Install the app
How to install the app on iOS
Follow along with the video below to see how to install our site as a web app on your home screen.
Note: This feature may not be available in some browsers.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
You should upgrade or use an alternative browser.
Replacing the Acela Trains
- Thread starter masterowner
- Start date
Looks like it... but you can't even say the words "High Speed Rail" around a politician, especially a Republican because they think that any place except the northeast will not use the train. Not to mention congress still won't cut any waste (like their own wages maybe?). I mean some people are starting to use the train a lot more than flying or traveling by car because it is less of a hassle. But, HSR in the Northeast now? The GOP is just gonna say that it will be like the controversial California project which will probably be axed soon.
They're already working with Siemans in SF to replace the HHP-8 with the ACS-64.
I would note that this expenditure may just be for replacement of existing equipment as it ages beyond its "useful life". Indeed still usable, but people don't want to ride in something that will be close to twenty years old by the time new stuff is needed. I am quite certain that the NEC is one of Amtraks most profitable routes, carrying more than 50% (and I think closer to 80%) of the Megapolis N/S passenger traffic.
"Depreciation" is the word I was looking for, it might be assigned a life of 20 years and needs to be replaced, even if it is still usable. It's an issue created by the accountants, not the operation managers. A shop chair or table could last for half a century and the workers might not think about it, but it has "existed for longer than it was intended to", and so needs to be replaced.
And njmetsfan, HSR is the NEC, and the NEC is HSR. I will admit that HSR is a buzzword on the ranks, but Amtrak is on its way to covering 90% of its operating costs by 2014. Refer to paragraph 2: If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
I would note that this expenditure may just be for replacement of existing equipment as it ages beyond its "useful life". Indeed still usable, but people don't want to ride in something that will be close to twenty years old by the time new stuff is needed. I am quite certain that the NEC is one of Amtraks most profitable routes, carrying more than 50% (and I think closer to 80%) of the Megapolis N/S passenger traffic.
"Depreciation" is the word I was looking for, it might be assigned a life of 20 years and needs to be replaced, even if it is still usable. It's an issue created by the accountants, not the operation managers. A shop chair or table could last for half a century and the workers might not think about it, but it has "existed for longer than it was intended to", and so needs to be replaced.
And njmetsfan, HSR is the NEC, and the NEC is HSR. I will admit that HSR is a buzzword on the ranks, but Amtrak is on its way to covering 90% of its operating costs by 2014. Refer to paragraph 2: If it ain't broke, don't fix it.
Well that's the thing about the NEC. I still think it is HSR as well but for some reason, people wanna use the European model which defines HSR as 125mph and above in terms of average. I heard that Acela can go that speeds but because the NEC still uses older catenary and stuff along those lines, they can't average out those speeds in some of the dense stretches. But I know it is still possible even with the current Acela. There was word that Amtrak were doing higher speeds test in the section of track between Trenton and New Brunswick and they were rumored to be approaching the 150 and 160 mark around Princeton Jct. They aren't the first of course because the Metroliner prototype set the first speed record for the NEC of 156mph.
And on the if it ain't broke, don't fix it... we gotta remember, Amtrak is being funded not by profits (yet) but by the government and politicians control what sort of happens at times. Idk, I really don't trust the Dems or GOP nowadays...
And on the if it ain't broke, don't fix it... we gotta remember, Amtrak is being funded not by profits (yet) but by the government and politicians control what sort of happens at times. Idk, I really don't trust the Dems or GOP nowadays...
I would agree with that one, I do find it hard to believe that they are going to remove all of the acela sets and the HHP-8s from service. I find it kind of silly to replace the stuff that is only around ten year old or so. All of the equipment is in good working order to, so it is kind of pointless to remove it from service just to replace it.
Engineerkenny
New member
I hope they say no because I have never gotten to ride an acela but i have always wanted to and also acela rocks!
I would agree with that one, I do find it hard to believe that they are going to remove all of the acela sets and the HHP-8s from service. I find it kind of silly to replace the stuff that is only around ten year old or so. All of the equipment is in good working order to, so it is kind of pointless to remove it from service just to replace it.
I see the equipment being downgraded to regionals from the first-class "high speed" service. Either that or some commuter agency would buy the equipment.
John
I would note that this expenditure may just be for replacement of existing equipment as it ages beyond its "useful life". Indeed still usable, but people don't want to ride in something that will be close to twenty years old by the time new stuff is needed. I am quite certain that the NEC is one of Amtraks most profitable routes, carrying more than 50% (and I think closer to 80%) of the Megapolis N/S passenger traffic.
20 years is nothing in terms of trains, and why would you get rid of something if it still works, is still effecient to maintain and is up to OCH&S standards...
Jamie
20 years is nothing in terms of trains, and why would you get rid of something if it still works, is still effecient to maintain and is up to OCH&S standards...
Jamie
From what I read, Amtrak has looked into adding more Acela consists, but the capacity issues that these trains have just can't be justified by the cost of the new railcars. The Bombardier plan was one option and was going to be a stop-gap approach until they purchased the new equipment. Instead they chose to go for a new design to keep up with the ever increasing demand. This is a wise move as it would save money by getting the new equipment in right now rather than add more of the under-sized Acela consists and then getting ordering more new equipment later on.
I agree that 20 years isn't very long for trains. That's why I think they'll be trickled down to the Regionals and for commuter service.
John
If this is true, then I'll make a million dollars a year playing professional trombone. This won't happen anytime soon for one reason: the shape of the route is too curvy for a high speed train around the Washington to Philadelphia line. Plus I haven't seen any track work preparing for such a train.
Fred
Fred
20 years is nothing in terms of trains, and why would you get rid of something if it still works, is still effecient to maintain and is up to OCH&S standards...
Jamie
I agree absolutely! But, did the SD40 really properly survive until 1989? Not really, the SD60 was the latest and greatest and was bumping them the mainline really fast. I agree that the functional life is far beyond 20 years (#844!), but the accountants will demand numbers. The Amtrak F40 practicaly had their wheels run off from use before the Genesis program.
Hey buddy, you wanna buy a rebuild? Dirty little trick fer them accountants, ya know they can't control running costs, right? Yer keeping existing assests fit for use, don't ever mention yer replacing them! GP15-1 anyone?
Well then after seeing this a few things are of issue:
after seeing this video they only cut NYC to DC from 96 minutes To 84 minutes.
117 billion dollars,and what is powering this beast?is it still electric or is America going maglev?
and will this train be confined to the northeast area for the next 20 years?
what will happen to Acela?will it go to Comuter railroads like NJ?
are they gonna rip out all electric lines they put up or will they be sold to the railroads?
after seeing this video they only cut NYC to DC from 96 minutes To 84 minutes.
117 billion dollars,and what is powering this beast?is it still electric or is America going maglev?
and will this train be confined to the northeast area for the next 20 years?
what will happen to Acela?will it go to Comuter railroads like NJ?
are they gonna rip out all electric lines they put up or will they be sold to the railroads?
Last edited:
I agree absolutely! But, did the SD40 really properly survive until 1989? Not really, the SD60 was the latest and greatest and was bumping them the mainline really fast. I agree that the functional life is far beyond 20 years (#844!), but the accountants will demand numbers. The Amtrak F40 practicaly had their wheels run off from use before the Genesis program.
Hey buddy, you wanna buy a rebuild? Dirty little trick fer them accountants, ya know they can't control running costs, right? Yer keeping existing assests fit for use, don't ever mention yer replacing them! GP15-1 anyone?
It's interesting that you'd say that about the F40PH. The MBTA in Boston has just started retiring them. They were bought new the same time Amtrak bought there's. The MBTA units now have hanging fenders and rust spots like we used to see on old Dodge Darts from the 1970s. They sure got their, I mean our tax, money out of these units.
The SD40s still live on, albeit being displaced now on the Class 1s, as "new" units on the Class 2 Regionals and short lines. Pan Am Railways is still using those along with GP40s and GP9s on their lines.
John
amtrak2041864
High Speed Rail!!
Well people fail to consider with the track upgrade is the 165 test makes the difference because I think it pushes the track track to class 9 track 200mph permitted. Also they needed to buy new trainsets because the acelas can not reach 200mph. Class 9 track is between 161-200 because class 8 track is between 151-160. So that is the upside and by time they get here the track work should be done and we can go railfanning in prinction. And I think the manufacture of the trainsets may be Bombardier and the Zefiro trainset design. Very cool.Well that's the thing about the NEC. I still think it is HSR as well but for some reason, people wanna use the European model which defines HSR as 125mph and above in terms of average. I heard that Acela can go that speeds but because the NEC still uses older catenary and stuff along those lines, they can't average out those speeds in some of the dense stretches. But I know it is still possible even with the current Acela. There was word that Amtrak were doing higher speeds test in the section of track between Trenton and New Brunswick and they were rumored to be approaching the 150 and 160 mark around Princeton Jct. They aren't the first of course because the Metroliner prototype set the first speed record for the NEC of 156mph.
And on the if it ain't broke, don't fix it... we gotta remember, Amtrak is being funded not by profits (yet) but by the government and politicians control what sort of happens at times. Idk, I really don't trust the Dems or GOP nowadays...
Last edited:
Well people fail to consider with the track upgrade is the 165 test makes the difference because I think it pushes the track track to class 9 track 200mph permitted. Also they needed to buy new trainsets because the acelas can not reach 200mph. Class 9 track is between 161-200 because class 8 track is between 151-160. So that is the upside and by time they get here the track work should be done and we can go railfanning in prinction. And I think the manufacture of the trainsets may be Bombardier and the Zefiro trainset design. Very cool.
Actually, right when Amtrak got the Acelas fresh from Bombardier in 1999 they took a trainset out to a test track and it got up to 200 and was still accelerating when the officials said it was too fast for them. They had to put restrictors on the throttles! So I don't think that's why they bought new ones. Sucks to see all the old good NEC stuff go away though, first with the announcement of the ACS-64 and then this. I took a farewell-to-the-toasters railfanning trip to Jersey Avenue and appropriately got a good hornshow from one of the AEM-7s themselves.
They're replacing them because the current Acela and HHP-8 locomotives were one-offs from Bombardier, and, as a result, are becoming expensive to maintain.
Amtrak was considering purchasing 40 extra cars to expand Acela trainsets from six cars to eight, but Bombardier quoted a very high price for additional cars, since they were custom designs. Amtrak decided it would be more cost-effective just to replace them entirely.
I hope they go for Siemens Velaro trainsets, though it will take some serious lobbying to get the FRA to allow them to run on the NEC. However, since they are a standardized design used everywhere, maintenance costs will probably be kept in check for the foreseeable future.
Amtrak was considering purchasing 40 extra cars to expand Acela trainsets from six cars to eight, but Bombardier quoted a very high price for additional cars, since they were custom designs. Amtrak decided it would be more cost-effective just to replace them entirely.
I hope they go for Siemens Velaro trainsets, though it will take some serious lobbying to get the FRA to allow them to run on the NEC. However, since they are a standardized design used everywhere, maintenance costs will probably be kept in check for the foreseeable future.
MARC bought the HHP-8s too, so while I see why they are being replaced that might put Amtrak in a better position to get spare parts than with the Acela. Also, they might want to consider selling their HHP-8s and AEM-7s, or at least some of them, to MARC or any other commuter agency who might want them.
MARC bought the HHP-8s too, so while I see why they are being replaced that might put Amtrak in a better position to get spare parts than with the Acela. Also, they might want to consider selling their HHP-8s and AEM-7s, or at least some of them, to MARC or any other commuter agency who might want them.
lol just imagine Acela in NJ or Metra schemes...
Similar threads
- Replies
- 22
- Views
- 2K
- Replies
- 42
- Views
- 5K