2 Dead when Semi Smacks Amtrak Train in Nevada

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How do you know that the signals were working? It says it happened at 1:30 PM Chicago time which would be still in the morning hours Nevada time, and depending on which way he was traveling the sun could've been a factor. Not all crossings along Highway 95 are guarded, and depending on the length of the train and any obstructions to the left or to the right there is a possibility that the driver did not see the train.

I would suspect we need to let the NTSB sort it all out before making comments without having all the facts.
 
How do you know that the signals were working? It says it happened at 1:30 PM Chicago time which would be still in the morning hours Nevada time, and depending on which way he was traveling the sun could've been a factor. Not all crossings along Highway 95 are guarded, and depending on the length of the train and any obstructions to the left or to the right there is a possibility that the driver did not see the train.

I would suspect we need to let the NTSB sort it all out before making comments without having all the facts.

Kind of why I wish they would have given the actual crossing out. That way I could have looked it up...

It's incredibly common for cars and truck to ram into the side of trains. I suppose that many other factors are up to the NTSB to decide, I only made that comment because it just seems like the "same old story". Even though, most don't end with a burning train and 2 dead. Very tragic.

Sorry for the brash comment. Nevertheless, anyone going over a grade crossing needs to slow and stop. That's my rule. If the crossing isn't properly guarded, it is now. The FRA gets involved with everything, and I'm sure it'll be up and over standards after this. The length of the train would be rather short. Being rural, the Zephyr would be going a good 80mph. That train would flash by. Personally, I'm feeling this was a lost race with the train. :(

Cheers,
Joshua
 
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How do you know that the signals were working? It says it happened at 1:30 PM Chicago time which would be still in the morning hours Nevada time, and depending on which way he was traveling the sun could've been a factor. Not all crossings along Highway 95 are guarded, and depending on the length of the train and any obstructions to the left or to the right there is a possibility that the driver did not see the train.

I would suspect we need to let the NTSB sort it all out before making comments without having all the facts.

THEY RAN INTO A F@#&KING TRAIN
how do you miss that
 
what bothers me is this is far more common than you think. We only hear about it after some idiot either becomes the ornament on the lead engine's pilot beam, or like in this case slams broadside into the thing.

I still think there must be a railway safety course as part of gaining a driving license, and MANDATORY for anyone trying to get a trucking license. We didn't initiate training procedures when we built the interstate highway system, and look what it got us. arrogant, impatient people who want to speed because it saves them 20 seconds and think a train can stop like a car, so they think it will stop for them if they can't make it across.

it's utter stupidity :n:
 
Like I said, a lost race between a train.

If I explain myself a little better, we had the same thing out here... The 1999 Bourbonnais train wreck. SAME situation, except the train hit the truck head on. 11 passengers died. I really don't have any tolerance for people who ignore trains.

Cheers,
Joshua
 
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It's a tragic accident obviously, but I believe that's all that is obvious at this point. That's why transportation spokespeople are trained not to make rash comments. The facts need to be gathered, studied and analyzed before making conclusions. I can think of a few reasons why a truck would run into the fourth car of a train in the middle of the day. How about failed brakes on the truck for one. It's a sad story, but let's get the facts before we start condemning the truck driver.

Mike
 
It's a sad story, but let's get the facts before we start condemning the truck driver.

Mike
What they have so far...

NTSB ADVISORY
************************************************************

National Transportation Safety Board
Washington, DC 20594

June 24, 2011

************************************************************

NTSB LAUNCHING TEAM TO INVESTIGATE AMTRAK ACCIDENT IN NEVADA

************************************************************

The National Transportation Safety Board has launched a Go-
Team to investigate the collision between an Amtrak
passenger train and a vehicle at a grade crossing on a rural
highway in Nevada.

The Amtrak train was traveling from Chicago to Emeryville,
Calif., when it was stuck by a truck at about 11:25 a.m. PT
today. Numerous fatalities and multiple injuries have been
reported.

Robert Accetta will serve as Investigator-in-Charge for the
team. Member Earl Weener is accompanying the team and will
serve as principal spokesman during the on-scene phase of
the investigation.

Cheers,
Joshua
 
maybe i was a little to harsh before. Leeferr is right, we don't know the full story. the brakes could have failed on the truck, or the driver might have suffered a heart attack or have been somehow incapacitated and not been able to apply the brakes. or he simply could have misjudged the speed of the train and the distance he needed to stop. we don't even know if the truck was as highway speed (whatever the speed limit was on that road), for all we know he had his foot mashed on the brake and just couldn't stop in time.

like leeferr said, there are many variables that need to be taken into account. it's imprudent to make accusations now, when we don't have all the facts.
 
People are fallible. Drivers suffer strokes, cardiac events, seizures and many other illnesses while driving every day. Some abuse drugs, some fall asleep, mechanical equipment fails. All we can be certain of at this point is that it wasn't the train's fault...
 
I don't know, it appears (to my untrained eye) that there is a slight downgrade coming towards the crossing from one side, so depending on the load that was behind the truck, and the direction he was travelling, the driver could have thought he was giving ample time to apply the brakes when he was actually too close for the grade there to stop in time.

Just thinking out loud...i guess i've always been kind of a ametuer crash investigator. You have to give the guy the benefit of the doubt until something comes out to the contrary.
 
THEY RAN INTO A F@#&KING TRAIN
how do you miss that

Actually it's not as hard as you think. Amtrak's run 70-80 miles an hour, they DON'T always hit their horns at crossings. On an unguarded crossing if the semi is doing say 55 mph and is approaching an unguarded crossing and there are trees or other obstructions on the left or right of the road that obscures the view of the track and the train is relatively short it wouldn't be hard all.

Could be by the time he saw it in front of him crossing the crossing and he hit his brakes he was too close to stop.

Back in my younger days I drove a truck for a couple of years over the road and I saw all kinds of things. I've been up and down Highway 95 in and out of Reno and probably have crossed the exact crossing where this happened.

But since you or I don't work for the NTSB, it's not really for us to make a judgment now is it?

Because yes there are always best practices and if everything were perfect accidents like this wouldn't happen. But we don't live in a perfect world and not everything is as cut and dried as you would think.

Because I've been scared crap less by a damned Amtrak coming across an unguarded crossing, he didn't hit his horn until after I had cleared the crossing and he went through it at 70 miles an hour. So I know for a fact that they don't always hit their horns while approaching a crossing.

And no I didn't see the train coming because there were vineyards on each side of the track and the road so the view of the track was highly obscured on each side unless you were sitting right on the crossing.

So I know for a fact it's not impossible or as impossible as you like to think.
 
Well, that's just not good enough, especially for a professional driver.
Mick Berg.

Well now you know why I got out of the transportation industry

But what do you want to do to him? Sentence him to death? Too late…

In the two years I drove I saw things that would probably scare you to death an not all at the behest of the "professional drivers" either.

I saw things that regular drivers did that was so absolutely stupid I was amazed that they had lived as long as they had. I saw things from all types of forms of transportation that would probably make a New York taxi driver blush.

And yes railroad engineers were among those.

I'll tell you a little story about how a rush to judgment can be wrong. Now this is liable will be a bit lengthy so bear with me I might even have to make an over two or three posts. But as I said many years ago I was driving over the road and I had loaded up in Hawthorne Nevada at the Naval weapons Center going to Norfolk Virginia to the shipyards. Now it doesn't matter what I had on, but it went bang :hehe:

Anyway I was coming southbound on some little Podunk Pennsylvania highway between Pittsburgh and Harrisburg and after all these years I don't remember the highway number but I can tell you the name of the town, it was New Buffalo Pennsylvania. It was a two lane with a turning lane in the middle and what I remember of that town was there was a big white house, sitting next to a used schoolbus lot and that was about it. That was on my right side as I was coming into town on the left side of the road was a little cable guardrail that dropped off into a river if I recall correctly.

I'm coming in to town at 55 mph and I looked up and saw a steel hauler coming the opposite direction probably doing about the same speed on the other side of town. In the driveway that White House was a 1992 Crown Victoria Ford that was white and it looked like an old lady was driving, she pulls out into the center turn lane heading towards me and in the same direction as the steel hauler.

Now this is where things started going in slow motion and I'll remember it to the day I die. The steel hauler saw her and got out of the throttle because I saw a puff of smoke out of the stacks and he moved over little bit and he was going to go on around her and she was going to then go into the lane and everything was going to be hunky-dory. This is where it turns south…

She waited till he was about 3 feet off her bumper and veered in front of him and at this point it was like the opening scene to the original Beverly Hills cop movie when you saw the semi truck full of cigarettes hit the one parked car and it went completely in the air and came back down, that's what this looked like to a T.

She came back down in front of him and they started coming across the highway towards me. I made a snap decision and turned half a turn to the right aiming at the bus lot and put myself in the sleeper headfirst they made contact with my truck at the left front axle, (now I might add I was driving a conventional Freightliner at the time) he pushed her car through my front axle through my fuel tank through my battery box through my tandem axles which turned my truck on its right side at that point, through the landing gears on the trailer and wrapped them back three quarters of the way through the 53 foot trailer, then knocked the trailer tandems 50 yards down the road.

Her car came to rest between my trailer and the tandems and he went on down the road maybe 75 yards and put it nose first into a ditch on his left side or the site I was on. I smelled battery acid so I righted myself came out of the sleeper grabbed the steering wheel and kicked out the right windshield and crawled out and walked around the front of my truck which was now on its side laying in the ditch in front of that bus lot I looked down and saw what looked like a Brillo pad which was once that 1992 Crown Victoria Ford.

Needless to say she was killed on impact the steel hauler had injuries and was taken to the hospital I came out without a scratch, so I was standing around as the accident investigation was going on. Now of course since I was the only one remaining at the scene of the accident, I was asked to take a breathalyzer, I blew a zero, that wasn't good enough they put me in a squad car and took me to the state police barracks and made me blow two more zero's and give a urine sample and a blood sample.

They were absolutely convinced that I or the steel hauler had completely caused this accident and were 100% at fault, I'm sure they tested his blood at the hospital as well. They were just absolutely convinced that we had killed this old lady and they wound up poring over my logs and kept me in custody for almost 8 hours doing it.

This was in the days before cell phones and after the accident I had to really call my dispatcher because of the type load that I had that when something like this happened Uncle Sam really wanted to know. So the young woman at the house who I found out later was the woman's granddaughter let me use the phone. I told my dispatcher and he freaked wanting to know the trailer had broke open which I told him it had and he really freaked out.

After I hung up this young lady offered me a Coke and was telling me that she was afraid this was going to happen, and I asked her what she meant by that and she told me that her grandfather was 90 and had black lung, and his insurance had run out, and her grandmother had $100,000 life insurance policy that I guess paid double for accidental death. Now I have no doubt that she committed suicide using me and the other truck as the instrument.

When I told this to the state troopers they wanted none of it, it was either me or the other driver who was at fault and that she just didn't see the steel hauler. Now where that theory breaks down and is flawed is simple, had she not seen the steel hauler she would've pulled out into the lane coming towards me he would've hit his brakes and probably cussed her out under his breath and everybody would've been happy and still living. But she turned into the turning lane and was running slow in the turning lane waiting for him to come by on the outside and timed it just perfectly before veering in front of him. I have no doubt she saw him or she wouldn't have used that center lane.

But the whole point of this long-winded post is that while things may seem obvious they may not always be. And people always talk about professional drivers, but sometimes things can spiral out of control to a point where even a professional driver can't avoid an accident.
 
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Actually it's not as hard as you think. Amtrak's run 70-80 miles an hour, they DON'T always hit their horns at crossings. On an unguarded crossing if the semi is doing say 55 mph and is approaching an unguarded crossing and there are trees or other obstructions on the left or right of the road that obscures the view of the track and the train is relatively short it wouldn't be hard all.

Could be by the time he saw it in front of him crossing the crossing and he hit his brakes he was too close to stop.

Back in my younger days I drove a truck for a couple of years over the road and I saw all kinds of things. I've been up and down Highway 95 in and out of Reno and probably have crossed the exact crossing where this happened.

But since you or I don't work for the NTSB, it's not really for us to make a judgment now is it?

Because yes there are always best practices and if everything were perfect accidents like this wouldn't happen. But we don't live in a perfect world and not everything is as cut and dried as you would think.

Because I've been scared crap less by a damned Amtrak coming across an unguarded crossing, he didn't hit his horn until after I had cleared the crossing and he went through it at 70 miles an hour. So I know for a fact that they don't always hit their horns while approaching a crossing.

And no I didn't see the train coming because there were vineyards on each side of the track and the road so the view of the track was highly obscured on each side unless you were sitting right on the crossing.

So I know for a fact it's not impossible or as impossible as you like to think.


He reasoning is mine. The crossing has no obstructions. It is very well protected. Gates, bells, two pairs of lights both sides of each signal. On top of that, horn or no horn, the signal gives 20 seconds of FRA-mandated fore-warning before the train hits the crossing. Now, it is possible the signal would have failed, but my god, I wouldn't expect that. If it is so, good bye to that maintainer.

Now, please don't take me as a sassy little boy, my Dad drives truck. Not Pro though. Construction dump trucks. (not the all-in-ones, he actually has trailers to pull)

It really does seem like a lost race. How hard do you need to hit the side of an Amtrak train to cause your fuel tanks to burst and kill what is now, five people? I've seen this all the time, but never so severe. It's not until someone loses some lives does the media ever pick it up.

Have a look at any busy crossing FRA Accident Report, they're publicly available here:
http://safetydata.fra.dot.gov/OfficeofSafety/PublicSite/Crossing/Xingqryxing.aspx

Sometimes, you won't believe what you find. Out here in Manteno, IL. We had an accident at the Pedestrian Crossing. I expect someone killed, nope. It was some drunk guys who ran their car into the rails thinking the Pedestrian crossing was a real rail crossing. They ditched the car... @ 2:30am, and the next CN freight train slammed it. Just for fun, here's the training video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-OcbRvl48P8

You have the same reason as my dad for keeping away from Pro driving.

Cheers,
Joshua
 
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