Are 'sc' packages payware and is there a way to see what assets they hold?

R

RobWed

Active member
So I've tried to download a few routes from the DLS. No luck so far as each has unknown assets. Some authors have indicated that their route depends on DLC purveyed by N3V Games. But in order to do so they are compelled to provide that information on an external website, presumably at their own expense. In other instances I am compelled to throw myself on the mercy of the Trainz community and ask them to help me track down 'unknown assets'. As far as I can tell there is no way, once an end user like us has downloaded a package, to tell what assets we hold belong to which DLC we purchased. This process seems further complicated by the fact that each edition of the game seems to be bundled with an inconsistent set of DLC. So person A can produce content using only the assets that came with the edition of Trainz they bought but person B can't use that work because they have a different edition of Trainz.

Is there a way, without having to rely on the kindness of strangers, to identify which DLC I should prioritise as a purchase in order to be able to use routes I'm interested in? It strikes me as financially beneficial to N3V Games to provide this information as well as being advantageous to content creators as it both simplifies and amplifies engagement from the rest of the community.

Honestly, I expect that, having downloaded content from the DLS, something for which I am PAYING A SUBSCRIPTION, it should have at least the capacity to tell me where to purchase the assets I need to enjoy the efforts of content creators... This is not a difficult goal to acheive.
 
RobWed said:
Yes it will! I checked the "Enable advanced debug tools" and restarted the game.
Click to expand...
Not sure this is functional...
For 'list-package-assets simc:sc297' (which I don't have but likely contains assets I'm after) it just gave the error message 'No assets from package 'simc_sc297' are installed. Which would appear to make sense except I got the same error message for packages I DO have installed.
 
RobWed said:
Not sure this is functional...
For 'list-package-assets simc:sc297' (which I don't have but likely contains assets I'm after) it just gave the error message 'No assets from package 'simc_sc297' are installed. Which would appear to make sense except I got the same error message for packages I DO have installed.
Click to expand...
Okay it was soft failing any improperly formatted package names.
list-package-assets "sc441" returns the tzarc file name installed at /packages/sc441/content/
list-package-assets "sc297" returns the error 'No assets from package 'sc297' are installed'

So it doesn't allow me to self-help tracking down the DLC I need to get these downloaded routes up and running.
 
Thanks
JCitron said:
sc297 is:

<kuid2:154322:101483:23> ECML Kings Cross - Edinburgh
Click to expand...
Thanks John,

I used that package number while testing the list-package-assets function in TrainzUtil. HPL got me on to that functionality and KotangaGirl pointed me in the direction of the page that gives package numbers for each DLC. I chose sc297 because Marky7890 has produced a massive body of work, being his Cornish Railways, and I am keen to try it. He mentioned on the British Trainz website that both ECML DLC and the TANE assets for TRS19 DLC were requirements.

In my naivety I imagined that putting the package number for DLC I don't have into the TrainzUtil function would list all the assets in the package and from there, the dependencies of those packages and that I could check that against the list of missing dependencies I have put together for the four routes I downloaded yesterday. And in three of those four routes I'd just be guessing about packages numbers because there appears to be no method for identifying where to source assets not on the DLS beyond what the community tries to do for itself. I must have downloaded around 10,000 assets yesterday in an attempt to get a functional route. I have 210 missing dependencies and no way of clearly identfying how to source them. It's a design deficit of significant proportion. I'm frustrated by it and I don't imagine my feelings about it are in any way on the margin. It's also more than that when you consider that at least some of the assets I'm after are packaged into DLC that N3V would like to sell to us.

It's not like the simulator isn't enjoyable. I've been having a great time when I'm in it. The frustration involved in attempting to enjoy the efforts of others in the communiy is however a massive disincentive and I imagine a barrier to further engagement from all but the most committed railfans.
 
RobWed said:
Thanks

Thanks John,

I used that package number while testing the list-package-assets function in TrainzUtil. HPL got me on to that functionality and KotangaGirl pointed me in the direction of the page that gives package numbers for each DLC. I chose sc297 because Marky7890 has produced a massive body of work, being his Cornish Railways, and I am keen to try it. He mentioned on the British Trainz website that both ECML DLC and the TANE assets for TRS19 DLC were requirements.

In my naivety I imagined that putting the package number for DLC I don't have into the TrainzUtil function would list all the assets in the package and from there, the dependencies of those packages and that I could check that against the list of missing dependencies I have put together for the four routes I downloaded yesterday. And in three of those four routes I'd just be guessing about packages numbers because there appears to be no method for identifying where to source assets not on the DLS beyond what the community tries to do for itself. I must have downloaded around 10,000 assets yesterday in an attempt to get a functional route. I have 210 missing dependencies and no way of clearly identfying how to source them. It's a design deficit of significant proportion. I'm frustrated by it and I don't imagine my feelings about it are in any way on the margin. It's also more than that when you consider that at least some of the assets I'm after are packaged into DLC that N3V would like to sell to us.

It's not like the simulator isn't enjoyable. I've been having a great time when I'm in it. The frustration involved in attempting to enjoy the efforts of others in the communiy is however a massive disincentive and I imagine a barrier to further engagement from all but the most committed railfans.
Click to expand...
The cheapest way to get the ECML Kings Cross route is to purchase TANE, but I'd recommend the Deluxe edition as it has Avery - Drexel with it. These two routes have a lot of assets which are used in routes on the DLS.
You don't need to install TANE just the routes you need in your latest Trainz version.
 
grazlash said:
The cheapest way to get the ECML Kings Cross route is to purchase TANE, but I'd recommend the Deluxe edition as it has Avery - Drexel with it. These two routes have a lot of assets which are used in routes on the DLS.
You don't need to install TANE just the routes you need in your latest Trainz version.
Click to expand...
Thanks grazlash,

And thanks to that link from KotangaGirl I know the cheapest way to get the cheapest way to get ECML is during one of the Steam sales when I could get it for as little as 2.95 dollarydoos! :ROFLMAO:

So the TANE, TRS19, and TRS2022 versions of a DLC that share the same name contain identical assets?
 
I meant to add that whilst I appreciate the efforts of everyone in the community to reduce the frustration involved, it shouldn't be up to us.

It's not unreasonable to expect that CM would tell us what assets we would require BEFORE downloading a route. It's not unreasonable to expect CM to tell us what DLC might be required to operate a route. It's not even unreasonable to expect that CM has the capacity to direct us to 3rd party sites for dependencies. They could even monetise it in the case of payware 3rd party sites.

Anything that promotes customer engagement is to N3V's benefit.
 
RobWed said:
I meant to add that whilst I appreciate the efforts of everyone in the community to reduce the frustration involved, it shouldn't be up to us.

It's not unreasonable to expect that CM would tell us what assets we would require BEFORE downloading a route. It's not unreasonable to expect CM to tell us what DLC might be required to operate a route. It's not even unreasonable to expect that CM has the capacity to direct us to 3rd party sites for dependencies. They could even monetise it in the case of payware 3rd party sites.

Anything that promotes customer engagement is to N3V's benefit.
Click to expand...
I agree, Rob. We've asked for this bit of convenience for years. Finding out what dependencies are part of a route shouldn't be so difficult. Clicking on an asset in Content Manager should give us another window that displays dependency of information instead of us needing to click on each and every asset separately, and ditto for routes and sessions as well. Having this ability would help us clean up old content we no longer want or need. Is a dependency of, or has dependencies columns in Content Manager would go far to save us time, frustration, and angst should we delete something that was needed with no way to retrieve that asset any longer.

Assets including routes and sessions made for previous versions will work with more modern versions of Trainz. There are some caveats such as some older content doesn't look as good and there are some script incompatibilities with some assets, but for the most part most objects look and work fine. The modern versions of Trainz, meaning T:ANE, TRS19 family, and TRS22 and relations are more closely related to each other than they are to the older versions. We can't go back but routes and sessions built in T:ANE will load up with no modifications in TRS22 and up. Routes and sessions from TS12 and before need a bit more than a bit of TLC and some require some major renovations, but they do import into the new versions.

I took a route I started in January 2004 and I have brought it forward through every bump, bruise, and scrape found in various versions of Trainz. As time has gone on, I have renovated, rebuilt, and expanded the original route to where it stands today. The original route is a mere core of the current version and has been greatly modified, that being a real understatement, but that core still exists.
 
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