with "copy commands from"
 command.

Drive to (Obsoleted command was used in 2006 and below) Should use navigate to...If I remember right AI will find the shortest way to a point and will not redo there route usually causing havoc with more AI trains.

Drive to trackmark (Obsolete command) See above

Drive via trackmark - been using navigate, need to find out exactly how these are different, why and when they should be used instead of navigate.
(Obsolete command) See above
EW-Time and weather change - Ability to change time and weather (This was before their was a Quickdrive)

Headlights on/off - ? (Usually used for AI's to turnoff headlights)

Hornz - similar to bellz, except it's a play one shot rather than toggle on/off. For grade crossings you need 4 trackmarks, tinker with the distances. Navigate via 1,2,3,4 with hornz commands following each navigate via trackmark;

Navigate via trackmark 1
Hornz
Hornz
Hornz
Navigate via trackmark 2
Hornz
Hornz
Hornz
Navigate via trackmark 3
Hornz
Navigate via trackmark 4
Hornz
Hornz
Hornz

Space about 50 yards apart, depending on speed, the triple hornz commands will sound like a long blast so you get the standard long-long-short-long for grade crossings.
I've played with this but not seriously, for one thing all the US grade crossings I've tried produce phantom crossing bells in odd places nowhere near any grade crossing, and adding all those commands is too much like work when you're still trying to dope out the navigation problems.

It also plays a longer blast then the regular "horn" command

Instant load - I assume this differs from load in that the AI will load instantly rather than taking its time, haven't played with interactives much.

This is usually used with spawn portal trains. It instantly loads the first product in there config. (Does not need to be by an industry)

Load - see above, probably what it sounds like. Don't see much use except of trains with actual visible loads.

Must have a "Navigate to" command prior to it. It loads what ever industry and car are set up for. I.E. log wagon at the local forestry.
Locomotive start or shut down command - ? Special command used for Phil_C locos. See built-in SD70. Turns off or on the engine

Move to train -? Moves a driver to a loco that doesnt have a driver.

Navigate to - I use this for final destination portals, I think it's also for industries. Correct used to go to industry, station, or portal

Navigate to trackmark - I use this for trackmarks at passenger stations or anywhere I want the train to stop. Navigate to trackmark station 1, Wait for 1 minute, then the next command. (Correct used to go and stop then follow next order)

Navigate via trackmark - difference from navigate to trackmark is it doesn't momentarily stop at the trackmark. (Correct)
Notify - I use this for troubleshooting when running multiple AI trains, navigate via trackmark 43, 44, 45, notify, 46, 47, etc. Got the F7 announcement window open while running the session, the guy will announce having passed trackmark 45.

Yes or if your doing a session as "dispatcher" you may want to be notify where different trains are.

Openose -? (No idea)
Pantograph state - ? (Tells the AI where you want the Pant to be, AI default setting is pant is up)

Pantz - no, I just checked, I remembered to put mine on. (Same as above)

Path command - ? (Special SenCity 2006 command)

Razorback drive to - ? (Special RazorBack route drive command)

Release junction - ? (More less obsolete tells the AI to release junction. Was used primarily used because once a pre-2009 AI had plotted a route it would lock all junctions)

Run around - ? Unhooks the engines are runs around train hooking up to the last car.

Run around Ex - ? Not sure how this is different from above

STW drive - ? No idea

Terminate passenger train - ? Unloads all passengers at a terminal, used at a terminal where its the "last stop"

Uncouplez - ? Uncouples the engine from the rollingstock, dont need to know the rollingstock names and dont have to be on the map.

Uncouplez from - makes the AI uncouple from car number specified in the command, options are 0-20, with zero being the first car or loco behind the lead loco. Got a 2 unit MU or steamer with tender, Uncouplez from 1 will uncouple behind the second unit or tender.

Can tell it where to cut it off, Its best for trains that drop a few cars in a yard.

Unload - presumably the opposite of load. (Correct)
WaitFor - Specify a time period you want the AI to wait before executing the next command. Example navigate to trackmark station 1, wait for 20 seconds, navigate to trackmark station 2, wait for 20 seconds, etc.

(Correct)
Wait for trigger - ? Waits until trigger to do what ever commands are after it.

Wait until -? I believe waits until a specific time to do commands after it.

Wait until minute - ? You set a minute time and it will wait until taht minute to do what ever commands are after it. For example maybe its set for passenger train that goes to a station then waits till whatever the time is till :15 minutes after the hour.
Click to expand...

Rules are things added to the session ie driver setup, driver commands etc.
Commands are things the driver can do, ie drive, load, navigate to. etc.
Scripts are pretty much everything else, ie ARN, loading animation etc.

Hope this helps,

hert:wave:
 
Last edited:
Okay, all that makes sense except the first one;

Autopilot command - Same as clicking drive but can be put into a driver command

What's the point? Give an AI train, either physically placed or spawned from a portal, a series of commands and it follows those commands. Technically the AI engineer IS an autopilot, he needs an autopilot so he can sleep on the job? :hehe:

The rest of it clears a lot of confusion, I've heard that some of these are obsolete but not which ones. "Couple at trackmark" is the one I was using for my experimental route "Yardwork" with the "Marathon" session, a train spawned from a portal navigates to a trackmark, Uncouplez from 1, then runs to another portal to leave. Another train spawns and executes Couple at trackmark and hauls that string of cars away to go into another portal. Except now it's not working, there was apparently an update to Couple at trackmark and the new one gives me script errors.
 
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