So much for locked layers.

[sniper297]

http://www.trainsim.com/vbts/showthread.php?312599-Puzzle-switches

Trying to find a faster way to make better looking switches, I tried reversing the usual method. Normally I lay track, make switches, then create a new layer and lock the route layer so when I'm placing and aligning frog and checkrail objects I don't keep accidentally moving the nearby switches. Apparently that doesn't work in reverse. I tried making the additional layer first, placing the track objects, then locking that layer and changing back to the route layer to make the switches. Soon as the new spline vertex is created the checkrail or frog goes rocketing off to another vertex.

I suspect the problem is that track objects position data is not stored as coordinates, but as distance and direction from some nearby vertex, or possibly distance from one end of the spline that it's on. So locking the layer doesn't do anything, if the object is (for example) stored as 3.721 meters from the nearest vertex to the left and another vertex is created, it shoots over to 3.721 meters from the new vertex. As far as surveyor is concerned it hasn't actually moved, but since the reference point has moved it's in a different place in the world, same place on the track that's no longer where the track was before. This would explain a lot of weirdness when switchstands and signals jump all over the place, unless there's already a vertex between the track object and the new vertex you're making it changes the length of the existing ribbon of track.

 

[SharkNose]

Layers have caused me to come up with some new colorful metaphors to describe their annoying behavior. :n:

 

[sniper297]

Actually the only time I try to use different layers is when trying to do stuff like this, where you're always grabbing the wrong thing. My colorful metaphors all come from the tracklaying tool helper trying to anticipate which way I want the connecting track bent after i just finished straightening it.

 

[llebrez]

Don't feel lonely on this. I also have many problems with it. I can change objects in a route and it shows as it should in the session. But if I change a spline or track, who knows what would happen. Sometimes the spline starts and goes to infinite far in the map, or another spline get's "corrupted" somewhere else, or it joints to another spline. The whole thing is so confusing that I haven't been able to get the hand on it. Used to be that you change something in a route and it get's changed in the session. Very easy and logical. Now, for the sake of "improving", things border madness, and I don't like it. If anyone has some clue as to how we should replace assets, modify spline location, points, etc. please be precise as to how to do it without getting into trouble.. or losing routes (sometimes it happens). Oh! by the way, I only use one layer if you want to call a route and session that way, nothing else.

 

[sniper297]

Some "experts" will tell you always edit a route by editing a session, some say they always save as with a new name, for me the simplest thing is to edit a session by clicking the edit session button, edit a route by clicking the edit route button, stay out of the session layer while route editing, stay out of the route layer while session editing. It works for me, and while working on a route I save to CDP once a day with today's date appended to the filename. The way I understand it is having multiple route layers is useful for this type of thing, manipulating objects close to other objects when there's no precision "grab handle" to prevent moving the wrong object. It actually does work well within its limitations, the first post is one example of exceeding the limits. The other way works well, if you add and move frogs and checkrails normally it's all too easy for it to grab a switch and move that instead of the object you intended to move. So create new layer, lock the route layer, add the frog and checkrail objects in the new layer and you won't accidentally move a switch. Merge layers when finished. On the DLS;

American Flyer 1.1,<kuid2:522774:100852:1>

For an example of the finished product. Don't remember offhand how long that took, but for a bigger route I'm currently trying to find a faster way to add the frogs and checkrails to each switch - makes a difference when you have thousands of switches to do, this is just one failed experiment.

 

[JCitron]

Sniper,

This is the same exact method I use. It makes thing a heck of a lot easier. Remembering which mode I'm in though is a pain. It would be nice if there was a title bar or something that says which mode we're in. The other thing too is not get sidetracked and start fixning things we see in the session mode that should be done in the route mode. I've made that dumb mistake too.

John

 

[sniper297]

Yeah, when I'm editing a session I click the objects tab then immediately hit the question mark tool for configuring portals and industries, make sure I don't touch anything else. The trains tab is safe, but anything I see that I want to change other than trainsets, portal or industry configuration I make sure to save and exit the session and go in through the edit route button, then save and exit that when I want to go back to editing the session.

One exception to that rule, setting defaults for switches in a session - that automatically gets saved to the route layer. Change a switch so the default path for that session goes someplace else and you have to save - overwrite both route and session, so when I'm setting a default path with the switches I make sure I do NOTHING else while doing that.

Making some decent progress on this;

But to do the entire route I still have to find a faster way.