Discrepancies of the build of an item and its dependencies

Frank_Dean

Well-known member
Discrepancies with the build of a wagon, train or other object with its dependencies.

This is a problem that although it is not very usual, is somewhat annoying for those nostalgic who do not use the latest version of Trainz available, and has an easy solution by not using or deleting the items that we downloaded with errors or unknown dependencies.

I am very clear that Trainz is a business that feeds its owners and employees with new sales and that in theory we should only use the latest version.
Currently in N3V is sold: TANE, 2019 and 2022 and in STEAM the same and also 2012, so if old versions of Trainz are sold, why not respect the builds in which the assets were built?
I am referring to the fact that if you upload or update a content with a build X, its dependencies to work have to be the same build x or lower, never higher.

The problem I am going to describe does not exist if you only use Trainz 2022, it is only if you use 2019,TANE or 2012.
There are more similar cases, but I will give only two examples of two authors who this year have uploaded their creations to the DLS. I have no desire to criticize the authors, but only to inform those who are interested. These authors have tested their wagons in 2022, with a lower Build, and as they work, they do not realize that if someone downloads and installs them in older versions they will not work, even though they have downloaded with a correct build for their version.

Example first, freight cars, with a Build 4.6 or 2019:

<kuid2:60238:39652:1> ATSF 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39674:1> Canadian Nationa 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39673:1> Chesapeake & Ohio 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39653:1> Conrail 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39671:1> Milwaukeec Road 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39651:1> Northern Pacific 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39672:1> Southern Pacific 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39654:1> Penn Central 40 foot Boxcar

They don't work in Trainz 2019, because they need the dependency:
<kuid2:523:19723699:1> Fruit and Vegetables Build 4.6, which is not in the DLS but is an internal dependency of Trainz 2022 and is not in 2019.

Second example, freight cars, with a Build 3.5 or Trainz 2012.

<kuid2:60238:39652:1> ATSF 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39674:1> Canadian Nationa 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39673:1> Chesapeake & Ohio 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39653:1> Conrail 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39671:1> Milwaukeec Road 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39651:1> Northern Pacific 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39672:1> Southern Pacific 40 foot Boxcar
<kuid2:60238:39654:1> Penn Central 40 foot Boxcar

They do not work in Trainz 2019, TANE or 2012 because they need the dependencies:
<kuid2:523:19723699:1> Fruit and Vegetables Build 4.6
<kuid2:523:19723702:2> Hardware Build 4.6
which is not in the DLS but are internal Trainz 2022 dependencies.


All the previous wagons can be used in 2019 if we look for those two dependencies in 2022 and install them in 2019, I have tested it and it is possible, both in TANE and in 2012 they do not work.

I apologize to the two authors mentioned if you feel offended or annoyed, I only intend to inform those who are interested, that the Build for which they were created has not been respected.

The solution is easy and quick, just use the wagons in 2022, as they work perfectly.

I apologize if any important meaning has been lost in the translation.
 
What you've said is perfectly clear with nothing lost in translation. Part of the problem is there's no way to know if an asset is built-in, or to which version the dependency actually belongs easily due to the various versions being included in built-in assets or DLC.

In Surveyor we have that color-coding but there's no way of knowing in Content Manager at a glance unless all the columns are displayed and that has to be done manually. Having assets color-coded in Content Manager similar to Surveyor when that option is enabled would be helpful in knowing if something is from the DLS, built-in, or DLC, or neither. Making the asset-version column more prominent, perhaps bold, or the ability to make any particular column bold, would go far.

In addition to the issue you have mentioned, we have another that has cropped up more often than not lately. As users have created newer assets, they create them at 3.5 or 3.7 build to avoid the stricter requirements of newer build-versions. These "TS12" assets are not really TS12 assets because they call up newer dependencies with build 4.6 or higher. This causes TS12 users to run into missing dependencies because there are no substitutes for these. The way to solve this would be to build into the rules error-checking that any asset must use dependencies that are at the same or below the version of the asset and not allow newer asset-versions.
 
for <kuid2:523:19723702:2> Hardware Build 4.6, the back version <kuid2:523:19723702:1> is available via "list Asset Versions, but it is also version 4.6. Unfortunately, the originals for both are unknown. Is that because they are paid DLC?
 
... As users have created newer assets, they create them at 3.5 or 3.7 build to avoid the stricter requirements of newer build-versions. These "TS12" assets are not really TS12 assets because they call up newer dependencies with build 4.6 or higher. This causes TS12 users to run into missing dependencies because there are no substitutes for these. ...
Guilty as charged. I do this all the time when I need a new version of one of my existing objects. I copy all the source files to a new folder, apply a newer KUID, make the needed changes to the mesh and voilà, a new (old) object. I know it works in my latest Trainz22PE. Never verified if it also works in the original version since I don't work in there. As for dependencies, the original worked so the new one works too, at least in my setup.
 
for <kuid2:523:19723702:2> Hardware Build 4.6, the back version <kuid2:523:19723702:1> is available via "list Asset Versions, but it is also version 4.6. Unfortunately, the originals for both are unknown. Is that because they are paid DLC?
<kuid2:523:19723699:1> Fruit and Vegetables
<kuid2:523:19723702:2> Hardware
They are not included in Trainz 2019 Platinum, but they can be taken from 2022 and installed in 2019.
The above 2 kuids have a Trainz 2022 built-in status, and are dependent on:
Code:
<kuid2:661281:35115:4> Custom 40' Boxcar - #4
<kuid2:661281:110099:2> Tutorial 03 - Switching
<kuid2:661281:200019:8> Content Samples #1
<kuid2:661281:35112:4> Custom 40' Boxcar - #1
<kuid2:661281:35113:4> Custom 40' Boxcar - #2
<kuid2:661281:35114:4> Custom 40' Boxcar - #3
<kuid2:661281:35116:4> Custom 40' Boxcar - #5
<kuid2:661281:35117:4> Custom 40' Boxcar - #6
<kuid2:661281:35119:3> Custom 40' Boxcar - #7
<kuid2:661281:35120:3> Custom 40' Boxcar - #8
<kuid2:661281:67532:1> TRS22 - Additional Content Package
<kuid2:661281:110093:1> 01 Highland Limited
<kuid:661281:110094> 02 Local Freight
<kuid:661281:110095> 03 Dispatchin' the Action
<kuid:661281:67536> TRS22 - MPS Package
<kuid:661281:110096> 04 Multiplayer Session
<kuid2:661281:200039:9> Kickstarter County 2 (TRS22)
<kuid2:661281:110098:3> Tutorial 02 - Junctions
<kuid2:661281:110100:2> Tutorial 04 - Industry
<kuid2:661281:110102:2> Tutorial 06 - Objectives
<kuid2:661281:110103:3> Tutorial 07 - Realistic Mode
<kuid2:661281:110106:2> Tutorial 10 - Steam
<kuid2:661281:110101:3> Tutorial 05 - Signals
<kuid:204652:100020> Basic Session
All of the above have Built-in status in 2022.
 
Guilty as charged. I do this all the time when I need a new version of one of my existing objects. I copy all the source files to a new folder, apply a newer KUID, make the needed changes to the mesh and voilà, a new (old) object. I know it works in my latest Trainz22PE. Never verified if it also works in the original version since I don't work in there. As for dependencies, the original worked so the new one works too, at least in my setup.
Your assets most likely work fine if any dependencies are the same or at a lower version.

The issue is attaching newer-build dependencies to TS12-build assets. A locomotive, for example, is no longer installable in TS12 even though it's listed as a version 3.7 asset due to the bogies being used are 4.6 version and there are no 3.7-version available.
 
..

The issue is attaching newer-build dependencies to TS12-build assets. A locomotive, for example, is no longer installable in TS12 even though it's listed as a version 3.7 asset due to the bogies being used are 4.6 version and there are no 3.7-version available.
Not to belabour the point but if an asset is tagged to be version 3.7, that should mean that ALL parts of it are also version 3.7 including every dependency and required feature.
 
Not to belabour the point but if an asset is tagged to be version 3.7, that should mean that ALL parts of it are also version 3.7 including every dependency and required feature.
You can always switch the dependencies. The alternative is assets only get released in the latest version.

Cheerio John
 
Back
Top