newbie Mom intro and questions

[johnwhelan]

You're killing me! I'm blushing. Thank you so much.

[though I did make sure to read your comments to Muniman so he'd fully appreciate my efforts on his behalf ]


Ah. Excellent. Thank you, Peter.


That's good news. European layouts are some of our favorites. Muniman loves tram & city routes (light rail in general)(hence his name, for the Muni in San Francisco) and we all love the European electric trains.

Is this the one you're referring to? :

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814161218

Is it just me, or does figuring out graphics cards (which will work with what, power supplies, what you really need versus power you'll never use, etc.) seem like one of those things you need a 3-month college course in? Yikes.

That video card would be my personal choice and I'd pair it with this power supply.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371007

It's $25 off today but even at its original price it would still be my personal choice. Power supplies my personal view is look for one of the 80% efficiency ones and stay within the brand names on tomshardware.com.

Cheerio John

 

[muniman]

Thanks, John!

 

[johnwhelan]

One final point please take some anti static precautions when adding memory, power supplies or video cards.

I do not recommend my method of leaving the computer plugged in but turned off at the power supply and working with a anti static wrist strap. There are safer ways, please research them.

To reduce the risk do not work on a nylon carpet or wear man-made materials such as nylon, cotton is better. You may not notice any difference when you work but a static discharge can shorten the life of the components.

Cheerio John

 

[collinsl]

Cut... You may not notice any difference when you work but a static discharge can shorten the life of the components.

Cheerio John

Or even break them! It takes as little as 100V to damage a computer component, but a human can only feel upwards of 1000V of static electricity, and you can only see 20-30,000V.

QUOTE muniman: Is it just me, or does figuring out graphics cards (which will work with what, power supplies, what you really need versus power you'll never use, etc.) seem like one of those things you need a 3-month college course in? Yikes. END QUOTE

I'm doing a 2-year college course, and I don't think that this will be covered!

Anyway, there are some great internet sites that work out how much power you should need (in Watts), and most graphics cards will say on the manufacturer's website how much power they will need, generally if it is over 400W.

Also, graphics cards use most of the power within a computer. The rest of it will generally use up to 150W at PEAK loads only.

 

[johnwhelan]

Or even break them! It takes as little as 100V to damage a computer component, but a human can only feel upwards of 1000V of static electricity, and you can only see 20-30,000V.

QUOTE muniman: Is it just me, or does figuring out graphics cards (which will work with what, power supplies, what you really need versus power you'll never use, etc.) seem like one of those things you need a 3-month college course in? Yikes. END QUOTE

I'm doing a 2-year college course, and I don't think that this will be covered!

Anyway, there are some great internet sites that work out how much power you should need (in Watts), and most graphics cards will say on the manufacturer's website how much power they will need, generally if it is over 400W.

Also, graphics cards use most of the power within a computer. The rest of it will generally use up to 150W at PEAK loads only.

Now the interesting thing is I put a meter on the power supply to the PC and even running Trainz it consumes much less than the value "needed" for the video card, its been measuring between 70 - 110 watts.

Cheerio John

 

[mawilson]

John,

The power supply has to rated for max load. That typically happens at power on when it has to spin up several fans and one or more HDs. Add to that the odd DVD drive with a disk left in it. Finally providing power to all the components on the motherboard and the associated cards. The spinning things really consume power. I'd guess that the wind machines on the high end graphics cards account for most of their power rating.

 

[SuperFudd]

I suspect your major bottle neck is the video card. What ever you replace it with should have at least 256M of video RAM on it.

 

[AJ_Fox]

A little off topic but do you all see how close to accurate muniman got the mechanical engineering on the drawings he did of the locos when he was 7?

Cheers

AJ

 

[collinsl]

Now the interesting thing is I put a meter on the power supply to the PC and even running Trainz it consumes much less than the value "needed" for the video card, its been measuring between 70 - 110 watts.

Cheerio John

Sorry, I may not have worded my last statement correctly. What I meant was that the graphics card will need that much power AT MOST.

 

[Heaton]

John,

The power supply has to rated for max load. That typically happens at power on when it has to spin up several fans and one or more HDs. Add to that the odd DVD drive with a disk left in it. Finally providing power to all the components on the motherboard and the associated cards. The spinning things really consume power. I'd guess that the wind machines on the high end graphics cards account for most of their power rating.

The fans can't be using much power. Electric motors generally are very efficient users of power, and the mechanical load on any fan motor is low (it's only moving air after all). The eight-inch mains-powered fan on my desk only rates 24W. Drive motors would be more demanding of course, but mostly during the spinning-up stage; power consumption would reduce once they're at a steady speed.

Also someone mentioned 400W in connection with graphics cards (if I interpreted that info correctly). This is four fifths of the heat generated by a 500W halogen floodlight lamp. Is that figure reasonable, given that all power dissipation in a device finally ends up as heat?

 

[collinsl]

The fans can't be using much power. Electric motors generally are very efficient users of power, and the mechanical load on any fan motor is low (it's only moving air after all). The eight-inch mains-powered fan on my desk only rates 24W. Drive motors would be more demanding of course, but mostly during the spinning-up stage; power consumption would reduce once they're at a steady speed.

Also someone mentioned 400W in connection with graphics cards (if I interpreted that info correctly). This is four fifths of the heat generated by a 500W halogen floodlight lamp. Is that figure reasonable, given that all power dissipation in a device finally ends up as heat?

This was in reference to a card that I saw somewhere (can't remember now) that was reputed, by the manufacturer, to use up to 400W in short bursts (1-5 seconds), thereby not generating much heat, but requiring a PSU that could cope. 5 seconds is enough for a PSU to reset if it cannot cope with the power requirements, as I found out on an old computer.

 

[Heaton]

Ah, OK .......

 

[mawilson]

Heaton,

It isn't the power required to keep spinning things spinning that is the problem. That is generally not much. It is getting them to start spinning that takes all the effort. At power up the supply has to handle all the fans, etc. starting up at the same time.

If you have a 160 or so Watts on the motherboard and 250 or so Watts on the GPU then it doesn't take much resistance in the various motors to overcome a 450 W power supply.

"So I rewired it."

 

[Heaton]

Yes, motors do pull maximum current at start-up, and you'd get a surge. Forgot about that.

I wonder if software could be used to sequentially start the assorted spinning things. Seems to me that it shouldn't really be necessary in an ideal world to employ a PSU that's overrated for normal conditions just to cope with temporary current surges.

 

[johnwhelan]

Yes, motors do pull maximum current at start-up, and you'd get a surge. Forgot about that.

I wonder if software could be used to sequentially start the assorted spinning things. Seems to me that it shouldn't really be necessary in an ideal world to employ a PSU that's overrated for normal conditions just to cope with temporary current surges.

My thought as well, some sort of bios setting? PErhaps we should talk to ASUS about it.

Cheerio John

 

[seward]

It's so heartwarming to see a young lad and a Mother who is caring enough to take the time to help her son like this.

Perhaps Auran should adopt a new slogan?

Hows about: "Trainz brings Families together"?

 

[PerRock]

It's so heartwarming to see a young lad and a Mother who is caring enough to take the time to help her son like this.

Perhaps Auran should adopt a new slogan?

Hows about: "Trainz brings Families together"?

How about:
"Trainz brings Families together; and couples apart."

peter

 

[JimDep]

"Perhaps Auran should adopt a new slogan?"

Speaking of adoption.......do you need another son?

 

[Zwabberaar]

"Perhaps Auran should adopt a new slogan?"

Speaking of adoption.......do you need another son?

... or two?

 

[laldfordo]

Or even break them! It takes as little as 100V to damage a computer component, but a human can only feel upwards of 1000V of static electricity, and you can only see 20-30,000V.

That's a significant bit of information. I've always thought, if I can't feel a tingle when I touch an earthed part of the computer I'm not going to harm it.