point/switch jam

dzien50

New member
Hi I have a problem which I hope you can get the gist of.
I have a station area with a yard attatched and a shunter which sorts out wagons etc. There is a train due to arrive in the station under AI control, as I'm shunting the yard I find the main point to the platform, which the AI loco will arrive at jammed and I cannot get the shunter back off the main and into the yard unless I stop the AI schedule, now if this happened when the AI was close I could sort of understand it but it happens when the AI train is 14 boards away and 34 signals away, so I find this very frustrating and cannot think of how to overcome it. Has anyone any ideas ?
Thanks
PJ
 
I think this is a fail safe AI thing so that everything is set for them and only them. AI are not smart and dont think of other factors like shunters ect.

I think thats what it is. I dont know how to overcome it though. Sorry.

Cheers,
Adam
 
You could try to set the shunter to AI control to a track mark within the yard then after the shunter enters the yard area, take control back.
It's how I solve similar problems.

:)
 
The AI will take control of a junction well in advance of an approaching train. There is a 'Release Junction' driver command on the DLS here which you can include in sessions. When you need to control the junction just insert 'Release Junction' into the AI train schedule and you will be able to control the junction. This in no way impedes the progress of the AI train...

Andy :)
 
Without a screenie or map I can only hazard a guess at the track layout but you could sort it out by creating a "headshunt".This is a long siding which allows the shunter to shunt wagons without needing to occupy the main line.
 
Hi and thanks everyone for your suggestions, I've gone with Andy's release junction and it works a treat. Thanks again all.
PJ
 
Interesting situation described here. I've wondered about this with some of the maps I have. In terms of real simulation, seems to me that, helpful though it may be, Release Junction has its potential drawbacks and probably is not realistic. The other half of this equation is the use of many signals between turnouts.

There is not much point (and real danger) in entering a long stretch of road that has no turnouts, regardless of what local signals say, unless you know the whole line ahead is clear or has escape points - and that an opposing train heading toward but not yet on the uninterrupted line ahead will be stopped. But, no turnouts ahead means no escape points. If a train is already on the line ahead or cannot be stopped from entering it, where can another train headed in the opposite direction go, once it has entered the line?

Not having been a railroader, I can be all wet, but in a yard situation it appears to me that real yard operations are designed to stay off the main as much as possible and, especially, not to enter the main beyond the limits of the yard. In other words there will be an end-of-yard entrance to an arrival/departure track at each end, with adjoining classification tracks off to the side, as well as engine servicing, drill tracks, and so on. If a switcher needs to move across the main, then that should be done using crossovers between the turnouts at the ends of the yard. Unless it is very close, the AI train coming down the main toward the yard will only control the outside switch. And, if it is close enough to control an interior switch, you probably want to wait until it has passed through.

Regarding multiple signals along a line with no turnouts, I would like someone to explain to me why so many are in use on some routes. I suppose the issue is following another train headed in the same direction. What is done on a real railroad? What was done in the old days before radio communications? I suspect that train orders were given out at each station, and an engineer would know what was ahead or what to expect to be ahead -- whether to lay up and wait or whether to proceed at what speed. Unless there are some Rules to cover this situation, TRS does not offer the ability to give out station orders, but does allow the "engineer" (me) to look ahead on the map and see what to expect. That being the case, why use multiple signals between turnouts? Well, we can use Post Message and Wait for Message rules, but that is between engineers, not very realistic prior to what, the 1970's or so when radio communications became possible - even now, I suspect (but don't know) that communications pass between engineer and dispatcher, not between engineers.

Don't mean to be going off on a tangent from this thread, but I think it is all related and would appreciate some education on these points, especially as relates to real railroad practices - how it is really done in different time eras, not how to get around it in TRS.

Dick
 
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Hi Dick,

I think you are correct. The only circumstance I can think of in which multiple signals would be installed on unrelieved two-way track would be Centralized Traffic Control, where the dispatcher could actually follow the progress of the trains and remotely control the signals accordingly, which we don't have in Trainz. I believe that is why CTC can move traffic so much more efficiently than block signalled track.

Bernie
 
multiple signals

usually multiple signals along a plain section of track is to allow two (or more) trains to closely follow each other to increase line capacity, and also to provide protection of following trains so that if one ahead stops, the signal behind it will stay red and warn the next train. Most 'real' railroads will use this sort of signalling on double track (if the traffic on the line is heavy enough to warrant double track, its usually heavy enough to warrant signals). Even before radio communication automatic signalling was able to replace other systems of manual working (such as train order, or time interval).
 
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