ATLS triggers and a brake question

N

nicky9499

SSoTW Bot
Hi guys,

I've some ATLS crossings which used to be simply rigged (track-wise) by just plonking a trigger at the center and setting the trigger radius to 500 and correspondingly lesser for lower speed areas. However I observed the side effect of doing so is that the crossings never ever come up, at least as far as I've observed. So I went to take a gander at how Joe did his crossings on the Tehachapi route, and he has a "distant" trigger at a distance away from the crossing appropriate for the track speed, then another two straddling the road crossing. Which makes sense, distant trigger turns "on" the crossing, trigger beside the road turns it "off".

However, because crossings are bi-directional, there's always a "distant" trigger on both sides. So what I've observed is my train goes through the crossing, no problem. And afterwards the gates come back up, no problem. But then they come down again (!), presumably because it's hit the opposite direction's "distant" trigger. I've no idea how to fix this.

Anyone have good ideas?



Oh, also, a quick question. Braking has always been very unwieldy with Trainz. And today I got down to a little scrutinizing. By hitting the A key, I can move from "release" to "apply". However regardless of whether I'm clicking the HUD slider or using the keystroke, the minimum braking force is at least 20 lbs (tested with RRMods' BN SD45), which is abit much I feel, especially on light trains. If I try to use the HUD slider and move it a little bit it jumps back to Release. Can this be "modded"?

Cheerio,
Nicholas
 
First question Id ask is which setting are you using on the trigger? "1 or 2 way running - basic" requires only 1 trigger on each side of the crossing where as "2 way running - 4 trigger system" requires 2 triggers either side of the crossing.
 
I use the 2 trigger ATLS system, it works great. Now if we could get TS12 to stop moving track objects when you save it I be much happier.

Edit: corrected to 2 not 4.
 
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1 and 2 trigger mode needs the train to pass 2 triggers and the 4 mode needs 4 triggers to be passed. Driver commands can also be used with the triggers Any combination can be set up as long as the correct number are passed. 4 mode = 2 triggers and 2 commands or 3 triggers and 1 command. If one trigger is not selected correct it will fail to operate right.
 
Hi guys,

I have found the "2-way 4-trigger" setting which previously went unnoticed and put that on all the triggers associated with the crossing in question. However, the "gates coming down a second time" issue still persists. The gate-closed buffer while prototypical (current calculations 26m:1mph), is abit too long for my liking, so I can eliminate this to a certain extent by moving the distant triggers closer to the crossing. This increases the chances of the outgoing train hitting the other direction's distant trigger while still occupying the crossing. If unclear I can provide a diagram and/or screenshots. However, it is still a stopgap measure and shorter trains will still trigger the crossing twice.

Nicholas
 
Yes, the controller and slave are set to level crossing mode. It is operating on its own channel. In addition, it's being tested in the "base" session, which also means nothing else (other AI drivers and trains) are present. Just tested it again after moving the triggers closer. Still happening.
 
You should have 4 triggers all set up the same, 2 on each side of the crossing. 2 at a distance from the crossing and 2 close to each side of the crossing. As the train approaches crossing first trigger activates crossing, second trigger is ignored, third trigger activates crossing and forth trigger is ignored. train must pass all 4 triggers without change of direction.


"This increases the chances of the outgoing train hitting the other direction's distant trigger while still occupying the crossing"

Does not matter, all 4 triggers can be under the train and it will still work. Front of train activates the first trigger and rear of train activates third trigger 2nd and 4th do nothing.
 
Ok guys,

I decided I was spending way more time than was necessary to troubleshoot such a simple crossing so I tore out all the triggers and laid them out again as shown.

Triggers (there is a single distant one on the other side and yes I've made sure the left one is on the correct track)


Controller:


Slave:


Trigger:


However, the crossing is still triggered twice! I don't know why. Even a sufficiently long train that straddles 3rd and 4th trigger, the crossing will go up and immediately come down again.

Guess we're back to troubleshooting then. :(
 
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The only reason I can see this will happen is you have the triggers still set at 1 or 2 way running. That would result in the first trigger and second trigger working together followed straight away with the third and forth trigger repeating the operation. Make sure all triggers are set at 4 trigger mode.
 
Could the problem be naming the ATLS assets? In the tutorial it mentions something about naming it properly. I have mine set up like shown above (all triggers set to two way/four trig. system and four triggers on all paths). I however do not name them.
 
Hi Justin,

That's the ticket! Everything is working well now. When I put in the new triggers I forgot to set them back to 2-way 4-trigger running. Apart from that the setup is exactly the same only the previous one had proper names. Anyhoo, it's working now, so I'll apply this method to the rest of the crossings on the route. Thanks again to all who chipped in.

Cheerio,
Nicholas
 
Hi Nicholas,

Glad you got it sorted. There are two reasons to 'name' ATLS Assets. One is so the assets will save their set-up config to the Route and not just the session. In which case follow the pdf instructions using the [ ] and ( ) characters. ATLS assets see [ ] and ( ) as soemthing special.

The other reason to name them is just because you want to. If you name them just because.... then avoid using those special characters, especially [ and ] or you may get problems. Actually using ( ) as I see you have shouldn't be a problem... but best to avoid. If you don't use [ or ] then the ATLS script should ignore the name.

Your problem here by the look of it, was not setting all Triggers to 4 way.

Stagecoach is always the man to sort you out. He is an expert ATLS User. He knows more about using it than I do!!!!

Cheers,

Boat
 
Hi boat,

You mentioned that ATLS assets save their settings to the session. Would this also be the case if all ATLS assets were built on the route layer even if I were working on the "Base" session? Obviously I would like the settings to carry over to other sessions. If it is imperative to put in the funny number names I'll do so.

Alright, update:

I've updated the whole route to the 4-trigger system. However some parts are posing abit of a challenge to set up. The underlying issue is, some trains will pass by at track speed, others may stop at a nearby station or travelling slowly. See this picture:



The calculated distant trigger distance puts it in the station (end of flatcar, that's a measurement consist), which would not be a problem if a train was passing through but would mean the gates would stay down for an abnormal amount of time if it was picking up passengers.


Another question I'd like to ask is if it would be advisable to have different settings for a single crossing.



In this scene, the left 3 tracks are mainline, so they're set for 4-trigger mode. I've set the Home Depot sidings on the right to 2-trigger mode as it's rather short and trains traverse it very slowly. I've not tested it thoroughly yet, so will there be side effects?

Cheerio,
Nicholas
 
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To save it to the route you must name it exactly as the code states in the top left corner (ATLS3[-1,0] for example otherwise it is only saved in session.
If you ever looked at my advanced ATLS demo you will see that you can mix trigger set ups on the same crossing. I used all the different modes on one crossing, The only rule is that a train must pass the correct number of triggers of that mode. As for the train stopping at the station it is fairly simple. You need to use priority numbers on trains and triggers. The first trigger on your approach to station un tick priority 3. Find a suitable TM prior to the ATLS trigger and use the command set priority at TM and select 3. The trigger will not activate the gates when passed by that train. Before you leave the station use the ATLS driver command for the correct mode of the crossing, this acts as the first trigger and activates the gate. Use a short pause to allow the animation to take place.
You could also do this with slow trains, place a TM nearer the crossing and use drive via TM followed by the ATLS command.
 
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