Curve radius issues w/ screenshots

[jfriedrich]

Hi All,

I am slowy working on my route, and I have discovered an issue.

This is a Jointed Rail CSX CP38-2 and a 60ft box car

Same GP38-2 and a 50ft Box Car

This occurs on a lead into an industry on my route. I have been extremely cautious in creating gentle smooth radius's but evidently what I'm doing is not enough. Its even worse with 6 axle power. Is there a better way to do curves? templates on the DLS?

Thanks For any help and suggestions,
Regards,
Jordan

 

[oknotsen]

I think this is unavoidable as it is just part of the assets. Those things are not really connected.

 

[wreeder]

That curve looks pretty sharp to me. There are curve templates on the DLS. I like the ones by Mr. Den. Search for username Mr.Den or Name = Guide Curve under TRS2004 assets.

Here is the instructions for using the yard guide. The curve guides are just reference guides for placing spline points.

http://www.animalomnibus.com/trainz/Yard_Guide.pdf

William

 

[jfriedrich]

Thanks wreeder the help is much appreciated. Those templates are great, how do you do shorter curves with them though? Is there templates on the DLS for switches/turnouts?

Regards,
Jordan

 

[jordon412]

_mutton_ and Natvander made some turnout templates, while I believe that stationmistress made some yard ladder guides. Whenever I make switches, I use the built-in (in Trainz 12) 'S_' switches for #9, #11, wyes, crossovers, yard ladders, while the 'switch' switches for #7 switches and #9 and #11 single and double-slip switches. For curves, I use the built in 'FT' track.

 

[jfriedrich]

thanks jordon412

 

[bendorsey]

Probably the only way to get couplers to swivel to properly follow cures would be to attached them to the bogeys like taglo trucks. Prototypical in a few instances but generally speaking not.

80 foot long passenger cars aren't designed for super sharp curves, lol.


Ben

 

[KingConrail76]

Probably the only way to get couplers to swivel to properly follow cures would be to attached them to the bogeys like taglo trucks. Prototypical in a few instances but generally speaking not.

80 foot long passenger cars aren't designed for super sharp curves, lol.


Ben

Gotta go with Ben on this one. The Couplers of the assets do not "swing" as they should, and the longer the overhang from Bogie center to coupler face, the worse the look. There must be a way to animate couplers/draft gear.

In MSTS, the Coupler could be made a "Child" of the Bogie, and thus would "swing" left and right, as the bogie rotated to follow the track. It was by no means perfect, but much better than the screenies above.

Since currently in Trainz, the coupler is either a part of the cars mesh (fixed to the car, and no appearent way to animate), or a completely seperate mesh (there are some "coupler" assets on the DLS**), there is no way to tie them directly to the motion or axis of the bogie...

One solution would be to have the coupler as a part of the bogie mesh, but the problem with this solution is that every variation of overhang length would need individual bogies for each end of the car...that's a lot of bogies to rebuild and/or model.

** The coupler assets on the DLS; I've never investigated them thoroughly, so I'll ask, They get "attached" to the car/loco by means of a "Bogie" attachment point...Do they follow the track like a bogie, or is there something about them, in their Config maybe, keeping them from following the trackwork?...or is this the solution, already available to use for cars/locos without the coupler as part of it's own mesh?

 

[cascaderailroad]

I use straightened track, the ruler to get a radius, and insert extra spline points.
I also use FT turnouts or animated switches as a template, to lay single track over top of, the delete the FT turnouts.
My high speed crossovers are @ 400' long, and branch line switches are @ 150' long.
I also use straight edges of straightened track
Of course this may not solve the problem of couplers not swiveling.
http://i525.photobucket.com/albums/cc339/cascaderailroad/Screen_006-16_zps78fe5bd3.jpg
http://i525.photobucket.com/albums/cc339/cascaderailroad/Screen_001-43.jpg

 

[TRam__]

Do they follow the track like a bogie, or is there something about them, in their Config maybe, keeping them from following the trackwork?

No, it is impossible. Meshes are used for simulation of coupled/uncoupled brake pipes or buckles(couplings).

 

[wreeder]

Thanks wreeder the help is much appreciated. Those templates are great, how do you do shorter curves with them though? Is there templates on the DLS for switches/turnouts?

Regards,
Jordan

Search for 3Dtrains in the title field. Frogpipe updated the switch guides from 3D Trains that I have used since the first version of Trainz. Instructions for their use are here: http://www.animalomnibus.com/trainz/ProToolz.html

With any curve template, just use as many spline points as you need but remember to use the straighten tool on the first piece of straight track at either end of the curve.

William

 

[VinnyBarb]

Snip.....Gotta go with Ben on this one. The Couplers of the assets do not "swing" as they should, and the longer the overhang from Bogie center to coupler face, the worse the look. There must be a way to animate couplers/draft gear. Since currently in Trainz, the coupler is either a part of the cars mesh (fixed to the car, and no apparent way to animate), or a completely separate mesh (there are some "coupler" assets on the DLS**), there is no way to tie them directly to the motion or axis of the bogie...

One solution would be to have the coupler as a part of the bogie mesh, but the problem with this solution is that every variation of overhang length would need individual bogies for each end of the car...that's a lot of bogies to rebuild and/or model.

** The coupler assets on the DLS; I've never investigated them thoroughly, so I'll ask, They get "attached" to the car/loco by means of a "Bogie" attachment point...Do they follow the track like a bogie, or is there something about them, in their Config maybe,

keeping them from following the trackwork?...or is this the solution, already available to use for cars/locos without the coupler as part of it's own mesh?

How about:

If a coupler is created and set up as a bogey, with an "invisible" half of the coupler mesh extended into the car or locomotive frame, so the coupler (which now is a bogey) swivels realistically there where in reality a coupler is attached to the frame. With the other end of the coupler (the visible end) pointing away from the frame getting centered in the middle of the tracks (being now a bogey), then all such created couplers should stay together and stay attached when turning around a curve of the tracks.

All that is needed now is to get the a.limfront and a.limback attachment points inserted in the bogie/couplers where they need to be and the other car or locomotive bogies, (the real ones) configured right, so all bogies including the bogie couplers are working correctly.

With the couplers attaching these to the bogies, as pointed out above, well, that could work somewhat if bogies are very close towards any end of a car or locomotive but in reality, the real bogies are further away, more towards the middle of such car or locomotive and behave a little unrealistic around curves if so created, being attached to the real bogies. Believe me, I tried this setup too in the past but found this a bit unrealistic looking and behaving.

I know that the above will work as in the past I created such couplers and showed these here in the forum quite some time ago but I never released any of that work I created. Other creators have done similar with couplers where no animation is needed for the above way of setting up such coupler bogies and I guess, some of their work is still on the DLS.

Just a thought

VinnyBarb

 

[ZecMurphy]

Hi All
There are some assets that have the couplers setup as bogies. However, there are some issues to 'basic' setups such as this. First is that each bogie has an effect on the physics in Trainz, so adding the extra bogies will require you to create custom physics to ensure your wagon is handled correctly. Second is that the coupler will swing even if it's not coupled to a vehicle.

You may also find that, on tighter curves or longer vehicles, your coupler 'clips' through the carriage body.

Through script, it would be possible to create couplers that swap from a 'static' 'uncoupled' mesh (attached, via an attachment point, to the 'body') to a 'bogie' coupled mesh. This would allow the coupler to swing when coupled, but when uncoupled would remain static (it would, however, centre itself).

We would recommend using the 'ACS' coupler system by Bloodnok/JamesMoody for any coupler scripts. This is the 'official' script, as used with our DLC packs. It does require that all vehicles be setup with the appropriate tags for couplers and brake hoses to work. I believe James has an update in the works that may improve this, however brake hoses will require the tags to be in the other vehicles for them to animate (this is to account for vehicles with either 'uncoupled' brake hoses, or completely lacking brake hoses).

Regards

 

[VinnyBarb]

As hardly any cars/coaches or locomotives are set up with such above created couplers, it remains problematic as having only one or 2 such set up items in a consists and the rest having downloaded content not with such created coupler "bogies". That was behind my decision not to release such set up in the first place.

AURAN/N3V Games should have created such couplers in the first place a long time ago, as described above by Zec Murphy, preferably for TRS04 already and should have made these "couplers" mandatory for each car/coach or locomotive since then. It is much too late now to rectify this as blind Freddy can see, no one is going to update the whole not so equipped cars/coaches and locomotives fleet on the DLS.

My opinion

VinnyBarb

 

[KingConrail76]

As hardly any cars/coaches or locomotives are set up with such above created couplers, it remains problematic as having only one or 2 such set up items in a consists and the rest having downloaded content not with such created coupler "bogies". That was behind my decision not to release such set up in the first place.

AURAN/N3V Games should have created such couplers in the first place a long time ago, as described above by Zec Murphy, preferably for TRS04 already and should have made these "couplers" mandatory for each car/coach or locomotive since then. It is much too late now to rectify this as blind Freddy can see, no one is going to update the whole not so equipped cars/coaches and locomotives fleet on the DLS.

My opinion

VinnyBarb

We may not correct all items on the DLS over night, but if new assets are created, I think from this point forward, that the system should be utilized and expanded.

 

[jfriedrich]

Search for 3Dtrains in the title field. Frogpipe updated the switch guides from 3D Trains that I have used since the first version of Trainz. Instructions for their use are here: http://www.animalomnibus.com/trainz/ProToolz.html

With any curve template, just use as many spline points as you need but remember to use the straighten tool on the first piece of straight track at either end of the curve.

William

Thanks again william, for steering me towards these templates, they will be of much assistance. As well thanks to everyone else for their assistance and advice into creating smoother radii and turnouts.

Didn't expect to see this thread evolve into a scripting discussion but I'm glad it did. That way stuff can be sorted out. All I was looking for was advice in creating smoother radii/turnouts to avoid or reduce this as much as possible.

Thanks again guys,
Jordan

 

[davesnow]

My solution..... Don't look at the couplers when you're on a curve! Heeheeheehee!

 

[cascaderailroad]

Now that you mentioned it ... I will probably notice this forever ... As when someone told me about the Musak music in the elevator, or shopping store ... now I can't stop hearing it, and it is driving me absolutely crazy !