justinroth
Well-known member
On my route I have around 120 miles between yards of different railroads (NS and Conrail). I'm wondering how far a local would go to spot freight, prototypically.
How far do local runs go?
- Thread starter justinroth
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amrail2000
GONE AND FORGOTTEN
It depends on the territory. Some can as short as few miles and others can be lengthy. The thing to keep in mind that a railroad crews day is not to exceed 12 hours. So a rail carrier would schedule their trip around that. So really I come back to , it varies by location and company. The variables are just to many to try to describe. One thing you could do is have a train leave each yard and run half way or to the nearest passing track that could handle the train. Cut off road engines and run a round the train and then work industries going back. This will add operational interest and make your route seem bigger. I hope this helps . Feel to free to let me know if you any more help.
Run Eight
Sam
Run Eight
Sam
Historically, in the U.S. the permitted hours of service has varied. In 1907, when the Hours of Service Act was created the limit was 16 hours, then it was lowered to 14 hours in 1969, etc. I think the last revisions were made in 2008. Over the years, some states had laws on the books regarding hours of service for railroad employees as well that sometimes varied a bit for different occupations and some states law made provision extended time on duty during "emergencies".
justinroth
Well-known member
thanks fellers. I was initially thinking that halfway point would be a cutoff, with maybe some trackage rights type situations.
A local is also called a way freight. In the USA, it would depend on the division and the era. Back when every small town along the route had industries serviced by the railroad, it would take much more time than today, when trucking does most of the local freight. In 1950, the SOO ran two daily way freights on the First Subdivision between Schiller Park MP17 (north side of Chicago) and Waukesha MP97. One would leave Schiller Park at 5:45am and head west and the other would leave Waukesha at 7am and head east. They had a meet scheduled at MP54 at 10:10am. By 1963, the western end of the run went all the way to Shops Yard MP158. They still ran one train each way every day except Sunday with a meet at MP80.
As traffic would decline, they would drop the schedule to one train a day in alternate directions - westbound on Monday, Wednesday and Friday and Eastbound on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday.
On other divisions, they would run a "turn". Leave the yard, go approx. halfway to the next major yard and then return to originating yard. Sometimes there would be no hard and fast schedule. No need to run a train if the traffic doesn't call for it. And if the traffic was light, a "turn" might not "turn" at the same location every trip.
David
As traffic would decline, they would drop the schedule to one train a day in alternate directions - westbound on Monday, Wednesday and Friday and Eastbound on Tuesday, Thursday and Saturday.
On other divisions, they would run a "turn". Leave the yard, go approx. halfway to the next major yard and then return to originating yard. Sometimes there would be no hard and fast schedule. No need to run a train if the traffic doesn't call for it. And if the traffic was light, a "turn" might not "turn" at the same location every trip.
David
amrail2000
GONE AND FORGOTTEN
As I stated, it depends on the area and where the train is at. Also the current law is 12 hours. I do appreciate the historical information as well. My thanks for posting that.
justinroth
Well-known member
I guess where my confusion comes from is lack of knowledge on RR practice. Basically the west yard and industry is CR, everything else is NS CSX and C&O(which is the bulk of the route ...unprototypical and time transcendent/paradoxical I know....but I grew up with these roads). Would NS take a whole train and drop it at the Conrail yard...and conversely would Conrail take the 120 mile trip to the NS yard? I know enough to realize it's not that simple, but I have never been exposed to nor have I came across info on operational practices in my years as a railfan. p.s. sorry if this is in the wrong forum 
justinroth
Well-known member
There is no general answer to your question; the answer will vary at nearly every place where such a situation would happen. In the real world, the labor agreements, the costs, and the revenue would have an influence on the operating practice. If the "whole train" off the NS was a unit coal train, it might well be brought to the CR yard and dropped, and then after they were rested, the delivering crew might well return to their origin point with the empties. On the other hand, if there was a large industry near the yard, CR might well make the 120 mile trip to the NS yard in order to maximize the revenue from the shipper.
The fact of the matter is, if you are freelancing a route with the roads you mentioned, if you can come up with a logical explanation as to why something is being done in a particular way, there is probably somewhere a prototype example of something done exactly the same way. On the other hand, if you figure that the carriers involved are using real people, and spending real money, keep in mind that each is going to try to find a way to minimize its costs, and maximize its revenue, so the most unlikely scenario would be where the two carriers each haul a loaded train 120 miles, and deadhead back. In that situation, they'd be more likely to arrange a meet half way, cut the power and caboose of each train and place it on the other, and return with the loaded train to its origin.
ns
The fact of the matter is, if you are freelancing a route with the roads you mentioned, if you can come up with a logical explanation as to why something is being done in a particular way, there is probably somewhere a prototype example of something done exactly the same way. On the other hand, if you figure that the carriers involved are using real people, and spending real money, keep in mind that each is going to try to find a way to minimize its costs, and maximize its revenue, so the most unlikely scenario would be where the two carriers each haul a loaded train 120 miles, and deadhead back. In that situation, they'd be more likely to arrange a meet half way, cut the power and caboose of each train and place it on the other, and return with the loaded train to its origin.
ns
Model Railroad Operations SIG - This is probably the best resource for operations. Although it is geared toward table top model railroads, they have vast resources into actual railroad operations. The next issue of their quarterly publication, the Dispatchers Office has an article about modeling operations using Trainz.
David
David
FWIW.......
I live on the BNSF Gateway Sub., it runs 202 miles from Klamath Falls, OR to Keddie , CA.
There is very little industry south of Bieber, CA (Approx. 1/2 way point).
The KLFKED Local runs south on Monday and Thursday. If there is work south of Bieber, they will go south as far as necessary.
(the last reload point is at Crescent Mills, CA, mp 194) They will usually tie up for the night at Clear Creek, CA mp168.
On Tuesday/Friday they will head north picking up loads as they go, ending the day in Klamath Falls.
If there is no work south of Bieber, they will try to get back to Klamath falls on their hours.....this local is notorious for needing to be dog-caught........too many miles of single track railroad with trains and MoW in the way.
DaveL
I live on the BNSF Gateway Sub., it runs 202 miles from Klamath Falls, OR to Keddie , CA.
There is very little industry south of Bieber, CA (Approx. 1/2 way point).
The KLFKED Local runs south on Monday and Thursday. If there is work south of Bieber, they will go south as far as necessary.
(the last reload point is at Crescent Mills, CA, mp 194) They will usually tie up for the night at Clear Creek, CA mp168.
On Tuesday/Friday they will head north picking up loads as they go, ending the day in Klamath Falls.
If there is no work south of Bieber, they will try to get back to Klamath falls on their hours.....this local is notorious for needing to be dog-caught........too many miles of single track railroad with trains and MoW in the way.
DaveL
justinroth
Well-known member
Awesome! Thanks for all the info....but, if I have to deadhead what are the chances of getting a fridge and hotplate in cab