A simple solution to an annoying problem......

[Railhead001]

Sometimes easy answers can be hidden in a complex problem. Take for example the use of track markers and the maddening random results one can get from just trying to make basic moves. Currently I am finishing the details on my Brazemore Yard modifications (1 freight friendly and 1 passenger friendly). I am at the stage now where I am testing multi AI train movements. If your familiar with this layout or not, it is basically an elongated figure "8" that offers tons of operating possibilities.

One would think it would be rather not difficult to run at least 2 AI trains in the same direction around the figure "8" without doing anything else. But as anyone who has tried such attempts on medium sized or larger layouts, the train AI literally thinks on its own and will reverse for no apparent reason or go on a completely different route than what you had instructed it to do.

So now we have "directional" markers to help dummy down the AI so it knows to go in a specific direction, or should I say "should go" in a specific direction because even with using the directional markers the AI will still mess things up for your plans.

I have been following a youtube blogger that goes by Rudysmodelrailway. He has several tutorials on Trainz covering the basics and some advanced topics. I stumbled on one regarding track markers and was impressed by the simplicity of his observations. Basically ignore the directional track markers and use the standard track marker in its place but as a "via" marker. Connect them like dots to your regular markers you use for industries or other areas.

Especially useful for making diverging routes. I wanted a passenger train to go to 3 or 4 stations and stop for a few seconds before moving on to the next while having a freight train avoid having to wait for the station stops by branching off. Using the regular markers and setting up "via" points I set the commands (in " ") for the passenger train that was in the yard with the freight on separate tracks.

"Drive to trackmark" station A, "Wait" 20 seconds, "Drive to trackmark" station B, "Wait" 15 seconds, "Drive via trackmark" via 2 (via 2 being a standard track marker), "Drive to trackmark" station C , "Wait" 20 seconds, "Drive via trackmark" via 2b (via 2b again being a standard track marker), "Drive to trackmark" station D, "Wait" 20 seconds, "Repeat"

Next I had the freight train "Drive via trackmark" via 1, "Drive via trackmark" via 2, "Drive via trackmark" via 2b and then "Drive via trackamark" via 3, Repeat (Making it go in a continuous loop)

Both trains stayed exactly on course. When the passenger train first left the yard it was directed to go to the inner right track for a station siding while the freight was directed to take the left outer track and when approaching the yard the passenger train was diverted to the inside far right track while the freight took the center track down the middle of the yard.

The block signal system that is on the Brazemore Yard layout worked perfectly and had an added bonus, since the freight train went on a diverging path instead of following the passenger train which would have had it stop at all the signals because it was directly behind it, the signals became yellow or green allowing the freight to continue. Especially when entering the yard, normally the freight would have to wait until the passenger train had moved onto the next signal before it was allowed to enter the yard (Hence block signaling system). Now the passenger train clears the initial signal showing a yellow or green on the diverging track which the freight can take without having to stop for a red signal normally waiting for the passenger train to move onto the next block section.

Very enjoyable having the trains operate the way you want....major improvement on having to lay lots of directional markers and hoping the trains follow them.........

You can name the track markers anything but I used "via" so I knew it was just for driving on till the next point (plus makes sense with the "via trackmark" command) and wouldn't confuse me later with the other markers I use.

Hope this tip saves someone some hair pulling

Although this was done with TMR17 the tip can be used with Tane as well which is why I have posted this in the "General" forum.

 

[oknotsen]

... and since it all seems to be Surveyor stuff, I moved it there

 

[llebrez]

I have 72 consists on my world. Of these there are about 31 running on AI (*). If you set a few AI's, lets say 4 or 5, they run perfect, providing you set all the trackmarks and schedules correctly. Now start adding AI consists, and at some point, they start to do silly things such as running all over the place, stopping for no reason in front of signals or not throwing points ahead of the route. I have to use schedule library because if you don't, "wait for time" will wait forever if you save the session and resume it at a latter time. Have to mention that entering a portal is risky. If a consist enters, and you save the session while inside waiting for a timed return, it may never do when resuming the session (Lost consist). And in certain conditions, ramdom so it can't be reproduced for study, a consist will return without some of the cars. But overall, knowing the limitations, yes, you can run your world quite well.

(*) Running AI means to me that a consist, be it an airplane, ship, trains and even two trolleybuses run in a continuing loop forever. Some of them changing the loco at consist ends and one of them changing from diesel to electric locos in the middle of the run.

 

[JCitron]

I've noticed the same slowness and eventual stoppage of AI trains on my routes as well. I found that if I save the running session, or press pause then resume the session, the AI "wake up" and everything gets back to normal again. The running time for me is about an hour so I keep an eye on the clock, save, and resume, then continue on. By using this method, I've been able to run for many, may hours without a problem.

I mentioned this ages ago in the early T:ANE days, but this issue went unanswered. The symptom is the signals where they will show no train approaching and remain green even though there's a train at the signal, and there's another train coming the other way. Pausing and or saving seems to fix this. Maybe things will be better, crossing fingers, in SP2.

 

[Railhead001]

I've noticed the same slowness and eventual stoppage of AI trains on my routes as well. I found that if I save the running session, or press pause then resume the session, the AI "wake up" and everything gets back to normal again. The running time for me is about an hour so I keep an eye on the clock, save, and resume, then continue on. By using this method, I've been able to run for many, may hours without a problem.

I mentioned this ages ago in the early T:ANE days, but this issue went unanswered. The symptom is the signals where they will show no train approaching and remain green even though there's a train at the signal, and there's another train coming the other way. Pausing and or saving seems to fix this. Maybe things will be better, crossing fingers, in SP2.

I have not encountered that issue while using only track markers vs directional markers, 2-4 hours and seems fine but if I take a screen shot or pause it then I will have problems appear.

 

[wilts747]

I have quite a large creation first started under TS12 and migrated to T:ANE with some 40+ consists controlled mainly by AI with many more consists doing little other than contributing to the authenticity. I have tended to use a mix of Drive/Navigate, To/Via with a generous mix of Wait For/Until and Load/Unload to bring it to life. Although it is large I use Portals to turn back, or transport consists from one end of the creation to the other and visa-versa, while employing many of the Portal features of delayed return, loading, unloading etc. The shortest AI loop is in excess of 5 hours and the longest in excess of 17 hours hence the interaction between AI controlled consists is constantly changing and probably never repeated. On my multi-purpose mid range machine which I use fore Surveyor I tend not to save Drive sessions, that way they always start at the same point providing the opportunity to repeat something which goes wrong, crashes etc. and perhaps resolve it. I back up my creation to my gaming rig most weeks where Drive sessions are saved and continued.

I agree fully that at times AI does seem to have a total disregard for logic and a complete mind of its own but so far there has been nothing which I've not resolved be it after much frustration. Likewise fortunately I can say the same for Portals. While some of the individual consist scenarios are quite details I've created them in manageable steps when I probable could have reduced the commands and work involved. However while the Drive To/Via command tends to mean go there by the most 'direct' route and the Navigate To/Via command means just that, by any reasonable route all other factors considered, consists do tend to take the shortest route between two points unless that path is obstructed when instead of waiting for it to clear it will to frequently re-route and go the long and perhaps wrong way round to satisfy the command.

I think sometimes you just have to actually think AI and the options a consist may have in completing a command. Where there is more than one solution then perhaps it's the wrong command or it needs to be achieved in a number of smaller steps or with additional parameters. Peter

 

[llebrez]

This is a very interesting thread, mostly with encouraging and positive comments. Perhaps, Tony should read all this, and if by a remote coincidence, there is a better solution for the problems mentioned, at SP-2 execution and debugging, they could implement some modifications. Just a thought.