Hardware and configuration for Trainz 12

[Euphod]

I'm approaching that time where I make a new build, as I feel hardware has finally improved enough to justify spending some money to see some improvement in game play. I don't follow new hardware on a consistent basis, but I do investigate it once in awhile to see how advanced it has become, so I'm confident many of you will be more knowledgeable than I.

I believe we have established that more than two cores is a waste for a Trainz purpose built processor.

I further believe we have established that solid state drives are superior in data transfer to other drives.

Have we established the best place to install Trainz, either on the same or a different drive from the OS drive?

I don't care for AMD or ATI; I'm an Intel and Green sort of guy, so bearing that in mind what are your thoughts toward a new build, if you were going to pull the trigger within the next few months? I'm not looking to go bleeding edge, but if you were to separate all components into quarters, and consider the top tier, newest selection to be the 75 to 100 % group, I'm looking more at the 50 to 75% group.

Any thoughts welcome.

 

[RRSignal]

Hey Ed, Merry Christmas,

It's kind of tough to decide between i5 and i7, though I'd opt for an i7; otherwise I'd go AMD. Since that's not your cup of tea, that's a non-issue. Both are quad-core. Although you can't really take advantage of all four at the moment, it should provide a bit of futureproofing. I'm comfortable enough with SSD to make it my boot and Trainz drives. I would definitely keep a large HDD for backups and other, not-so-speed-intensive work. As for whether or not it's better to keep Trainz and the boot drive separate, I'm not sure it matters, though if I were doing it now, and assuming I was using as 120Gb SSD, I'd set up a 60Gb boot drive and a 60Gb Trainz drive, or maybe do it 40/80 as a safety. As I PLAN to do it, I'd get a 240, again using 60Gb for the boot drive and the remainder for Trainz, FSX and a few of my professional programs. I'd still run MSTS and many other proggies on the mechanical drive.

 

[fran1]

I've always had trainz separate from the o/s.
Each version in it's own partition of a drive.
Allowing 80gig per version should ensure you never have less than 15% free space on the drive/partition for defragging.
Dual core/core duo, I tend to agree with you but I'm noticing 75% usage on mine (intel 3.16 core duo) when using all steam locos. 10-15% higher than diesel locos, same route and stock. This is with the session in full swing with about 15-18 Ai's following schedules. FPs steady at around 20.
Never noticed more than 3.5 gig memory being used so 4 should be ample.

 

[CRO]

By no means a computer geek, I, like you, run a 50-75% system which I have just upgraded over the years as new releases required..
According to my readings on these forums, TS2012 is optimised for multiple cores, but I believe the CPU still does a lot of the graphics work - I could be wrong.
I run Win7 (64bit), Intel dual core quad at 2.56.ghz, 4g RAM, 2xWestern Digital Caviar drives and an Nvidia 9800GTX 1024mb video card. I get good frame rates with little stuttering except very in high density areas, e.g. ECML Kings Cross with lots of AI. The bottle neck I believe is the graphics card - I am updating as part of my Xmas pressies (still to come). My budget will allow me to look maybe at the GTX 460/470 cards.
I have had no problems with installing onto the default location - in my case C:\Progrtam Files (x86)\N3V\TR2012. I also have TS2010 on the same drive but its default location was C:\Progrtam Files (x86)\Auran\TR2010.
The only down side I see with this is that when I use the DLS, CM3.3 (TS2010) comes up as the default, not CM3.6 (TS2012).
I have a 2nd Western Caviar for all my other programs and keep the C: drive for System and Trainz.

You did say "..any thought welcome"... :hehe:

Bob (CRO)

 

[Euphod]

I think you're going to like the GTX460. I just bought one a week ago when I was certain that it was a faulty GPU that was crashing my system. I took out the old 8800 and put in the 460 and.... nothing.

After much gnashing of teeth and rending of garments it turned out to be a bad stick of RAM (first Corsair that has failed me yet).

Anyway, I left the 460 in there, even though my current board isn't PCIE2, and it still is a far and away improvement over the 8800. I'll keep the 460 for now in the new build, and then replace that when the 570s come down in price.

 

[steamboateng]

Euphod, if your into content creation/reskinning you may want to opt for a quad core processor, as these support running multiple apps at the same time.
I'm running an i7 950, 3.06 GHz processor, which is overclocked to 3.99 GHz, a clock which these processors can easily and safely handle. To faclitate long life, I stuck a Noctua NH D-14 cooler on top of the processor. This is a huge cooler, w/2x140 mm fans. Even in summer, the cores rarely reach 45 deg. C.
As I had my computer built with the intent of keeping it for a long time, (10 years) I stressed quality components, and included a big psu (1000w) for future expansion. I have 6 GB DDR3, 1600MHz ram, and a GTX 570 gpu. The OS is MS WIN 7, Home Edition. This system is a higher end, mid range rig, at best, but I'm sure it will handle all my needs for years to come. I run Trainz and the OS on an Intell 80 GB SSD, which is cutting it close. I plan to toss in another 120GB Intell SSD soon, just for Trainz. All other programs run on a 1TB WD Caviar Black, (64MB Cache) at 7200 rpm.
I've had this system for about a year, now, and have experienced no problems whatsoever.

 

[johnwhelan]

I'm approaching that time where I make a new build, as I feel hardware has finally improved enough to justify spending some money to see some improvement in game play. I don't follow new hardware on a consistent basis, but I do investigate it once in awhile to see how advanced it has become, so I'm confident many of you will be more knowledgeable than I.

I believe we have established that more than two cores is a waste for a Trainz purpose built processor.

I further believe we have established that solid state drives are superior in data transfer to other drives.

Have we established the best place to install Trainz, either on the same or a different drive from the OS drive?

I don't care for AMD or ATI; I'm an Intel and Green sort of guy, so bearing that in mind what are your thoughts toward a new build, if you were going to pull the trigger within the next few months? I'm not looking to go bleeding edge, but if you were to separate all components into quarters, and consider the top tier, newest selection to be the 75 to 100 % group, I'm looking more at the 50 to 75% group.

Any thoughts welcome.

I'm not certain we have established TS12 only uses 2 cores. TS2010 I agree and even then it will use more than two cores for CMP or whatever its called. I'd go quad for the difference in price.

Cheerio John

 

[nfotis]

@Euphod:

If you wish to buy in the next two months, a proposal would be:

- Intel 2500K CPU
- Z68 chipset motherboard
- Nvidia 560ti (or 570, if you have the money)
- 2*4 GB RAM (1600 MHz)

In the spring, we expect the Ivy bridge CPUs, I would expect the 3500K CPU to be a nice improvement over the 2500K.
Don't know if a future chipset would be a serious improvement over the Z68.
Nvidia future GPUs are still an unknown on speed/cost/power consumption.

for hard disks, prices are still very high due to Thailand floods (and I have read that Seagate and WD decided to reduce their warranty duration to one year in most of their lines)
If money was not a problem, I would go for a hardware RAID 10 controller (or RAID 5), like the ones by 3ware, getting capacity AND speed.

Cheers,
N.F.

 

[Euphod]

I do appreciate everyone's opinion, it won't be but a few months now. My current rig is going to go to my son, once I manage to stuff all the demons back in the box. That's proving to be a larger boulder to push than I thought!

 

[SuperFudd]

OK then.
My opinions:
An i7 rather than an i5 is a waste of money, clock speeds being equal, unless you are using certain professional (non game ) software.
A video card better than a GTX550 is a waste of money on Trainz.
I hear running Trainz on a drive not containing your OS is a good idea but I am satisfied using one drive.

 

[JCitron]

Ed,

All the different opinions and recommendations are just that. So, having said that I'll throw in mine!

Whenever I upgrade my PC, I go with the best that I can afford at the time. I'll get the fastest, newest processor within my budget, best video card, motherboard, etc. In general I end up with a fairly high-end system that is also a bit future proof so I don't end up upgrading every two years, but instead perhaps 3 to 4, depending up on what the future looks like with the operating system, programs, etc. I have followed this process since I started purchasing and building PCs, and this process for me started in 1986 or thereabouts. Prior to that date, I had two prebuilt systems that were proprietary hardware and could not be upgraded. It was this latter aspect that made me think about my process because you want to be flexible and go with the future rather than get stuck with something that's going to be obsolete completely in a year.

There are other things to take into consideration besides budget of course. There is the purpose of the machine. PCs today are very versatile, so building a system just to use Trainz is really a waste of hardware. Building a system that allows you to also make 3d models, run other programs quickly, and use Trainz without too many or no stutters is the way to go.

So in the end, don't shoot yourself in the foot, and build a bottom-end machine. Put something together that's near the upper middle if you can afford it. This will get you a lot further on what you'll spend, and will be less frustrating performance wise in the long run.

John

 

[Euphod]

Allow me to give air to my frustrations, please, if you would be so kind.

I have a particularly nasty problem right now. A couple of weeks ago I experienced a crash on my current build. I believed the crash was caused by my old GeForce 8800 deciding to give up the ghost. I replaced the offending GPU with a new one, but upon start up, it did not. In anguish I began removing components from the mobo to try and track the problem. Removing two sticks of RAM allowed for a start up, but the OS was hosed on C. I installed the OS on D to allow me to rescue any files that weren't backed up already. I ordered and received replacement RAM matching the RAM that was faulty. Reasoning that the faulty RAM caused the crash, I replaced the RAM and the old GPU, believing the GPU was probably not at fault in the first place. Upon start up, it did not.

I replaced the GPU with the new one, and removed the new RAM, and the start up was successful. I reformatted and installed the OS on C, but now the OS is not recognizing the D drive, Programs aren't reinstalling correctly, and I'm having a world of issues with minor programs that were never a problem.

At this point I'm thinking the MOBO is hosed to some degree. I should (and will) reinstall the RAM to see if the slots are bad, and if it effects the new GPU somehow. I'm afraid this MOBO will need replacement just to achieve a solid CURRENT build. Once that is achieved, this build will go to my son. His current build will come back to me so that he can play his games that are not compatible with Windows 7. My new build will use 7.

Now I am looking at building two boxes, basically, and I've been asked to cobble together a third for photos for the Ex-wife, so that she will not have to use my son's PC, because he is getting very territorial.

Sigh... it looks to be a busy building winter for me.

I classify PCs into the following categories: 75-100% (cutting edge, could last 7 - 10 years in usefulness), 50-75% (5-7 years), 25-50% (2-5 years) and 1-25% (2 years at best).

I'm going to build a 50-75% machine, but if it was based on what I could afford, it would be a lesser machine than what I have now!:hehe:

 

[lewisner]

Regarding the CPU my attitude is this.
My previous build was "good enough" for Trainz but when it came to recording and editing videos it was seriously lacking.
With an i7 2600K those problems are gone.
I dig war themed video games and I can run Battlefield 3 on Ultra settings and achieve 55 FPS which is no mean feat.
Put it another way; lets say you bought a 2 seater sports car to run you and your missus about. Later you decide to run her and the the 2 kids and dog about. The 2 seater is now useless.
What I'm saying is that spare capacity may seem a waste now but it may come in handy later?

Regarding your problem with the RAM I had a similar problem with my first and it turned out that the RAM I had used was "generic" and (since I was using it on an ASUS motherboard) it was not on the QVL (Qualified Vendors List) for that mobo. I obtained RAM from the QVL and all problems disappeared.