Save, Save As, Session Ruined!

[nicky9499]

Here's another headache TS12 gave me last night.

Overview. Basically, my Base session was broken; it contained track in it's session layer which I later fixed on the route layer and thus cannot be used as all the track in there is messed up, again another TS screwup but that's a different story. So to fix this, since my Intro session was nicely done, logically what anybody would have done is just delete that session layer, leaving a blank session layer, then save it over the messed up Base session. How hard can it be, right? Yea, this is TS12.

1. Save Route and Intro session
2. Delete Session layer
3. Save As Route and Base session*

See the star there? That's where TS12 fk-ed up. The only software in the world I know of, where Save As is the same as Save! When I tried to Save As, it asked me if I would like to create a new route and session. Why, no thank you but I doesn't seem like you're leaving me any choice. If I did proceed, I figured that'd just mean I'd have 2 copies of the route with the new Base session in the latter, to fix this one would just edit the config file to point the Base session back to the original route.

BUT NO.

The routes menu only shows ONE of my route, and in that route are Base and Intro sessions. But get this; the Base session still has the rules from the Intro session (this is correct, since all I did was delete all the stuff on session layer) but the Intro session - which should've been UNTOUCHED after I did the Save in step 1, is now devoid of all trains, trackmarks, triggers and invisible signals etc. How the hell did this happen?

Okay, so I calmed down, immediately quit Trainz and dived straight into the UserData/Backups folder and pulled out Intro session's backup.
I don't know what to do now, but in order not to klutz things up even more and try to bring back my Intro session, I thought I'd ask you guys for help.

Nicholas

 

[nicky9499]

Mmm, anybody? I have the backup sitting on the desktop but am not sure if I should import that for fear that it may overwrite something that I can restore.

 

[shaneturner12]

I've a feeling that deleting the Session layer caused some of your problems...

Shane

 

[nicky9499]

Hi Shane,

Yes, I intentionally deleted the session layer before this happened, that much is apparent. What I don't understand is why this should affect the Intro session when I Saved As new Base session after deleting said session layer. This does not make sense at all. It's as though TS12 took my Save As command and went to Save over my Intro session anyway.
Anyway, TS12's bullsh!t aside, what I'd now like to do is to have my session back and delete all the session trains and trackside objects to get back an empty Base session.

Nicholas

 

[shaneturner12]

It's partly due to the way that KUIDs work - if it's the same name, the map-kuid entry in the session gets changed to the new route.

However, you should get it back if you import the backup CDP files.

Shane

 

[stagecoach]

Save will overwrite the saved route and session and keep the same kuids. Save as will save as a new route and session with new kuids. I would check CMP to see if you have two routes with the same name but different kuid numbers. The intro session will be linked to the older route and not the newly saved route. Check the map kuid in the intro session to that of the now new route kuid.

 

[clam1952]

Don't forget the backup folders, it's probably in there.

 

[llebrez]

I have been fighting this for a long time. Somewhere I read that the new SP's would solve this as the "save or overwrite session" is not a true thing and was flawed. But after several tests, things are the same. All I know is that N3V is aware of the problem. To compound the absurdity, the mess happens only in splines. Objects saved in a route, show up in the session, if you add or modify a spline in the session, "save it" it may not show in the route, and if you add splines or modify existing ones in route, it will tangle the session. It can be fixed but it takes a long time and you have to re-do things. Verdict : Is no good!

 

[nicky9499]

It is indeed no good and is another one of the many stupid things in TS12 that trips up the unaware user and causes a big headache wasting alot of time. In this particular case there is a workaround that I can think of.

1. Save Abc session.
2. Export to CDP.
3. Delete session layer and Save As
4. Reinstall Abc session CDP and overwrite.

It is not too different from my re-importing the session from backup folders. Thank goodness that worked otherwise I might've totally lost heart to continue and left Trainz for abit.

 

[llebrez]

That is a lot of hassle, but it may be the only way. Now do this: Install some building or tree in a route. Save it. It says "Overwrite existing route and.." and you have only one choice: "Do not save session" You save it. Now open your session of this route and see if the changes are there. Chances are that the tree or building is there! But it said "Do not save session" ! Then you change something is the session and save it. Now the window is the same as before but it adds "Overwrite existing session" and "create new session". Careful here: If you overwrite, your change may show in the route, but if what you made was a spline, it will not. Then you go to the route and make or modify a spline. This will mess the session and there will be splines all over the place. Hours playing with this and things get more complicated, because if you delete the splines, you may lose them in the map too! As I say: No good

 

[nicky9499]

Hi llebrez,

What you mention, a similar issue caused the need for me to re-create the Base session in the first place. What happened was some track was added accidentally to the Base session layer instead of the route layer. Then while editing Intro session, I noticed track was not there (thought route didn't save) so I added the tracks again, this time in route layer. This means I cannot open Base session any more because doing so would screw up the route (track splines in same location on both route and session layer).

 

[llebrez]

I am sure somebody may say "You don't know what you're doing...". If so, I challenge anyone to write proper and detailed complete instructions on the subject.