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Thread: This was my own fault, but did it have to be?

  1. #1
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    Default This was my own fault, but did it have to be?

    It's rare, but every now and then I do it. I go and fiddle with layers and accidently end up placing hours of work in the session layer by accident.

    Then, since I don't want 8000 default sessions for no reason, I click "do not save session" when I save the route.

    Pop into driver to have a look and *poof* everything is gone.

    My question is why is this even a thing?

    There are 2 entry point into surveyor "edit route" and "edit session". Given this pit fall, and nothing on screen to say what layer your currently working on (for God's sake why not??), what advantage am I not seeing to being able to edit a session when I clicked "edit route" or vice versa?

    Honestly I'm pretty angry right now, I know it's my own fault, but I'm trying to sanity check myself on the feeling that this shouldn't even be possible. ~sigh~


  2. #2

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    A route always needs a session in order to load so the edit route creates a new one every time. Edit session loads the route with the last saved information of the session. Edit session will not create a new session unless you choose to save it as a new name. Some parts of a route need to store information in the session. I always use edit sessions and save both, that way if I make a mistake it is not lost.

  3. #3
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    I lucked out, after cooling off for few minutes I checked the back up folder and found what looked like a session with the right time stamp.

    Long story short I got my work back.

    Now to your point, I have no sessions saved for my route, but "quick drive" always appears. Ergo, a session is not required. This is part of my confusion, the game always creates a "generated" session called "quick drive" on the fly.

  4. #4
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    Good save! It really doesn't matter where you work, edit route or edit route layer in a session, as long as you have a workflow you can adapt to new situations and suits how you work. I keep it simple and never mix building with running and always edit the route. Get into the habit of opening CM and saving your route as a cdp backup regularly too.
    Quickdrive is an auto created session and works differently to Universal Driver/Surveyor which is in platinum and above
    Cheers
    Last edited by grazlash; July 30th, 2021 at 05:49 AM.

  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by frogpipe View Post
    Now to your point, I have no sessions saved for my route, but "quick drive" always appears. Ergo, a session is not required. This is part of my confusion, the game always creates a "generated" session called "quick drive" on the fly.
    A route must have a session in order to work. If you don't have a session it will create one every time you open the route. Don't confuse a session with the Session Layer. All layers in the top half of the layers tab will save to the route. The bottom half will save to the session.

  6. #6
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    This is informing me that there is something I don't understand, assuming it's true that "A Route must have a Session in order to work"

    In content manager, if I right click "Kickstarter County" and choose "List Dependents", I get a list of 4 Sessions (Morning Run, FossilFuels, Trees for Life, and Multiplayer Session)

    If I do the same for my own route, for which I have never deliberately made a session (yet) and delete ones that get made by accident, I see *nothing*.

    When I choose my route in game, I have ONE session under "View Sessions" - Quick Drive. I can load it, and play it, no problem.

    I have assumed it was just a built in mode, I can't edit it, I can't see it as a Dependent in Content Manager.



  7. #7

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    Quote Originally Posted by stagecoach View Post
    A route must have a session in order to work......
    Not true.
    My routes work fine without.
    Just tick "Do not save session" when saving the route.


    However, I do make a session once in a while, to put various trains in and drive / test the route.
    Trainz user since May 2003
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  8. #8
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    When you are driving you are running in a "session" - If you don't have one when done it's only because you didn't save it. If you have a route with no session you have to "Create Session" -or- you have to edit the Route, then go into "Driver" which creates a session. You may choose not to save it but you drove in a session. That is why you have "Session Options" while in Driver.
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  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1611mac View Post
    If you have a route with no session you have to "Create Session" -or- you have to edit the Route, then go into "Driver" which creates a session.
    Not in 2019. This is NOT how it works in TRS19.


  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by frogpipe View Post
    Not in 2019. This is NOT how it works in TRS19.
    Kindly tell me the steps you take to drive in a Route without being in a session.
    19 Plus-SP4; Plus-beta 114800; 19-Std SP3; Tane SP4
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  11. #11
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    Some might be missing the point, 'quick drive' is a session, just that it doesn't have any goals or orders and whilst part of the route it is a session, of sorts.

    The point is if you're working on the route you select EDIT ROUTE. If you want to create a session you have to select 'Create' or 'Edit session'. Fiddling with the route whilst editing a session, by switching to route layer, is asking for trouble and a lot of confusion. I would never do it that way. Route for route editing, session for session editing and NEVER mix the two via layers. Apply the KISS principle and you won't have any problems.
    Working on Trainz.

  12. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by 1611mac View Post
    Kindly tell me the steps you take to drive in a Route without being in a session.
    See: https://youtu.be/j0LOXklJT-Q (Weirdly you can't see the rightclick menus, but at the end, I pick List Dependents and get that empty list because there are no sessions)

    Quote Originally Posted by Alikiwi View Post
    Some might be missing the point, 'quick drive' is a session, just that it doesn't have any goals or orders and whilst part of the route it is a session, of sorts.

    The point is if you're working on the route you select EDIT ROUTE. If you want to create a session you have to select 'Create' or 'Edit session'. Fiddling with the route whilst editing a session, by switching to route layer, is asking for trouble and a lot of confusion. I would never do it that way. Route for route editing, session for session editing and NEVER mix the two via layers. Apply the KISS principle and you won't have any problems.
    A session "of sorts" is not a session, it cannot be loaded or edited or even located in the CM. It certainly doesn't require loading into surveyor or creating a new session - I THINK I remember it working that way back in TS12 or maybe T:ANE, it's been a long time for either of those versions.

    Meanwhile: I agree about not mixing editing - My question is: "Why can we can mix editing Route and Session? A stupid [REDACTED] choice by N3V? Or, is there actually a reason for it that I don't know about?"
    Last edited by frogpipe; July 30th, 2021 at 08:49 PM.


  13. #13
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    You can always merge the session layer with the route layer if you accidentally forget to click the right layer when building a route.

  14. #14
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    I sorta did that, but like I wrote, I hadn't saved the session- fortunately I was able to find it autosaved in th backups folder.

  15. #15

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    As already stated Quick drive is a default session. Default sessions are blank and are used to store certain settings that your route creates. If you save a session it will show next to the quick drive and then if you use edit session you can load, edit and see it in CM. Newer versions of TRS19 don't use quick drive anymore. Edit session loads both the session and route and if you place a consist on the route a driver is created for it which is saved in the session. Edit session will load that driver for the consist while edit route will not. Light, fog, rain, time or snow for instance are stored in the session not the route.

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