Long Meg Anhydrite trains

[Ringarooma]

Looking at the Summer 1961 Freight Timetable the following observations are interesting but confusing, or at least, apparently incomplete.

Movements associated with Long Meg can be summarised roughly as follows:

0500 (TuTh, 0645 S, 0705 MWF) Empties arrive at Longwathby, having left Walton (Cheshire) at 1145 the previous evening.
0605 (TuTh, 0720 MS, 0740 WF) Light Engine leaves Longwaithby for Kingmoor shed - What does it do for an hour? How do the empties get to Long Meg?

0630 Light Engine leaves Kingmoor shed for Longwaithby to depart at 0825 for Long Meg
0825 Longwaithby to Long Meg - (Light Engine + Empties?)

0900 Depart Long Meg for Walton (South) - Loaded train

1040 (S, 1102 M) Train arrives at Long Meg from Carlisle - Duran Hill (Yards?) to Long Meg - No comments provided: Are these empties from the north?

1117 (S, 1147 M) Train departs Long Meg for Carlisle London Rd Yard - are these loaded wagons for the North?

1157 Light Engine leaves Kingmoor shed for Longwaithby to depart at 1400 for Long Meg

1400 Light Engine Longwaithby to Long Meg -

1510 Depart Long Meg for Adlington (south) - Loaded Train

1736 Empties arrive at Longwaithby from Widnes - What happens to these? When do they go to Long Meg? Another set will arrive early next in the morning!!!

1835 Light Engine departs Longwaithby for Kingmoor shed

Does anyone have any actual records or operational experience relating to the scheduling and working of these trains?

Was there a resident company or BR shunter there or did a BR engine come from Carlisle?

As this traffic was such an important part of the S&C it would be good to understand hwo it really worked.

Any advice greatly appreciated.

 

[fran1]

The mine had its own saddle tanks which would go to/from the S+C.
Apparently it was only 400 yds to the S+C.

 

[stovepipe]

Try this:

Two loaded trains depart south each day - one at 0900 to Walton and one at 1510 to Adlington Jn (near Wigan). Walton empties return to Langwathby between 0500-0705 depending on which day. The Adlington (or Widnes) empties return to Langwathby in the evening arriving, 1736 SX and 2200 SO. (SX means every day but Saturday i.e 5 days a week, SO means only on Saturday). The rest are light engine movements to/from Kingmoor and trips to move wagons up from Langwathby to Long Meg.

There were also some wagons that went to Marchon Chemical Works (Whitehaven). The empties were tripped down from Durran Hill and full ones taken away to Carlisle London Road Yard for onward transit, on Saturday and Monday mornings only.

As the turn around time are short, a rake of empties would be dropped off, and an already loaded rake taken away. Loading being done by private shunter in the meantime.

There was also a couple of stopping freights that called at Long Meg - probably to drop off coal and maybe to collect and drop off cripples.

There were no trains on Sunday.

 

[Ringarooma]

Thanks for the informatin fran1 and Stovepipe

There are still some questions in all this:

Did the BR engines drop off/pick up at the Long Meg Sidings or at Longwathby? If at Long Meg, why does the timetable include reference to Longwathby? Why at Longwaithby and not at the Long Meg Sidings? The Long Meg sidings seem to be a better option to me! They have direct access from both directions.

There is no engine movement shown between the arrival of the evening and the next morning empties at Longwathby. There does not appear to be enough room at Longwathby - just the Down Refuge, and it might not be a good idea to have that full of empties on a regular basis.

If the empties were left at Longwathby, were they picked up 'as required' by the Long Meg shunter?

An interesting little puzzle.

 

[stovepipe]

I think maybe Langwathby had to be used for staging, as space looks at a premium at Long Meg, and would have likely all been needed for assembling and storing the loaded trains.

The early morning empties were only at Langwathby for between 1hr20 and 3hr25, so they could of probably been left on the road adjacent to the goods shed. That would mean the evening empties could stand in the down refuge until collection at 1400 the next day.

There are instances of privately owned locos running on the mainline, but I can't see that it would have been needed at Long Meg.

The Mondays Only operation between 7-11am would make a good basis for a session I think.