Hi everybody.
edh6 I believe you are perfectly correct in advising that WCRC do not own the steam locomotives they operate and therefore in my posting at #16 on this thread I should have stated “operated” and not “owned” in my references to the above companies locomotives. I also believe that all the mainline train operating companies lease all their operating consists from either Network Rail or the rail regulator I am not sure which. Where I would respectfully disagree with your above posting (if I interpret your wording correctly), would be where you state that it is the responsibility of the vehicle acceptance body to ensure the locomotive is fit to run.
It is always in all forms of land transport whether that be road or rail the responsibility of the day to day operator/driver of a vehicle to on each occasion before use, ensure that the vehicle is legally adequate for the purpose to which it is to be used. In the foregoing it is for the operator to ensure that the vehicle complies to all the requirements of highways or rail requirements act(s) and mechanically meets all requirements laid down under various legislative requisites encompassed in the above act(s). To put it or simply, if you are operating/driving any vehicle road or rail on the day something happens, the buck stops with you and no one else.
edh6, again I would respectfully wish to disagree With regard to paragraph 2 of your posting where you state that regular rail commuters are only affected to a “small extent” by the operations of the rail tour operators as they only run at weekends in the height of summer. I believe if anyone checks the schedules of all the mainline train operators they will quickly realise that Saturday operations especially almost exactly replicate Monday to Friday schedules. I will certainly accept Sunday schedules are considerably changed but this is normally on the direction of Network Rail to enable regular maintenance such as track inspection to be carried out. Even with the foregoing restrictions most mainline schedules compare very favourably by midday with the other six days of the week.
For a considerable number of years now Britain has not been a Monday to Friday nine two five economy. Weekend working now extends throughout many industries that were untouched until the mid-1990s. Seven-day working now is commonplace in the retail, call centres, utility company offices, distribution centres, mail and parcel hubs, the list is endless to add to the traditional industries of healthcare, power generation etc. I find in my own employment that even the offices of the clerk of the courts are available for contact on Saturday’s (if you know the numbers to ring), something that was unthinkable only a few years ago.
In other offices these days many full-time employees are given a “job brief” which does not relate to hours worked, but rather more to the extent of their responsibilities and the hours worked are “whatever it takes” to fulfil those responsibilities. Therefore many people still need to commute to their place of work at weekends and if they are not doing that they often still commute to town and city centres for shopping trips or personal entertainment etc. You will therefore find that Britain’s rail network is equally as busy at weekends (with perhaps the exception of early mornings) as they are any other day of the week. When it cost between £60-£100 British sterling to park a car for a day in central London, you will certainly wish to use the train rather than your car.
With all the above in mind, it is again possible to see why a debate is beginning to take place regarding the use of heritage locomotives on Britain’s mainline network. In my own humble opinion for what it is worth I believe there is, but not perhaps in the more populous areas of the UK such as around the large cities of northern England and an area encompassing the Midlands and the South East region. In regions such as the South West (where I live), North Wales and the regional lines of Scotland I feel there is a place for heritage rail tours and I certainly hope they will continue.
However, there certainly have been some very strong opinions against heritage rail tour operation expressed on social media and rail forum this week following the wooten basset spad. I would not wish to repeat some of those tweets and postings as this may endanger the blood pressure of many steam enthusiasts on the forum. But steam enthusiasts must realise that they are in the main regular rail users making those comments. The forgoing persons are the present and future of Britain’s rail industry and pay very high ticket prices for their travel. Therefore, their voices cannot be ignored as they will always carry a great deal of weight with any UK government in power.
Bill
Actually WCRC only own diesel locomotives. Almost all steam locomotives in this country (mainline or not) belong to private individuals (e.g. Jeremy Hosking, John Cameron) or locomotive owning societies (e.g. NELPG, A1 Steam Trust, RSLGT). It is the respnsibility of these owners and their Vehicle Acceptance Body (Basically an insurer) to ensure the locomotive is fit to run in the network. They then rent their locomotive to whoever wants to operate it, which is usually WCRC or DBS and occasionally DCR (The NYMR is also technically a mainline steam operator, but only in the section from Battersby to Whitby).
As regards delays, you may be correct to a small extent, but looking at lists of railtours online they are primarily at weekends (and thus not affecting commuters), with maybe two or three on weekdays every week at the height of summer. Compared to the volume of other traffic on the network any effect will be pretty negligible compared to delays caused by everything else.
Clearly there is a future in mainline steam, otherwise the Science Museum would not be spending millions on Flying Scotsman or the A1 Steam Trust trying to build a new P2 (etc. etc.)...
edh6 I believe you are perfectly correct in advising that WCRC do not own the steam locomotives they operate and therefore in my posting at #16 on this thread I should have stated “operated” and not “owned” in my references to the above companies locomotives. I also believe that all the mainline train operating companies lease all their operating consists from either Network Rail or the rail regulator I am not sure which. Where I would respectfully disagree with your above posting (if I interpret your wording correctly), would be where you state that it is the responsibility of the vehicle acceptance body to ensure the locomotive is fit to run.
It is always in all forms of land transport whether that be road or rail the responsibility of the day to day operator/driver of a vehicle to on each occasion before use, ensure that the vehicle is legally adequate for the purpose to which it is to be used. In the foregoing it is for the operator to ensure that the vehicle complies to all the requirements of highways or rail requirements act(s) and mechanically meets all requirements laid down under various legislative requisites encompassed in the above act(s). To put it or simply, if you are operating/driving any vehicle road or rail on the day something happens, the buck stops with you and no one else.
edh6, again I would respectfully wish to disagree With regard to paragraph 2 of your posting where you state that regular rail commuters are only affected to a “small extent” by the operations of the rail tour operators as they only run at weekends in the height of summer. I believe if anyone checks the schedules of all the mainline train operators they will quickly realise that Saturday operations especially almost exactly replicate Monday to Friday schedules. I will certainly accept Sunday schedules are considerably changed but this is normally on the direction of Network Rail to enable regular maintenance such as track inspection to be carried out. Even with the foregoing restrictions most mainline schedules compare very favourably by midday with the other six days of the week.
For a considerable number of years now Britain has not been a Monday to Friday nine two five economy. Weekend working now extends throughout many industries that were untouched until the mid-1990s. Seven-day working now is commonplace in the retail, call centres, utility company offices, distribution centres, mail and parcel hubs, the list is endless to add to the traditional industries of healthcare, power generation etc. I find in my own employment that even the offices of the clerk of the courts are available for contact on Saturday’s (if you know the numbers to ring), something that was unthinkable only a few years ago.
In other offices these days many full-time employees are given a “job brief” which does not relate to hours worked, but rather more to the extent of their responsibilities and the hours worked are “whatever it takes” to fulfil those responsibilities. Therefore many people still need to commute to their place of work at weekends and if they are not doing that they often still commute to town and city centres for shopping trips or personal entertainment etc. You will therefore find that Britain’s rail network is equally as busy at weekends (with perhaps the exception of early mornings) as they are any other day of the week. When it cost between £60-£100 British sterling to park a car for a day in central London, you will certainly wish to use the train rather than your car.
With all the above in mind, it is again possible to see why a debate is beginning to take place regarding the use of heritage locomotives on Britain’s mainline network. In my own humble opinion for what it is worth I believe there is, but not perhaps in the more populous areas of the UK such as around the large cities of northern England and an area encompassing the Midlands and the South East region. In regions such as the South West (where I live), North Wales and the regional lines of Scotland I feel there is a place for heritage rail tours and I certainly hope they will continue.
However, there certainly have been some very strong opinions against heritage rail tour operation expressed on social media and rail forum this week following the wooten basset spad. I would not wish to repeat some of those tweets and postings as this may endanger the blood pressure of many steam enthusiasts on the forum. But steam enthusiasts must realise that they are in the main regular rail users making those comments. The forgoing persons are the present and future of Britain’s rail industry and pay very high ticket prices for their travel. Therefore, their voices cannot be ignored as they will always carry a great deal of weight with any UK government in power.
Bill
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