TRS19 - Early Access Is Coming!

I'd suspect they're worried optional subscription will become compulsory subscription, rather like optional DRM has become compulsory DRM.

Unless, of course, you're planning a DRM free version (for macOS as well please this time). RRSignal would be so pleased :)

So would I and, I daresay, many others. And if not, then at least we have an enjoyable version of Trainz to console us.
 
Folded. Bought it. Report later.

The Jedi mind powers of Tony H. stretch far and wide...

Just don't let us down.
 
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The Jedi mind powers of Tony H. stretch far and wide...

Formidable indeed!

Welcome to the TRS19 Club Vern. I will look forward to your report, warts and all. Unfortunately other duties have prevented me from exploring TRS19 much beyond the surface but what I have seen so far does impress me. I wonder how far it could have gone if they had severed all connections with content that was older than TS12 - ignoring the inevitable forum outcry of course?
 
As visible, I bought TRS19, but it does not feel completely right.

I don't see the point for increasing the price. In earlier times, there has been the same or more included content without such a increase.
New features? Some regarding the graphics, some smaller changes here and there, a new gui.
And to enjoy the new graphic features, i'll have to buy a newer PC or decrease the graphics quality.

Nothing about multiplayer surveyor announced 12.02.2016 in newsletter.
Trainz "Next" takes the world's best Railroad World Building tools ("Surveyor") and turns them into fully fledged "Multiplayer Surveyor" tools that will empower the creation of Routes only ever dreamed of before.

I bought TRS 19 because I love trainz and because there's hope.

About the subscription model. I and nearly all people (and they're a lot) won't use it. I understand that it will assure you a constant money flow, but as user, i don't see the advantage.
Sure I'll get a lot of DLCs, but do i really need them all? And when stopping the subscription, i have - right - nothing left. So the calculation just isn't true (about 1500$ worth some pages ago).
I'd think about using it, when the DLCs are added finally to my account e.g. after one year of getting them via subscription, but not like this and not for that price.
If some day new features will require subscription to use them or if its not possible to buy Trainz anymore, then it's definitely time to say goodbye.
 
Welcome Vern.

PhotoFunia-1535579697.jpg
 
I don't see the point for increasing the price.

You seem to be comparing the price of TRS19 with the current price of TANE. When TANE was first released is was more expensive, as is often the case with new products. Some have stated that the original TANE price was very similar to the current TRS19 price - I did look back through my purchase records but have been unable to determine exactly what I paid for TANE but it was more than the current asking price.

New features? Some regarding the graphics, some smaller changes here and there, a new gui.
And to enjoy the new graphic features, i'll have to buy a newer PC or decrease the graphics quality.

I recently imported my TANE route into TRS19 (no errors or missing assets) and the visual difference is more than just some small changes here and there. The atmospherics alone (mist, sunlight filtering through trees, etc) gave the route a whole new look it didn't have in TANE.

I recently had to buy a new laptop (it is amazing what a mug of hot tea will do to electronics) and the new machine has a far superior display system (GTX 1050ti graphics card and an IPS screen) to my existing desktop (GTX 750ti and stock standard LCD screen). But the laptop has only 8GB of RAM compared to the 24GB on the desktop. I initially installed TRS19 on the laptop only but later, for comparison, I also installed it on the desktop.

TRS19 runs just fine on the desktop. So far I have not noticed any major differences between the two systems - both have Turf FX, for example, which I did not expect to see on the desktop. I would expect that there will be some differences due to either the different graphic cards or RAM sizes.

About the subscription model. I and nearly all people (and they're a lot) won't use it. I understand that it will assure you a constant money flow, but as user, i don't see the advantage.

My informal survey of these forums seems to indicate, from those who have posted what they have purchased, that it is running about 50-50 between subscriptions and outright purchases. So I don't see where you get the assessment that "nearly all people (and they're a lot) won't use it". Some people clearly do see an advantage in the subscription model, others don't. Each person will make that decision based on their own requirements and experiences. In my case I don't have much DLC and tend to spend most of my time creating routes and sessions, so the purchase option was the obvious choice. Others have stated that they spend most of their time in Driver and little (or none) in Surveyor so one of the subscription options was their preferred choice.

I'd think about using it, when the DLCs are added finally to my account e.g. after one year of getting them via subscription, but not like this and not for that price.

That is a worthwhile suggestion that others have made and, who knows, it may be a possibility further "down the track".

My opinions only.
 
You seem to be comparing the price of TRS19 with the current price of TANE. When TANE was first released is was more expensive, as is often the case with new products. Some have stated that the original TANE price was very similar to the current TRS19 price - I did look back through my purchase records but have been unable to determine exactly what I paid for TANE but it was more than the current asking price.
I paid more for T:ANE too via Kickstarter, but on Kickstarter, it was available starting from 50 AUD (currently ~37US$). Early bird was even cheaper.
Even after release i'm quite sure that it was't more expensive than 50 USD.

I recently imported my TANE route into TRS19 (no errors or missing assets) and the visual difference is more than just some small changes here and there. The atmospherics alone (mist, sunlight filtering through trees, etc) gave the route a whole new look it didn't have in TANE.
I did the same with several routes I had in TANE and without changing more it doesnt look that great. I know and i'm definitely sure that its possible to have a far better visual experience in TRS 2019 (T:ANE had all settings to max, TRS 2019 on High settings).
But my point was that this are only visual improvements. At least for me, it's not all about graphics.

I recently had to buy a new laptop (it is amazing what a mug of hot tea will do to electronics) and the new machine has a far superior display system (GTX 1050ti graphics card and an IPS screen) to my existing desktop (GTX 750ti and stock standard LCD screen). But the laptop has only 8GB of RAM compared to the 24GB on the desktop. I initially installed TRS19 on the laptop only but later, for comparison, I also installed it on the desktop.

TRS19 runs just fine on the desktop. So far I have not noticed any major differences between the two systems - both have Turf FX, for example, which I did not expect to see on the desktop. I would expect that there will be some differences due to either the different graphic cards or RAM sizes.
The possible settings depend a lot of the route you use, my PC (Xeon e3-1241v3, 16GB DDR, GTX 970) doesnt run that smoothly on High settings on some routes.

My informal survey of these forums seems to indicate, from those who have posted what they have purchased, that it is running about 50-50 between subscriptions and outright purchases. So I don't see where you get the assessment that "nearly all people (and they're a lot) won't use it". Some people clearly do see an advantage in the subscription model, others don't. Each person will make that decision based on their own requirements and experiences. In my case I don't have much DLC and tend to spend most of my time creating routes and sessions, so the purchase option was the obvious choice. Others have stated that they spend most of their time in Driver and little (or none) in Surveyor so one of the subscription options was their preferred choice.
Damn, i forgot the part "most people I talked to" in that sentence, excuse me. Of course I do not want to speek for the whole community.I guess, we germans are a bit more cautious, we prefer to own things (my experience), of course that may be different and may change over the time.

Don't get me wrong, i'm not against TRS 2019, but i'd be luckier to see new game features, too instead of mostly visual changes. There are parts in Trainz, that really need improvement, even smaller functions e.g. its still not possible to have a second driver position (in a loco with two cabs) without using own scripts, also it's not possible to have double slip switches with procedural track.

Maybe i'm just a little disappointed because nearly all is about graphics, but tastes are different.

People that buy TRS 2019 (once) have the disadvantage, that they can't use e.g. the Trainz-Plus features or they have to pay TRS 2019 twice. So they seem to be excluded from the new features until a new product is released. And for that 69$, that should have been included, in the past, features for the buy-once version have also been added e.g. via Service Packs.
 
.. in the past, features for the buy-once version have also been added e.g. via Service Packs.

Nope.

I think you're misunderstanding what Trainz Plus is. It's not about making people pay for service packs. Service Packs are still free for all of our customers.

Trainz Plus is about giving our Gold Class subscribes access to features that are destined for the NEXT version of Trainz.

If subscriptions had existed back when TANE was introduced, for example, then our Gold Class subscribers would have had access to many or all of the TRS19 features as they were developed, rather than waiting for the release of TRS19 itself. They might have been working with PBR materials a year ago, for example.

chris
 
If subscriptions had existed back when TANE was introduced, for example, then our Gold Class subscribers would have had access to many or all of the TRS19 features as they were developed, rather than waiting for the release of TRS19 itself. They might have been working with PBR materials a year ago, for example.

chris

Isn't that what the TrainzDev group were doing? :)
 
Isn't that what the TrainzDev group were doing? :)

There are many differences between Trainz Plus and TrainzDev, eg:

* TrainzDev receives builds which are pre-beta, and NOT heavily tested.
* Trainz Plus receives polished builds.

* TrainzDev receives features which are explicitly NOT the future direction of Trainz, but rather early experiments for community feedback. Some of these features get to see the light of day, some are put on the back burner, and some are killed off or radically changed.
* Trainz Plus receives builds with completed features that are an ongoing part of Trainz.

* TrainzDev is deliberately kept to a small size, and is invite only.
* Trainz Plus is available to any Gold Class subscriber.

* TrainzDev receives access only features which need community feedback.
* Trainz Plus will receive all mainstream features as they become ready for external consumption.

cheers,

chris
 
Nope.

I think you're misunderstanding what Trainz Plus is. It's not about making people pay for service packs. Service Packs are still free for all of our customers.

Trainz Plus is about giving our Gold Class subscribes access to features that are destined for the NEXT version of Trainz.

If subscriptions had existed back when TANE was introduced, for example, then our Gold Class subscribers would have had access to many or all of the TRS19 features as they were developed, rather than waiting for the release of TRS19 itself. They might have been working with PBR materials a year ago, for example.

chris
Chris, I understand it, thats clear to me.
But i miss an option to get this also for people that own TRS 2019 without paying the full 15$ per month... if there's a solution for e.g. 5$/month, i'd join.
 
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I'm struggling to put into words how disgusting of a concept Trainz Plus is.

Say what you want about Railworks, but at the very least, it's a yearly release, and you don't have to buy the game every year to get the new features from the new version of the game: as long as you own a version of the game, you get the new features when the new game comes out. It looks to me that Trainz Plus is trying to replicate this idea, but instead, you gotta pay for the new updates until the next "true" release. Paying $150 a year or $15 a month for updates that should be free is stupid.

Stuff like Fog Sliders in Driver and Font Scaling in CM should be default inclusions to the program, not something you have to pay to get access to until a new game comes out in X number of years.

You claim it's "not paid Service Packs", and you're right. Service packs fix issues with the game, and occasionally patch in small new features. Trainz Plus gives users access to brand new features that won't be available for another 3-4 years. Hence, paid updates.

You people are terrible at listening to consumers. No one asked for Trainz Plus. No one asked for this assinine Subscription Service. For god sakes, just make the full game $70 and leave it at that. None of this extra bullsh*t is necessary at all.
 
Hi All -- my 2 cents

What's the big deal with the
subscription method? --- choose to buy it, or not -- What company today doesn't have a
subscription? But they give it a choose, like N3V did --- Amazon, Netflix, Hulu, Disney (next-year), and so many others! I'm not getting a
subscription now, but I can always change my mind a few months from now, or next year! It's not the end of the world -- In a sense, it's turning out to be quite funny -- Even Tony through a few humor remakes here and there!

Everyone, just have a good day --- Life is too short, and it comes too fast -- As a few know my story, just happy trainzing!

Ish :)[SUB][SUP]
[/SUP][/SUB]
 
Trainz Plus is about giving our Gold Class subscribes access to features that are destined for the NEXT version of Trainz.


chris

Back when we were being led to believe that the only thing that would be subscription in TRS19 would be a Multiplayer Surveyor option, there was a survey passed around. Pretty sure there was a question in regards to what we thought of that. While multiplayer surveyor is of no interest to me, I mentioned that it was a slippery slope which would inevitably lead to more things being locked behind an additional paywall on top of the program we already paid for.

I figured we'd at least be safe from that for another couple full releases, but lo-and-behold you're planning to lock new features behind said paywall in this current release. I hope you realize there will be yet another can of worms opening when these Trainz Plus features start rolling out and users realize they can't partake without sending you money every month.

On a side note, as most AAA games with a much wider audience are $60 when released, I have no issue with the $70 price tag as long as the built-in content is adequate, but will wait until the full release not early access. I have no desire for the Gold subscription with its DLC selling point (much of which many will already own or otherwise not have interest in), this isn't Pokemon where you collect everything to 'win.' What does concern me is when I saw TRS20 mentioned...I wouldn't be quite as understanding about that $70 if you're planning a yearly main-release cycle. Medium/Large (and actually NEW, not re-done) routes would never get finished if every year a new release comes along changing/possibly breaking things.

Just a few thoughts.
 
Indeed, and you can carry on operating with TRS19 as though the subscription method doesn't exist at all. If you want to.

So...i'm not allowed to point out when a service wasn't thought through? Just because i don't have to buy it?

Therefore, by that logic, pretty much nothing can ever be criticized. Let's run through some examples and make this slippery slope abundantly clear:

1. Food for sale on a store's shelves looks rotten? According to you, i can't criticize it or the company behind it because i don't have to buy it.
2. A car for sale in a dealership is missing a wheel? According to you, i can't criticize it or the company behind it because i don't have to buy it.
3. A train simulator creates a route and sells it for forty dollars. According to you, i can't criticize it or the company behind it because i don't have to buy it.

You seriously think i'm not allowed to criticize a service because i don't have to buy into it? That's truly amazing.
 
As much as I'm enjoying a positive experience with TRS2019 (albeit still not quite got the lighting right) I am with Chris in that purchasers of the $70 traditional install will not be disadvantaged when it comes to receiving updates - whether essential fixes or augmented gameplay.
 
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