Wheelslip problems

[Andrew21]

Hi guys

I've played Trainz for a while now on and off over the years and have recently started playing Trainz 12. I've patched it and it is up-to-date (58414) as far as I know. I created a map that has a long 1 in 66 grade (1.51%) with 300m rad curves. Being a fan of particularly NSW stuff, I downloaded Davido's NR class and put a train behind it. I had wheelslip issues which I worked out had to do with the enginespec being a little too... shall we say optimistic? The Tractive Effort (TE) is too high for an engine of that mass to sustain. Now to my problem:

I downloaded psycho_aussie's XPT's and put a standard consist XPT set up the grade (PC + 7 cars + PC). Now while it mananged to perform at the required 70km/h I was aiming for, it did this in notch 2 (out of 5). Any higher notch and it would start wheelslipping. The XPT power car relies on "Paxman Valenta enginespec" (kuid2:1551:51003:1) also off the DLS. I am not sure what is causing it to wheelslip. The XPT power car weighs in at 74 tonnes. By my calculations it should be able to sustain 217kN of TE without wheelslip. (Mass x force of gravity x Adheasion % = 74 * 9.81 * 0.3). Now I know on a grade that will be slightly less but looking at the config file the maximum TE it is supposed to output is 79kN (notch 5 5m/s to 10m/s). On paper I should be able to motor up there in full throttle no problems. I don't understand what the problem is here. Anyone had similar problems or know the cause and/or solutions?

Kind regards

Andrew

 

[Azervich]

This is the issue with most e-specs, over powering on the continuous ratings and starting ratings, the problem I see is because T.E is in kn people think it looks to low so they up the values beyond the actual max T.E of the locomotives at Continuous rating which is the speed the loco does in run 8 pulling heavy loads in all amps rather than volts, so tractive effort rapidly drops as you pick up speed until you make a transition from series-parallel to parallel, then at mid speeds another transition, and so on until the loco is in mainly volts than amps, problem in trains is people think values like 15kn or 50kn is too low when it's actually allot of power, most modern locomotives only run 10kn to 25kn at 110kph. if it's 120kph gear ratio.

Cheers.

 

[Andrew21]

Yeah I could understand that happening. The issue I have with the XPT though is not being overpowered. On paper if anything it is underpowered because of it's high ratio gearing. And yet...it still wheelslips! I am at a loss to explain why this occurs. I was driving in cab mode with sand on and cannot understand why for the life of me it wheelslips

 

[Azervich]

For a solution type in the loco config

max-tractive-effort 80000

the tag is in newtons, that will allow you to start off at 80kn without slip.

Cheers.

 

[Bill69]

Also in that espec the adhesion tag in the motor section is set at 3, bump this up to 5 and test again. Note if you have a loco on the track already remove it and replace with the new version before testing.

Cheers,
Bill68

 

[Andrew21]

For a solution type in the loco config

max-tractive-effort 80000

the tag is in newtons, that will allow you to start off at 80kn without slip.

Cheers.

Also in that espec the adhesion tag in the motor section is set at 3, bump this up to 5 and test again. Note if you have a loco on the track already remove it and replace with the new version before testing.

Cheers,
Bill68

Thanks for your help guys. The Max-tractive-effort tag did the trick (I set it to 217000 though lol) although I did try Bill69's suggestion first about bumping up the adheasion value to no avail. Thanks for reminding me to delete it and replace it too. I am guessing there is something in the programing for TS12 that wasn't there on TS2006? Anyways, at least I know how to fix such a problem in the future. Thanks again for your help.

 

[Azervich]

Actually, the delete and re-add was in TS2009 onwards.

Hi Bill,

Adhesion doesn't seem to do anything in trainz, I have experimented with that tag over the past months on steam locos with no effects, such as a 2-2-2 Well Tank I'm working on, it's not slippery when it should be even with adhesion 0.01, you need vehicle physics 60% for it to be slippery, even with driving wheel weight ratio of 33.33% and still not slippery, if I go lower it is, but it also gives a piston lock effect when you need to go forward, reverse, forward, reverse to unlock the pistons.

Cheers.

 

[Bill69]

Hi Azervich,

It does seem to in build 49922, I have a very slippery Big Boy hauling 3200 tons up Sherman Hill V2 though I must admit I have also reduced the driving-wheel-weight-ratio. It's lots of fun trying to get it up some of the inclines on the Sherman Hill route.

Cheers,
Bill