New 'puter

Hi djt,

Yes you'r right on the socket number, maybe I'm getting dyslexic or something. I've gone for the i7 mainly because of other work I do and so I can multitask. I chose the ATI 5777 mainly because I read on other forums about 58xx users having trouble with the graphics in some games. Also I hope it will be future proof for about 4 years.

Cheers,
Bill69.
 
The i9 when it comes out will have 2 more cores they say. and it will to start will be clocked slower than the i7.
Click to expand...


As I said the i7 with “2 more cores” is already out but it’s not called an i9. The new six-core i7’s are the 980X and the 970.


Really what I was getting at is do you know how many cores trainz supppports.
Click to expand...

It doesn’t matter how many cores Trainz supports, it’s the architecture of the i7 that makes it perform better than previous CPU’s whether the game takes advantage of multiple cores or not.


It is recomended that 30 frames per second or more is enough.
Click to expand...

Recommended by whom?

The smoothest performance you are ever going to get out of any game is when the frame rate consistently matches the refresh rate of the monitor, which with an LCD monitor with a 60Hz refresh rate is 60 fps.

http://www.daniele.ch/school/30vs60/30vs60_1.html


I stick by my claim re ATI.
But I'm willing to be proved wrong.
Can you for me do this... In ATI CP move all the sliders to max and tick all the boxes as well. go to the Bath.... and find the pipgions session. I note that in the Bath layout there and parts of the engines that are missing and some of the wagons only show the couplings and shadows.... So have a look around the yard you are in. I have not tried for 6 months maybe the ATI guys have sorted it in their drivers which would be good. Please let me know if that works for you thanks
Click to expand...

You don’t have to “move all the sliders to max” in the CCC. With certain games (RailWorks for example) if you select “Adaptive” AA in the CCC it will completely filter out certain textures.

The simple fix obviously from looking at my screen shots is not to use “Adaptive” AA. The screens of RailWorks were taken with “Multi-sample” AA.
 
I'm not gioing to argue with you
clearly 60 frams is better than 30 frames. So you are right
for those of us in the business or those that can afford or want to spend that is great.
Less than 30 frames you can see stutter. Noone wants to see stutter so if you get a video card that dose 30 frames then you will be happy and have spent about 1/4 of what we spent on ours (well me on mine anyway).

As for ATI I'll stick with NVidia cause I want the max out of my video card (I spent enough on it). And you can turn off you AA thing and have a visually inferiour picture. It's the little groves in the rail that so away when you turn on the AA thing but then some of the engine and wagon textures are missing. So the issue is as stated you cannot get the max from ATI cards and your pictures when viewed at the size you took them show that clearly little groves on the track.
I think that we both have what we want.
You have the fastest card
I have the one that looks the best
Also for many users it's a mute point cause they don't know how to set up the ccc or nvidia panels anyway. I always set them up for people then they don't have to worry

cascaderailroad
1Tb machine only refers to the hard drive size and any / all trainz games will fit in that size.
Other things you need are CPU
and
Video your 8500 is not the best and is not what I would buy but it will run most maps ok if its got 512mb or more video ram
 
As for ATI I'll stick with NVidia cause I want the max out of my video card (I spent enough on it). And you can turn off you AA thing and have a visually inferiour picture. It's the little groves in the rail that so away when you turn on the AA thing but then some of the engine and wagon textures are missing. So the issue is as stated you cannot get the max from ATI cards and your pictures when viewed at the size you took them show that clearly little groves on the track.
Click to expand...


Wrong again, you really need to do some research about image quality between ATI and Nvidia.

I use the same “Multi-sampling” AA with the ATI 5870 as I use with the Nvidia GTX 285. You can go higher with “Super Sampling” AA with both Nvidia and ATI, but with a performance hit, although the last couple of driver revisions from ATI have greatly improved performance of SS/AA.

Maybe you could give us some screen shots of RailWorks to show us what the “grove-less” (what ever that is) track looks like with an Nvidia card. Make sure you use at least 8xAA and please mention the host that you uploaded your screen shots to.






You have the fastest card
I have the one that looks the best
Click to expand...



Correction, with the ATI 5870 and Super Sampling AA enabled, image quality does look better than Nvidia’s equivalent. I also have both a GTX 285 and a 5870 so I can compare the two.




Also for many users it's a mute point cause they don't know how to set up the ccc or nvidia panels anyway. I always set them up for people then they don't have to worry
Click to expand...


How do you “set them up for people then they don't have to worry”?

Different games require different control panel settings, there’s no “one size fits all” with game engines.




Anyway here are some more screens taken using “Adaptive”, “Multi” and “Super” Sampling AA.


The first group was taken using just ““Multi-sampling” AA, as you can see there is no missing texture problem –


http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/6852/screenshotbathgreenparkq.png


http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/5443/screenshotbathgreenparkip.png


http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/5342/screenshotbathgreenparkk.png


http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/8159/screenshotbathgreenpark.png


http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/2231/screenshotbathgreenparkz.png


http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/7002/screenshotcastlerockrai.png
 
 
I chose the ATI 5777 mainly because I read on other forums about 58xx users having trouble with the graphics in some games.
Click to expand...


No problems here with about 15-20 sims/games I’ve run with the 5870 so far.

The issues I have seen in various forums have been linked to the usual “botched” install that has shown up whenever a new video card is released.



Also I hope it will be future proof for about 4 years.
Click to expand...



Yikes, “4 years”, I’m lucky if I get 6-12 months out of a video card before something better comes out and I upgrade. Currently I’m looking at replacing the GTX 285 with the GTX 480.
 
djt said:
Yikes, “4 years”, I’m lucky if I get 6-12 months out of a video card before something better comes out and I upgrade. Currently I’m looking at replacing the GTX 285 with the GTX 480.
Click to expand...

Well that's ok, I presume you are still earning and computer parts are cheeper in USA than they are in NZ

Bill69
 
Bill69 said:
Well that's ok, I presume you are still earning and computer parts are cheeper in USA than they are in NZ

Bill69
Click to expand...
If he/she is throwing that stuff out there's plenty of takers for it. Now what's that old saying Bill, I can't quite remember what it is. More rings a bell!
 
Quote:
Originally Posted by djt


Yikes, “4 years”, I’m lucky if I get 6-12 months out of a video card before something better comes out and I upgrade. Currently I’m looking at replacing the GTX 285 with the GTX 480.


Bill69 said:
Well that's ok, I presume you are still earning and computer parts are cheeper in USA than they are in NZ

Bill69
Click to expand...

We hit this problem before. How much computer was enough? For TC and TRS2006 we actually came up with a solution to compare different hardware configurations.

http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showthread.php?t=14993&highlight=benchmarking

http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showthread.php?t=14714&highlight=benchmarking

http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showthread.php?t=17294&highlight=benchmark

Looks like we need to do it again for TS2010. It's too easy to just throw money at the problem or replace the video card every three months. I think my computers are on a five or six year cycle now and the video cards about a three year cycle. Should we have some sort of draw for who gets djt's six month old castoffs? Assuming of course he's giving them away for free?

I note that Tomshardware benchmarks show that an i3 may well be enough to keep an ATI 5850 fed.

Anyone feel like sorting out the batch file?:Y:

Thanks John
 
It's too easy to just throw money at the problem or replace the video card every three months.
Click to expand...


It is?
How is throwing money/hardware at a game with a dated game engine easy? Obviously if it was “easy” then everyone would be running the latest/greatest hardware and enjoying great performance.


Should we have some sort of draw for who gets djt's six month old castoffs? Assuming of course he's giving them away for free?
Click to expand...

I usually don’t have too much trouble selling it.


I note that Tomshardware benchmarks show that an i3 may well be enough to keep an ATI 5850 fed.
Click to expand...


The i3 can keep an ATI 5850 fed in what applications? Are they CPU dependent games or GPU dependent?

Like many I take everything I see at “Tomshardware-BS” with a grain of salt.
 
Email in windows 7

I have spent most of today setting up windows 7 on my new 'puter, I have installed TS2009 and updated it to build 41844. It runs great, no problems, very fast and smooth. But the one thing that is frustrating me, I can't find how to send and receive emails yet. I found the bit that tells me M/S outlook and outlook express are no longer included so I guess I have to find where to download an email program. If anyone can point me to a program that will allow me to use my existing email address I will be very thankfull.

Cheers,
Bill69


Downloaded Mozilla Thunderbird. Set up runs well can now send and receive emails.
Bill69
 
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haha no email
yes win 7 is like that
ms want you to buy office see
wait until you try to open a doc file
then can you use youtube yet
haha
No ofence bill just that is how pc's are
glad trains is working for ya
As for the millionair that replaces his bits thanks for posting this shot showing how ATI video card can look with some games
http://img254.imageshack.us/img254/554/screenshotcastlerockraim.png

Qudos to him though he knows how to avoid it. Bill you should ask him how to set up your video card. it will blow you away what a bit to tweaking and achieve

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g42/winjmoore/TrainzAAQuality.jpg

Check out this picture to see what I mean
 
winjmoore said:
haha no email
Qudos to him though he knows how to avoid it. Bill you should ask him how to set up your video card. it will blow you away what a bit to tweaking and achieve
Click to expand...


It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to move a slider in ATI’s Catalyst Control Center to “Multi” or “Super” sample AA. If a video cards control panel is that bewildering to you then I suggest you take up another hobby.

By the way this non-issue with ATI video cards and RailWorks was well documented at UKTrainsim going on two years ago.
 
djt said:
It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to move a slider in ATI’s Catalyst Control Center to “Multi” or “Super” sample AA. If a video cards control panel is that bewildering to you then I suggest you take up another hobby.
Click to expand...

It is not bewildering to me!

Bill69
 
Bill69 said:
I have spent most of today setting up windows 7 on my new 'puter, I have installed TS2009 and updated it to build 41844. It runs great, no problems, very fast and smooth. But the one thing that is frustrating me, I can't find how to send and receive emails yet. I found the bit that tells me M/S outlook and outlook express are no longer included so I guess I have to find where to download an email program. If anyone can point me to a program that will allow me to use my existing email address I will be very thankfull.

Cheers,
Bill69
Click to expand...

Windows Live Mail comes bundled with Win7 and seems to work for me just as well as Outlook Express ever did.


Bill69 said:
Downloaded Mozilla Thunderbird. Set up runs well can now send and receive emails.
Bill69
Click to expand...

Oh, too late then! Never mind. ;)

Paul
 
Actually Windows Live is a free download that is often clicked on when looking for the mail option. I don't know who told you to use thunderbirds but IT is a better choice.
 
winjmoore said:
Actually Windows Live is a free download that is often clicked on when looking for the mail option. I don't know who told you to use thunderbirds but IT is a better choice.
Click to expand...

Hi Win,

Yes I have windows live mail, but that is more like windows messenger was in XP. Not what I want.

Cheers,
Bill69
 
Bill69 said:
Hi Win,

Yes I have windows live mail, but that is more like windows messenger was in XP. Not what I want.

Cheers,
Bill69
Click to expand...

????
If you install windows live it comes with 7 maybe 8 components
messanger is what you were talking about. Mail is really what you need...
That is just 2 of the components.
BUT as I said stick with thunderbirds

Now as to the improveing ATI video card image quality how did you do that. I think you said you could manage it. Someone said you need to move some sliders
What did you do to improve it ????
 
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winjmoore said:
????
If you install windows live it comes with 7 maybe 8 components
messanger is what you were talking about. Mail is really what you need...
That is just 2 of the components.
BUT as I said stick with thunderbirds

Now as to the improveing ATI video card image quality how did you do that. I think you said you could manage it. Someone said you need to move some sliders
What did you do to improve it ????
Click to expand...

Hi Win,

Mainly adjusted the AA to 8x and the AAmode to quality, also bumped up the AF moved the mipmap to Quality. Removed all the ticks in the ' use application settings' boxes.

Cheers,
Bill
 
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