Auran, "You" have a problem ...

C

casey38

Belgium Routes
I, for one, support more than very extremely Auran.

I've been, and still am i, a member of this forum since the very start, i mean, b4 Trainz CE 1.0 came up.

So, i just love TRS and all its predecessors.

I do appreciate the relationship that has been going on here, though it was better than it is a few years ago.

But, i discovered something on the French forum that is ruining the trust between a custumer and a company.

It has been raised to our attention that TRS 2007 has some in-build game assets coming from private users without asking them a kind of, say, permission before "stealing" an object.

Do the presence of an object on the DLS allows Auran to behave like that ?

If so, don't be astonished to see so many and many more web sites, with private creations ready to download, coming up everywhere !

It will be with the detriment of the concept of the dls.

Cheers,

André.
 
casey38 said:
It has been raised to our attention that TRS 2007 has some in-build game assets coming from private users without asking them a kind of, say, permission before "stealing" an object.

Do the presence of an object on the DLS allows Auran to behave like that ?
Click to expand...

Yes, I believe it does, and always has. You are right that those who wish to retain exclusive ownership of thier work should not upload to the DLS.

Ed
 
I had content I created used in TRS2006. They did ask permission from me before using it. Perhaps a change in policy?

John
 
Carey38

I note you are referring to TRS2007, so I can't speak to routes made for that version.

When the Trainz Narrowgaugers worked on the Northbay route for TRS2006, like all the other creators,we were given strict instructions that any third-party content, DLS or otherwise, could only be included if we had prior permission for its inclusion in the route. In fact we were given a required format for the email that we had to adhere to.

I know this was done because I had to do it and I'm certain that in our case everything we included was with permission. However, it is always possible that any route could unintentionally contain non-permitted content added in the very hectic last days before the deadline.

Euphod is mistaken, on the evidence it appears that Auran do not treat DLS content as if it was theirs.

Carey, if people are concerned about this, I am sure that the forum and Auran would have heard about it before now, why has the matter arisen at this late stage? Perhaps you should list the route(s) and the content involved.

Cheers

Narrowgauge
 
I have to say that i'm not very concerned as the objects i'm speacking about are from an user who calls himself "Scarol".

So, that is not a route but these are objects made by Scarol and uploaded on the DLS that are now included in TRS. I personely know the peep and he's sure that he never has been asked kind of permission at all.

I've posted this message as the other peeps of the French forum are kind of recitent to post themselves here ...

Thanks for the input, guys. I hope Auran's staff will give a go here.

Cheers,

André.
 
Not on DLS

I only found one of the two files mentioned in the French Forum thread on the DLS. 56954:37004 is not on the DLS.:confused:

I myself was contacted for permission to use some of my content in CE. I am thinking that if anything has happened here out of the ordinary protocol it is an error and not an unannounced change in policy. What was Auran's reply to scarol's inquiry about this?
 
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Casey I doubt Auran just puts 3rd party content on Trainz without asking the users about it. TRS2007 came out in Germany a few days ago and Auran asked the content creators whose content they had selected to put in TRS2007 if they could put it in. It would be very foolish of Auran to do otherwise as some of the content is copyrighted by the authors and therefore legal issues can ensue (though I doubt it would go that far).

WileeCoyote:D
 
WileeCoyote said:
Casey I doubt Auran just puts 3rd party content on Trainz without asking the users about it.
Click to expand...

If you read the thread you will see that Auran did not ask scarol for permission to use his content... However the Auran Content Creation and Distribution Policy is quite clear, I'm not sure what the problem is here. Yes it's polite for them to ask, but nothing's forcing them to do so. If they are in a rush to meet a deadline they may not be in a position to spend time a) sending out requests and / or b) translating them into another language. We may all be huge fans of the Trainz franchise, but at the end of the day Auran have a business to run.

2. Auran's rights
2.1 Grant of license
With regard to all your New Works uploaded to the Auran Download Station, you grant to Auran a personal, transferable but non-exclusive license to those New Works in order that Auran can redistribute the New Works to third parties:
(a) by making the New Works available for download from the Auran Download Station for free or for payment;
(b) by including the New Works on a CDROM or DVDROM (or other storage medium) that is made publicly available for sale or that is given away; or
(c) both (a) and (b).
Click to expand...
JB
 
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The end of the problem... perhaps.

Well JB that pretty well makes this a non-issue!;) Perhaps you shoud post that quote about Auran's rights over in the relevant thread in the French Forum.

Dave
 
Amigacooke I agree that from a community and customer relations point of view it's probably in Auran's interest to ask or at least notify people about the use of their content. It's just that the tone of this thread suggests that Auran have acted inappropriately in including people's content in TRS2007, which simply isn't the case.

My post wasn't a "well you agreed to this, so tough luck" post, I was just pointing out the terms that everyone agrees to when uploading content. It's for this same reason that I don't think Auran should honour requests to have content removed (other than offensive or faulty content and copyright issues etc).

JB
 
Casey,

I appreciate your concern, but it is not for you to raise an issue of content-stealing on behalf of another member, in this case, "scarol".

If Scarol has a problem, then it is his option to take the matter up with Auran.

And that does not happen here, it happens in an email from "Scarol" to helpdesk@auran.com

and what happens thereafter is between Scarol and Auran.

You might well know "Scarol" and he might be your friend, or you might be upset at this "content stealing". Whatever the case, it rests between "Scarol" and Auran and does not belong in this thread.

:eek:



casey38 said:
I have to say that i'm not very concerned as the objects i'm speacking about are from an user who calls himself "Scarol".

So, that is not a route but these are objects made by Scarol and uploaded on the DLS that are now included in TRS. I personely know the peep and he's sure that he never has been asked kind of permission at all.

I've posted this message as the other peeps of the French forum are kind of recitent to post themselves here ...

Thanks for the input, guys. I hope Auran's staff will give a go here.

Cheers,

André.
Click to expand...
 
I certainly don't want to start a fire.

I was only doing a "relay" between what is being said in the French forum and is not documented here.

The point is clear: Auran puts members objects in 2007 and they don't ask permission to do that.

That is what is said and feel in the French forum.

Regards,

André.
 
Casey38

If the items in question are built-in, almost certainly they would be there because a third-party route that has been added to 2007 contained those items. In the same way, all the third-party items that we used on Northbay are now builtins.

If the route creator or team included third-party items but did not ask permission to do so then the non-permitted inclusion is their fault. In our experience, Auran rely on the creator(s) to do the right thing, and would not have checked.

Why are you reluctant to say what route it is and what the items are?

I can understand why there are concerns, but I think you are unfair in blaming Auran.

Cheers

Narrowgauge
 
Hi all

I agree with Narrowgauge in that Auran are not usually the people building routes, which was especially the case with TRS2006, which I believe is what TRS2007 is (2006+SP1). Hence, any content that was included in a particular route should really have been up to the route creator to seek permission from, not Auran.

With the number of included routes in 2006/7, you couldn't expect that Auran would have the time, $$ or even the ethical responsibility to do this, as a) The agreement to upload (which we all have to agree to when uploading) says that Auran can use it if they want to; and b) It is the route creator's ethical responsiblity to ask a creator's permission if they know their route is to be included as a "built-in".

Perhaps those in the french community who have identified the route/s in question could request the route creator/s to retrospectively ask for permission, or at least apologise for the oversight. This might help resolve the situation. I don't think it should be Auran's issue to be honest.

Cheers
Tony
 
Excuse me for butting in here.

Like Dave, I went to the french forum and did some translation.

I somewhat agree with the point about the route builders should have gotten permission for this piece of content. But, then again, it isn't the route builders who are selling the game.

I was contacted about my content being included with a route for 06. I gladly gave my permission. Even though by Auran's terms and conditions, this was not necessary. It was a matter of being polite.

Should this non dls content been included? Certainly not. On one hand, it is very hard for a route builder to remember where they got every piece of content. On the other hand, before putting these routes and content into the final product, I think Auran should make sure it is available at the dls. If it isn't, will it be or do they have written permission ? If not, then it gets deleted from the route. Wasn't that the case with the Trainz Routes cds ? Content not on the dls either got replaced or deleted.

I also think that the route builders should forward the e-mails they received from creators giving the ok to a seperate address that only auran and its 3rd parties have.

Just my 2 cents worth.
 
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