CP C&M Subdivision

[ZZ_Tops]

Hey, just wanted to basically announce that I'm starting on an (attempt) at the line between Chicago and Milwaukee. The route in real life is 85.7 miles long going from Chicago Union Station to Milwaukee downtown. It's owned by Metra from Chicago to the Roundout interlocking, and then CP north of it. Most of it is a two-track line. Just a few notes:

1. I'm trying to make this as realistic a simulation as possible; I already have really recent and detailed track charts for the section of the line from Truesdell (MP 53 to Lake (MP 78), and pretty accurate info about the rest of the line general layout, signal locations, and basic track info. Unfortunately I don't have info about the track grade for the rest of the line. If anyone has that, PLEASE!
2. Begin the route. I'm going to be using microdem and HOG since I don't have transdem. Unfortunately even though some of the route has 10m data, I've had trouble in the past with mixing 10m and 30m data so it'll all be 30m.
3. Find someone to do buildings. If anyone wants to model some of the stations and notable landmarks along the route, contact me.
4. This isn't my first attempt at the route or at making a route. I've made several incomplete routes and tried this one about 5 times, but I've never really tried to get everything to work. Every other time I gave up on this route when I noticed that somewhere I had a section of track with some weird grade or other insanely annoying problem.

Considering how I've worked on this in the past, I could probably have the track laid (including signalling and other stuff like grade xings) done within a a month, provided I can find the detailed infor for MP 0-53 and 78-86 soon. Texturing and building placement would obviously be longer.

By the way, if it turns out someone else did this route in trainz and I just never found out about it, please tell me. I'd hate to spend my time on something and then it turns out something better was on the DLS the whole time.

 

[gisa]

Hi ZZ_Tops (great name btw )


Your route sounds really interesting. I'm sure there'd be plenty of things to see and that many different railroad companies use the trackage along it.

It also sounds like a very big route so might I humbly suggest two things?
1) if you are really gung ho about doing this [and it totally sounds like it] invest in tranzDEM? It'll more than pay for itself by giving you accurate terrain (fairly easily once you learn how to use it) and you can also import a map to navigate in the mini map as well as painting map textures onto the terrain to help as well. There are several trainzers here who use it and who can help you if you run into a jam or two...
2) I, like you, also wish I had grade information but could not find any for something I was working on (which I plan on getting back to soon). Hang in there and hopefully someone will help.
3) Lastly and perhaps most importantly, it might be wiser to break it down into sections (for overall size and realistic targets). You could always merge sections later. I just always found that knowing you have to do 100 + baseboards after you've only done about 2 or 3 is such a downer.

Good luck on your route! I look forward to seeing some pics!

:wave:

Gisa ^^

 

[mjolnir]

I would concur with gisa that breaking the project into multiple sections--probably at least four, one each for the Chicago and Milwaukee metro areas, and two intermediate ones--would be a good idea.

What version of TRZ do you intend to use?

ns

 

[007007]

I travel those rails regularly. If you have any questions feel free to ask and I will ***TRY*** and help you.

Good luck on this project!

-Steve :wave:

 

[applegathc]

Ah wonderful. I will be checking up on this thread...

cam

 

[ZZ_Tops]

I would concur with gisa that breaking the project into multiple sections--probably at least four, one each for the Chicago and Milwaukee metro areas, and two intermediate ones--would be a good idea.

What version of TRZ do you intend to use?

ns

gisa is right, and I've decided I'm going to divide this into 3 sections and merge them up as I finish each. Here's how it'll be divided:

1. Milwaukee-Truesdell. I have detailed info, as mentioned, for most of this part of the route, except for 8 miles at the north end. If I work from south to north, maybe someone will get info about the far north end before I reach the north end.
2. Truesdell-Rondout. This would be a pretty easy section, for the most part. Mainly rural and forest with some suburbs here and there.
3. Rondout-Union Station. I'd want to do this section sooner since it's the most challenging and has more uses.

Oh, and I'll be using TRS09

 

[ZZ_Tops]

Hi ZZ_Tops (great name btw )


1) if you are really gung ho about doing this [and it totally sounds like it] invest in tranzDEM? It'll more than pay for itself by giving you accurate terrain (fairly easily once you learn how to use it) and you can also import a map to navigate in the mini map as well as painting map textures onto the terrain to help as well. There are several trainzers here who use it and who can help you if you run into a jam or two...
2) I, like you, also wish I had grade information but could not find any for something I was working on (which I plan on getting back to soon). Hang in there and hopefully someone will help.
3) Lastly and perhaps most importantly, it might be wiser to break it down into sections (for overall size and realistic targets). You could always merge sections later. I just always found that knowing you have to do 100 + baseboards after you've only done about 2 or 3 is such a downer.

Good luck on your route! I look forward to seeing some pics!

:wave:

Gisa ^^

I did cave in and decide to do sections. As for tranzdem, I'm a cheapskate and the only way I'd buy it to do a route is if I made the route payware. Since I have no experience with selling stuff on the internet whatsoever and feel that this sort of thing is useful for the community as a whole, I'm not going to spend money on transdem with no return. Besides, microdem/HOG is useful enough.

 

[PerRock]

I used to have a bunch of information about Chicago Union Station. However I'm not sure how much of it I still have since its been awhile since I looked at it. I look to see what I can dig up.

peter

 

[ZZ_Tops]

Buildings

If anyone wants to make some models of the following buildings and put them up on DLS, I'd be practically in heaven:

1. Glenview Amtrak/Metra station
2. Sturtevant Amtrak station
3. Milwaukee Station

If anyone wants to do these, preferably with tracks included, It would move things forward A LOT since I don't want to use stock buildings but I also don't know anything about modeling buildings.

 

[007007]

Are you going to include the old Sturtevant depot?

 

[ZZ_Tops]

Cryptic but skeptical answer

Are you going to include the old Sturtevant depot?

Does it exist now? Accuracy over nostalgia. And yes, I can be mean. But really, I'm 19 years old, I don't know about these things, the "old Sturtevant depot" has about as much significance for me as your toothbrush. That's not to say it's objectively unimportant, just that I don't understand the significance of it because I never saw it or knew about it in its lifetime.

That said, if you want to provide it on the DLS, I'll include it.

 

[007007]

I too am 19 but I want to say that CP moved the depot this summer. It was still there last time I ran through there before I got laid off but here is a pic of the old and new ones...

Old:

New: (photos hard to come by)

Nothing on the DLS that I'm aware of...

-Steve

 

[ZZ_Tops]

Update

Two notes: First, I've noticed a lot of route-makers have been inconsistent at best about keeping people in the loop about their progress. Since I want to set a new precedent in quality route-making, I'm going to be releasing a weekly update on progress every monday (this week being the exception; the next update will be released on October 12, hopefully with the first screenshots).

So here's your update: Yesterday I began work with editing TIGER files and dividing the whole map up into three sections. This weekend will be spent loading into HOG, exporting to Trainz, and beginning work on the north section. If I can get good progress to a point where I feel comfortable about at least one small section, I might post some screenshots early.

Addition at 3:03 PM: I'm gonna keep on mentioning this because I can't stress it enough; I have pretty much no experience with creating, texturing, or scripting assets. I have enough experience with surveyor that I think I can make a good route, but I don't know how to make new buildings for it. If you want something in the route that isn't on DLS, I'm not going to make it because I don't know how to. If there's an important building for the route that isn't on DLS, I'll use assets I DO have to replicate the building as closely as I can. I will try to hold off on that approach as long as possible, but hypothetically, if the entire route was complete except for a few buildings, and I cold upload it to the DLS in 5 minutes by adding in some stock building, I will.

 

[HSSRAIL]

Have someone who has access to Trans Dem make the Gnd file do not use Microdem and Hog to do this. Break the route up into 10 mile segments that can be merged together. Good luck with your project.

Howard

 

[deegeeze74]

man i live on the north end of this route i can give info from mitchell airport station to and through downtown milwaukee

 

[ZZ_Tops]

man i live on the north end of this route i can give info from mitchell airport station to and through downtown milwaukee

GIVE ME!!!

Edit: You know, at your leisure, and as soon as you can get reliable info.

 

[ZZ_Tops]

Weekly Update #2

I decided to post an update today even though I did say earlier that it was unlikely. While I do have a few bits of the map at a screenshot-ready state, I'm going to wait until next week when I have a few more (I PROMISE there will be screenshots next Monday). That said, I have a few questions to ask before going into the current status of the route:

1. Does anyone have any advice on the Pleasant Prairie Power Station? It doesn't look like the tracks for that connect with the CP line right near there (though there is a connection a way up the line) so I figured I would just do some basic stuff for the power plant (such as showing the tracks and adding a few buildings), but considering it's an incredibly complex site which, as far as I know, CP doesn't use so much, I figured I could save some polygons (and framerates for you and me!) by doing a basic model for it.

2. As of now I've decided to model buildings accurately (or as cloe as possible) so long as they're within about .75 tiles of the track itself, with textures out to about 1.5-2 tiles. I'm running Trainz on a Macbook Pro (Bootcamp+Vista) with a 2.5 Ghz processor, a 512 MB GeForce 8600M GT gpu, and 2 gigs of ram and getting decent framerates at this level of detail. So for anyone running Trainz on a really good system, I apologize.

3. How do I take screenshots?

4.

Have someone who has access to Trans Dem make the Gnd file do not use Microdem and Hog to do this. Break the route up into 10 mile segments that can be merged together. Good luck with your project.

Already started the route, so that's a done deal, though if you have transdem and want to do the section from Union Station to about 1 mile north of the Wisconsin/Illinois border, I'm not stopping you.

With those questions/comments out of the way, here's the status:
Laid down track from approximately MP 48 to MP 59 (just short of Sturtevant) and textured just about all of it. I've put down buildings along bits and pieces, referencing google maps for building locations and types, also using google's streetview feature whenever possible. I'm predicting we have about 25 miles of functional track by next monday (albeit with not all buildings down), and the entire Wisconsin portion should be done by the end of November.

Once again, if anyone wants to upload buildings to the DLS for the route, please let me know what buildings you want to d and when ou think you can have them done. Track charts and info would also be apreciated.

 

[007007]

Does anyone have any advice on the Pleasant Prairie Power Station? It doesn't look like the tracks for that connect with the CP line right near there (though there is a connection a way up the line) so I figured I would just do some basic stuff for the power plant (such as showing the tracks and adding a few buildings), but considering it's an incredibly complex site which, as far as I know, CP doesn't use so much, I figured I could save some polygons (and framerates for you and me!) by doing a basic model for it.

BNSF actually got the contract for the plant earlier this year. CP delivers them so actually it is quite busy. The trains come up from Bensenville for the time being and return the same way. The connection point into the plant is listed in the timetable as "Wepco" which is a control point for 1 Main but does not affect 2 Main. The switch is just north (timetable west) of the grade crossings located just SW of the plant.

Skipping this industry defiantly wouldn't be the best idea...

-Steve

 

[gisa]

3. How do I take screenshots?

If you hit the print screen key, a .tga? image is saved in your trainz installation folder (I forget exactly where). I prefer to paste the image into irfanview (freeware graphics manipulator program) save it as a .jpeg.

:wave:

Gisa ^^

 

[ZZ_Tops]

BNSF actually got the contract for the plant earlier this year. CP delivers them so actually it is quite busy. The trains come up from Bensenville for the time being and return the same way. The connection point into the plant is listed in the timetable as "Wepco" which is a control point for 1 Main but does not affect 2 Main. The switch is just north (timetable west) of the grade crossings located just SW of the plant.

Skipping this industry defiantly wouldn't be the best idea...

-Steve

I'd like to see the timetable to confirm that. My track chart is from a grant application filed last year:
www.s4prc.org/fundapps/wis_grant_app_minusappend.pdf
And it does in fact list that there's a spur at that location which it lists on the chart as "Lawt Spu", which I think is what you're talking about; it's at the right location on the chart.

I gave this a little thought and decided to compromise on it; I'm just going to model the tracks and add one or two industry buildings, as well as a few textures for a small area. Once I release the section, someone else can add to it if they want.

Since I don't have any info except for track locations, the tracks willroughly follow the terrain.