Not satisfied with Auran's Support .

know you didn't leeferr nor did i, i only stated to get up and have a go at life which was meant to all who sit on there butt and ask why why and not just one nation going through hard times.

but i did after aardvark1 did

aard might have something caught in his vark1, i don't know

and yes it is far more important to put food in mouths than play computer games

but the fact is that people today are spending more time in front of the computer or game console and not worring about the things they should be worring about.
and this is what game companies would like you to do, but it's not there fault its your responseablity
steve
 
I think, IMHO, that chances of getting a refund are.... >0<
Well , according to the latest email from PayPal , i will get my refund .

By the way : My latest support ticket ( created on 23rd of August ) is still unreplied by Auran .


Ladies and Gentlemen . Have fun playing Trainz . I'm leaving this forum .

Have a nice day .
 
So with thousands of Help Desk tickets after waiting just 2 days, your patience was wearing thin ... by 12 days time, you were really ticked off ... and all inside of 22 days, you are leaving ... what if they just opened the Help Desk ticket yesterday ?
 
So with thousands of Help Desk tickets after waiting just 2 days, your patience was wearing thin ... by 12 days time, you were really ticked off ... and all inside of 22 days, you are leaving ... what if they just opened the Help Desk ticket yesterday ?

Welcome to the instant gratification society :hehe:

An update on my situation with TS12....I am still using it, although I mainly stay in one route...the Port Ogden and Northern route for TS12 with no SpeedTrees.
I love this route. It has both freight and passenger options and it is HUGE. It runs smooth as silk on my comp and the graphics on it look great. I did complete 3 out of 4 sessions of the Mojave Route. The 4th one has a bug in it (introduced by N3V) and hopefully N3V will fix it in the next update. You can read about problems with the DPU Push here:
http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showthread.php?t=72044

My problem wasn't with couplers, but with the session instructions not showing up.

One more thing....I have a really cool program that I use to run Trainz and every other game on my comp. It's called Game Booster 3. It's a free download and it works really great. It shuts down all the background stuff that isn't needed. You can get it here:
http://iobit.com/gamebooster.html

"Game Booster 3 is capable of delivering the best gaming experience to you even if you have an old PC. One-click to boost PC performance is not enough, Game Booster 3 also allows you to tweak your system for top PC performance. By temporarily shutting background processes and unnecessary Windows services, cleaning RAM, and intensifying processor performance, Game Booster 3 concentrates every little system resource for gaming only."
Works for me :)
 
I have Game Booster 3, and before that came out I had Game Booster version 2.<something, maybe 2.41?>. It certainly does close down unnecessary background programs and services, freeing up RAM, which could be useful when running Trainz on this laptop of modest specifications. ;) I use it every time I run Trainz.

Regards,

Retro.
 
Dep: 'Welcome to the instant gratification society :hehe: '
Your words are the crux of the problem and its the problem thats cloging this forum with crap. People who dont have the skill or brain power to examine a problem and try to solve it before asking for help. People with no computer skills, no patience, no ability to try to learn and when things are not to their self indulgent liking, they blame others, Have a good day
 
Dep: 'Welcome to the instant gratification society :hehe: '
Your words are the crux of the problem and its the problem thats cloging this forum with crap. People who dont have the skill or brain power to examine a problem and try to solve it before asking for help. People with no computer skills, no patience, no ability to try to learn and when things are not to their self indulgent liking, they blame others, Have a good day

Well I would have to say "that depends". Yes, there are impatient people on the forum. But those people bought the game thinking it was something that was...oh yeah, I gotta use it..."SHOVEL READY":hehe:. In many cases Trainz is NOT shovel ready. And therein lies the problem. Nowhere in Trainz advertising does it state that you need to be familiar with editing files and making all kinds of changes to the program to make it work. People don't find that out until AFTER they have spent their money. Many folks don't have "computer skills", other than knowing how to turn the power switch off and on and inserting a DVD. If Auran/N3V expects people to have more skills than that to run Trainz, then they need to state that somewhere on the box or in their advertising. Of course, they won't, because that would put a major hurt on their sales.
While some things like Surveyor are relatively "user friendly" compared to other train sims (and it is becoming less and less so with each new release of Trainz), other things like the DLS are a major source of frustration.
I don't think it's being "self-indulgent" to expect a product to be up to the claims made by it in it's advertising. While no computer program is bug-free, Trainz has problems that existed back in TRS2004 that STILL exist in TS12. Now there are a whole new set of problems that have cropped up in TS12. And for the most part, Auran/N3V seems to have taken the attitude that it's up to the user to buy a high-end computer to deal with problems that could be solved by a new game engine or some programming modifications. With each new release of Trainz, N3V seems to be catering to people who already own the sim and know it's oddities and quirks and how to deal with them. That's WHY you are seeing the frustration on the forum from new folks. They bought Trainz based on what it said on the box, not what the reality of the game is. People bought the game thinking they can just hop in the loco's seat and drive. Too many times in Trainz that is NOT the case.
Look at it this way...say you bought a new house. When you go to sign the paperwork you find out that it's all ready to be occupied EXCEPT there is no roof on it. You are told that will have to be assembled by you. You are not a carpenter, bricklayer, or electrician and really don't want to learn those skills. You just want to move into that house and use it because you paid the full price expecting it to be a complete house.
 
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Going back a couple of posts, I would also recommend Game Booster 3 by Iobit. I used 2 previously but 3 has solved my biggeset issue with a route I'm building in TS10. At over 3000 boards, I found that the whole program crashed when I tried to save work. This led to me abandoning my route until I tried GB3. It does a great job of freeing up PC resource (up to 45% on some occassions) and I haven't suffered a crash since.

No, I don't work for Iobit and yes, I have been having discussion with the helpdesk.
 
On the subject of GB3, I've also found it useful as well for improving Trainz performance.

A warning though, Asset-X does not like a few of the tweaks that GB3 can do (I think it's service related)

Shane
 
Hear, hear,Dap you are right! Auran/N3V should not put a new version out untill it has been completely tested all the problems have been fixed.
Then it can be called a game.
Mabe they N3V should fix TS12 before going on. After that have a new patch of improvment these at a price so they can still make money.
Then we won't kept getting the same build-in assets as we have gotten for the past 10 years.
One game,new improvement, new assets = better game less fixing on our part.
New assets from here on must past game requirment or rejected.
my 2 cents.
 
I have a long history of purchases from Auran. I will not be buying any new version of Trainz, no matter what impressive additions are promised. I object to them releasing new versions and going onto even newer versions without fixing the problems of the older ones. Sort of hits the loyalty factor in the head with a brick.
 
... Many folks don't have "computer skills", other than knowing how to turn the power switch off and on and inserting a DVD....
And there in lies one of the problems.

When home computers were first coming on the market, every user was expected to know how it worked, inside and out or you didn't get in the game. Now mass marketers have convinced people that like the famous ad that said "you push the button, we do the rest," its easy and look at the results. Everyone THINKS they can take a picture but few really know how.

Similarly many people have computers but how many take the time to really learn how to use them? You think Trainz is difficult, try SQL, any CAD program or a photo editor. Even something as easy as Word or Excel can be daunting for all but the simplest work. Why do you think there is such a huge help industry out there? Out-of-the-box easy is another myth perpetuated by marketers that is only true for the simplest of programs. The types that allow few if any user choices.

Trainz offers some of that simplicity in Driver using DCC mode. And if this was a truly closed system, i.e., no user content or changes, it would work just like that. It would probably end up as shelfware pretty fast too.

I think it is because it is an open system that it has lasted as long as it has and with multiple versions, everyone can find their own level of enjoyment, based on what they like and what their computer can handle.
 
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bolivar
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I have a long history of purchases from Auran. I will not be buying any new version of Trainz, no matter what impressive additions are promised. I object to them releasing new versions and going onto even newer versions without fixing the problems of the older ones. Sort of hits the loyalty factor in the head with a brick.

i totally agree with bolivar and dep

i will not be buying anything else from N3V either

cheers
ron
 
Agreed, that's why I left after TRS2004. Just thought multiplayer would be fun, and thought maybe the bugs had been fixed.

The only bug that has been fixed I see is that at least now I get connect to www.auran.com. When I played TRS2004 I would had to log on to DLS at certain times to even get any web page to load.

I'll at least not spend any more money at auran products until they give me any help on helpdesk. Have been waiting for a week now.
 
All the signs of a company struggling to stay afloat in my opinion.

We have to all agree that train simulation is a fairly narrow niche market. This makes it a fairly tight profit-loss margin for operation. I completely disagree with some of the policies that N3V has adopted, but I'm also fairly sure that they're doing what they believe they have to do in their own minds to survive. Let's all hope that it's the right thing because I'd really hate to lose Trainz and this forum. I also believe that they'd probably do things a little bit different if their budget allowed, but I doubt that the market is ever going to put them in the unlimited budget position that we'd all like to see them in that would provide everything that we'd like to see.

In the meantime, I'm going to keep plugging away, buy their products and complain when I feel I'm justified to do so. It may not do any good, but my purchase gives me the right to complain.

Mike
 
And there in lies one of the problems.

When home computers were first coming on the market, every user was expected to know how it worked, inside and out or you didn't get in the game. Now mass marketers have convinced people that like the famous ad that said "you push the button, we do the rest," its easy and look at the results. Everyone THINKS they can take a picture but few really know how.

Similarly many people have computers but how many take the time to really learn how to use them? You think Trainz is difficult, try SQL, any CAD program or a photo editor. Even something as easy as Word or Excel can be daunting for all but the simplest work. Why do you think there is such a huge help industry out there? Out-of-the-box easy is another myth perpetuated by marketers that is only true for the simplest of programs. The types that allow few if any user choices.

Trainz offers some of that simplicity in Driver using DCC mode. And if this was a truly closed system, i.e., no user content or changes, it would work just like that. It would probably end up as shelfware pretty fast too.

I think it is because it is an open system that it has lasted as long as it has and with multiple versions, everyone can find their own level of enjoyment, based on what they like and what their computer can handle.

Oh please....are you going to sit there and tell me that if you bought a computer back in the Tandy, Commodore, and Apple IIE days, you had to know how it worked inside? Both programming as well as hardware? Gimme a break. Let's get serious here. Unless you were a computer geek or programmer, you didn't have a clue about what was going on inside a computer. You bought the keyboard, disk drive and monitor, plugged them in, slapped in the casette or 5 1/4 inch floppy, and printed the command to load. After that you just used the program. People "got in the game" with the TRS80, the Commodore 64, and the IIE BECAUSE they were relatively simple to operate. Not because they wanted to learn programming or hardware repair. The computer has come a long way since then and pretty much anyone can use them. Heck, cellphones are now computers and you have little kids using them. But people buy computers for all kinds of reasons. The old days of DOS are long gone. Windows has made the computer so easy that little children in grade school are using them. So don't hand me that line about everyone needing to know all the intricacies of how they work. All we need to know is that the programs we buy DO work AS ADVERTISED.

One of the reasons Trainz has lasted so long is because there is a group of folks that remember what TRS2004 USED to be, and they keep hoping that newer versions will return to those days. Unfortunately, it's been a steady downhill decline from TRS2004. Yes, those that like to tinker with files can go at it with Trainz. But the average user does NOT want to tinker with files. He wants to DRIVE TRAINS. I don't think you can make the assumption or claim that everyone who downloads an asset with missing pieces gets all happy and excited that he now can hunt for those missing files or start tweaking what was downloaded into something that can be played.

I'll say it again...if Trainz is a game that FEATURED altering or searching for files, it should SAY SO on the side of the box. So far I haven't seen one edition of Trainz use that description as a "feature".
 
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Not saying everyone did, maybe I just hung out with the wrong crowd, but my first computer was taken apart and rebuilt many time over before it was finally junked.

Let's not get all misty eyed about TRS2004, it wasn't the be-all and end-all of simulators. It had and still has it's idiosyncrasies. I was also one of the early holdouts, sticking with '04 when '06 was launched for many reasons. It was only when TS2009 came out that I upgraded, having skipped the other intermediate versions too. Why did I stay? I was comfortable and happy with what I had. My creation workflow was well established and I didn't want to do things differently. Plus, CM was only in is first version and not very friendly. It was only by the time that TS2009 came out that new creations could be easily dropped on the open CM for automatic installation, thereby simplifying the workflow. Now in TS12 it's a smooth process. Is it for everyone? No, like I said many times, if you like what you have, don't change, I didn't for a long time; if you can't change, for whatever reason (hardware, moneyware) then don't.

I don't know about the average user but just driving trains is only ONE of the things that can and is done with Trainz. I think there was an online pole done before the great forum crash asking to rate the % time spent in various parts of trainz. Does anyone remember the results?

For me, content creation is at least 50%, route building perhaps 40% and just driving a distant 10%.

As for just working, are you saying that user training is not required? What complex program doesn't need training? You do realize that intuitive interface is just a slogan?
 
Why did a thread about poor support become a complaint about Trainz versions and Auran?

Having been in the computer industry since the Apple IIe, Visual 1050, Ontel Op1, and Atari 400s, series computers, I can say that Martin has hit much of this nail smack on the head.

When we first started with home computers, it wasn't the average Joe that purchased them. It was usually the electrical engineer, programmer, student, and someone else with technical intuition that made the purchase and tinkered to make things work. I was one of them, and in 1984 I got my first real computer.

The Visual V-1050 came with 2 floppy drives, 128K of bank-switch-enabled RAM, no hard drive, a 9" display and keyboard along with a pile of software, and the CP/M-Plus OS disks. Now other than WordStar, Multiplan, DR-Graph, C-Basic, and Z-80 Assembler, you were on your own to figure things out.

So you wanted to run some calculations, other than simple spreadsheet stuff in MultiPlan? It was up to you to write the program in Pascal, Fortran, or attempt some code in Z-80 Assembler. You had to write the code, compile it, debug it, and fixed it to make it work.

Now come along today, with the big marketing push by the big companies, and nothing has changed. The new operating systems, including Apple OSx, all current versions of Windows, and even Ubuntu, hide and bury the real workings of these boxes, which are really the same as they were back in the early 1980s. The only difference now is the parts are faster, hotter, and smaller.

Since the big computer companies have already filled the early markets, they've pushed their wares on the rest of the public. Their big fancy advertisements, marketing campaigns, and glossed over sales push, has sucked in the rest of the public quite easily. People go right for the store displays now and purchase, usually at a whim, the fancy-looking home computers. They're fed a line of B-S from the store sales-geek, who talks circles around the purchaser with all kinds of techno-terms that heads spin for days afterwards.

This elder couple now bring their new shiny machine home, set it up, and think they've got a Cray on their desk. The bad part is many of these computers have older technology, built-in graphics or underpowered graphics, just enough RAM, and usually one of the slowest cheapest hard drives anyone can find. The drive might be 2TB, but it's usually one of the slow 4500 RPM ones, while good for backups, is not good for running programs like Trainz.

This is where the problem lies. People take these under spec'd machines, running a bloated operating system, or one that is not sized properly for the hardware, browse the web, and come across a program like Trainz.

Trainz may run on these underpowered machines, or it may not. This depends upon the parts inside, and given the variations of the hardware between brands and models, this is hard to judge. The other thing too is the built-in graphics chip is not going to cut the mustard for the program even if it works somewhat. This doesn't give the program justice of what it can do.

The other thing too is we keep forgetting that Trainz is not the average computer-owner's program. As much as N3V has done to change this, there are still many layers to unfurl before they find the core. Trainz is a tinkerer's program just like any hobbyist would use. With its open-ended nature and multiple facets, there are so many variations possible for operation, and worse, for thing to go wrong.

And now to complicate things, the economy has changed, and the support staff we once had, is no longer there for these people. The community can help to a certain extent, but the real mouse-holding needs to be done by the developer who is trying to survive. We no longer have full support for the older versions, which in my opinion is expected, and we have to pay for more. We keep forgetting that N3V is a business and not Greg's hobby he decided to sell to a few friends. The old days are over, and we have to live with what we have today.

Will things change? Most definitely. Will N3V be here forever? I doubt it. Personally I feel we should enjoy what we have now while we have it instead of complaining about it. My grandmother used to say that nothing is forever both good and bad. So, savor the good things while you can because once it's gone, well you know it's gone forever.

John
 
Why did a thread about poor support become a complaint about Trainz versions and Auran?

Having been in the computer industry since the Apple IIe, Visual 1050, Ontel Op1, and Atari 400s, series computers, I can say that Martin has hit much of this nail smack on the head.

When we first started with home computers, it wasn't the average Joe that purchased them. It was usually the electrical engineer, programmer, student, and someone else with technical intuition that made the purchase and tinkered to make things work. I was one of them, and in 1984 I got my first real computer.

The Visual V-1050 came with 2 floppy drives, 128K of bank-switch-enabled RAM, no hard drive, a 9" display and keyboard along with a pile of software, and the CP/M-Plus OS disks. Now other than WordStar, Multiplan, DR-Graph, C-Basic, and Z-80 Assembler, you were on your own to figure things out.

So you wanted to run some calculations, other than simple spreadsheet stuff in MultiPlan? It was up to you to write the program in Pascal, Fortran, or attempt some code in Z-80 Assembler. You had to write the code, compile it, debug it, and fixed it to make it work.

Now come along today, with the big marketing push by the big companies, and nothing has changed. The new operating systems, including Apple OSx, all current versions of Windows, and even Ubuntu, hide and bury the real workings of these boxes, which are really the same as they were back in the early 1980s. The only difference now is the parts are faster, hotter, and smaller.

Since the big computer companies have already filled the early markets, they've pushed their wares on the rest of the public. Their big fancy advertisements, marketing campaigns, and glossed over sales push, has sucked in the rest of the public quite easily. People go right for the store displays now and purchase, usually at a whim, the fancy-looking home computers. They're fed a line of B-S from the store sales-geek, who talks circles around the purchaser with all kinds of techno-terms that heads spin for days afterwards.

This elder couple now bring their new shiny machine home, set it up, and think they've got a Cray on their desk. The bad part is many of these computers have older technology, built-in graphics or underpowered graphics, just enough RAM, and usually one of the slowest cheapest hard drives anyone can find. The drive might be 2TB, but it's usually one of the slow 4500 RPM ones, while good for backups, is not good for running programs like Trainz.

This is where the problem lies. People take these under spec'd machines, running a bloated operating system, or one that is not sized properly for the hardware, browse the web, and come across a program like Trainz.

Trainz may run on these underpowered machines, or it may not. This depends upon the parts inside, and given the variations of the hardware between brands and models, this is hard to judge. The other thing too is the built-in graphics chip is not going to cut the mustard for the program even if it works somewhat. This doesn't give the program justice of what it can do.

The other thing too is we keep forgetting that Trainz is not the average computer-owner's program. As much as N3V has done to change this, there are still many layers to unfurl before they find the core. Trainz is a tinkerer's program just like any hobbyist would use. With its open-ended nature and multiple facets, there are so many variations possible for operation, and worse, for thing to go wrong.

And now to complicate things, the economy has changed, and the support staff we once had, is no longer there for these people. The community can help to a certain extent, but the real mouse-holding needs to be done by the developer who is trying to survive. We no longer have full support for the older versions, which in my opinion is expected, and we have to pay for more. We keep forgetting that N3V is a business and not Greg's hobby he decided to sell to a few friends. The old days are over, and we have to live with what we have today.

Will things change? Most definitely. Will N3V be here forever? I doubt it. Personally I feel we should enjoy what we have now while we have it instead of complaining about it. My grandmother used to say that nothing is forever both good and bad. So, savor the good things while you can because once it's gone, well you know it's gone forever.

John

Well sorry, but I am not goiing to drink the N3V Kool-Aid and worship at the Trainz altar. Sitting back and keeping quiet is NOT going to make Trainz any better. N3V needs to be constantly reminded about what is WRONG with the game as well as what is right. It's NOT a one way street.

"Trainz is not the average computer-owners program." Horse manure. Trainz caters to EVERYONE who has an interest in trains, whether real, toy, or computer-generated. You can forgetabout that elitist attitude. I guarantee you N3V doesn't feel that way. They want EVERYONE to buy and enjoy their product, not just a bunch of computer nerds who get off on adding semicolons and commas to make files work. And I repeat again for the umpteenth time, since people don't seem to believe it, but if one of Trainz' "features" was modifying and changing files to make things work, IT WOULD SAY SO ON THE BOX. You know darn well Trainz is NOT going to put that on the box, because it will scare new buyers away like the plague.

People buy Trainz based on what it says on the hardware specs on the side of the box or on the website. And we all know the hardware specs listed for TS12 are right out of Fantasy Island. If N3V put an HONEST spec on the box for what TS12 needed to run properly, again, they would lose a huge segment of the buying public. It's not the consumers fault that TS12 doesn't work on their comp if their comp meets the specs N3V publishes. It's N3V's fault.

As to early computers, Radio Shack produced one of the early color computers (TRS-80) and it was geared to the HOME user...not some techno-geek sitting in a cubicle writing programs.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TRS-80_Color_Computer
And quite honestly, I have never run any of those techno-programs on ANY comp. I buy comps to use the internet or to play games on. And that has been true ever since my B&W TRS-80.
 
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