The good old days

[JCitron]

One point I will add is that the support offered by forum members to new (and not so new) users to help them solve issues has always been first class. This is often given under difficult circumstances such as very brief and vague posts (e.g. "It's not working" - end of message), posts that were made in the heat of frustration ("IT'S NOT WORKING - FIX IT NOW!!!!) and posts that are just plain incomprehensible (poor spelling, bad grammar, no typing skills - you all know what they can look like). All too frequently we post the answers and suggestions to their problems but never hear back from the original poster on that issue - although they sometimes pop up again in a new thread.

But it is always gratifying to get a post in a thread like this one

http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showpost.php?p=838385&postcount=11

Regardless of the "good old days/bad new days" problems, keep up the good work Trainzers - you are the backbone of the program.

Peter Ware

This is very much how my life goes in tech support. :hehe:

I've gotten messages on my VM like it's broken, so what's broken? There are a multitude of things running on the computer, so what's going on?

In the past as a hardware tech, I used to get boards back with tags that said "broken" on them. Oh so helpful when trying to pinpoint the problem. I used to run the boards for days in the burn-in room, plug them into my bench and freeze them with canned air, etc. to no avail. Ran every kind of diag on the board, but couldn't find a thing. The customer insisted it was the board. Finally I had them send back the chassis, and the board failed due to a loose ground cable on the inside! Arggh!

So, Yeah, I understand fully what it's like troubleshooting vagueness. It makes the day quite a bit more interesting. I too try my best to help those in need here. Sometimes with great success, and others with not even an acknowledgement if the problem was ever resolved, or not, and not even a thank you for trying, or just a thanks for fixing the problem. I guess that's the life of the internet these days.

John

 

[sniper297]

Well, one conclusion I came to recently is I'm gonna ignore calls for help from anyone who does not have a registered version showing;

http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showpost.php?p=837293&postcount=14

Can you say "warez", boys and girls? Sure, I knew you could! :n:

 

[JimDep]

And I also have that HD. US Army 1967-70.

I

Thanks for your service too! Say, I'm wondering Cuz, were you a fan of Walter Cronkites?

 

[Dep]

Well, one conclusion I came to recently is I'm gonna ignore calls for help from anyone who does not have a registered version showing;

http://forums.auran.com/trainz/showpost.php?p=837293&postcount=14

Can you say "warez", boys and girls? Sure, I knew you could! :n:

Yep...there was a similar post I saw where the guy said he can't play TS12 any more because it says it's a demo copy. He also didn't have the TS12 icon at the top of his post. Oops! :hehe:

 

[Dep]

Thanks for your service too! Say, I'm wondering Cuz, were you a fan of Walter Cronkites?

You're welcome. And no, I am neither a fan of Walter Concrete, nor am I Fonda Jane :n:

 

[JimDep]

You're welcome. And no, I am neither a fan of Walter Concrete, nor am I Fonda Jane :n:

We're in agreement there too. Hanoi Jane is no mystery, but many don't know the truth about Cronkite and don't understand the damage he caused. Our heroic Vietnam Veterans do.

 

[AJ_Fox]

Can we let the political comments go please?

ON TOPIC:

I think that the good old days will soon become this time now. Sure, things have changed. New members have come and some longer term members don't seem to be around much anymore, but they do still show up.

There seems to be many new very talented creators here, but some of the "old" ones are still around.

Cheers

AJ

 

[Dep]

We're in agreement there too. Hanoi Jane is no mystery, but many don't know the truth about Cronkite and don't understand the damage he caused. Our heroic Vietnam Veterans do.

Well said Jim.

 

[Driver_Col]

Can we let the political comments go please?

ON TOPIC:

I think that the good old days will soon become this time now. Sure, things have changed. New members have come and some longer term members don't seem to be around much anymore, but they do still show up.

There seems to be many new very talented creators here, but some of the "old" ones are still around.

Cheers

AJ

Agree with everything! I am just having a problem deciding whether I am an old "new" creator, or a new "old" creator, or maybe an old "old" creator ..... and as for talent ......... my close friends think so (that's how they became so close). And yes..... I just did a quick check and I am still around!

Maybe this will close this thread which appears to have served its original purpose.

:wave:

Colin.

 

[Dep]

Can we let the political comments go please?

ON TOPIC:

I think that the good old days will soon become this time now. Sure, things have changed. New members have come and some longer term members don't seem to be around much anymore, but they do still show up.

There seems to be many new very talented creators here, but some of the "old" ones are still around.

Cheers

AJ

When you think about it, if you agree with the OP, that's kind of a depressing thought. The OP said..."However these days it seems that most people are here to accuse people of doing things (namely stealing), make a dime off from anything, poke fun at the new guys, chew people out, and argue over which simulator is better."
If this is true, and today will be considered as the the "good old days" of the future, then what we have in store for the future doesn't look very bright. However, I remember folks arguing over which train sim was better even back when TRS2004 was around and new. The arguments of TRS vs MSTS are legendary. Today they have just updated the arguments to TS2012 vs Railworks 2. Heck, if anything, the arguments have gotten mellower, as many folks have both sims. But arguing over which sim is better happens on pretty much every forum where there are competing sims. So I don't expect it to go away here. And I don't necessarily see it as a bad thing, unless the argument gets nasty. I got TS2012AE yesterday and am happy with it, and I expect Railworks 2 to arrive early next week. I'm looking forward to posting a comparison of the two
Now if I can just figure out how to get this

up next to the rest of them :hehe:

 

[JCitron]

When you think about it, if you agree with the OP, that's kind of a depressing thought. The OP said..."However these days it seems that most people are here to accuse people of doing things (namely stealing), make a dime off from anything, poke fun at the new guys, chew people out, and argue over which simulator is better."
If this is true, and today will be considered as the the "good old days" of the future, then what we have in store for the future doesn't look very bright. However, I remember folks arguing over which train sim was better even back when TRS2004 was around and new. The arguments of TRS vs MSTS are legendary. Today they have just updated the arguments to TS2012 vs Railworks 2. Heck, if anything, the arguments have gotten mellower, as many folks have both sims. But arguing over which sim is better happens on pretty much every forum where there are competing sims. So I don't expect it to go away here. And I don't necessarily see it as a bad thing, unless the argument gets nasty. I got TS2012AE yesterday and am happy with it, and I expect Railworks 2 to arrive early next week. I'm looking forward to posting a comparison of the two
Now if I can just figure out how to get this

up next to the rest of them :hehe:

DEP,

Backup your hard drive before you put RW on your system. You don't want your PC to catch on fire or something. Remember you're mixing acid with fire! :hehe:

Very good points brought up here. I was one of the fallovers from MSTS to TRS2004 when the version came out. MSTS would get into a snit on me whenever I tried to do any route editing or install third-party content.

So many new folks think adding content is so difficult with Trainz, let them try that with the old MSTS. The program would crash completely if a dependency was missing. I used to spend more time at the different 3rd party sites looking for bits and pieces to get the routes to work. They guys don't realize how easy this really is!

As you know each of the sims has their advantages and disadvantages, depending upon what people want, and both offer similar things in a different way. I suppose the argument could be carried over in a car forum as well where things could get a bit testy over Fords and Chevys.

John

John

 

[Dep]

DEP,

Backup your hard drive before you put RW on your system. You don't want your PC to catch on fire or something. Remember you're mixing acid with fire! :hehe:

Very good points brought up here. I was one of the fallovers from MSTS to TRS2004 when the version came out. MSTS would get into a snit on me whenever I tried to do any route editing or install third-party content.

So many new folks think adding content is so difficult with Trainz, let them try that with the old MSTS. The program would crash completely if a dependency was missing. I used to spend more time at the different 3rd party sites looking for bits and pieces to get the routes to work. They guys don't realize how easy this really is!

As you know each of the sims has their advantages and disadvantages, depending upon what people want, and both offer similar things in a different way. I suppose the argument could be carried over in a car forum as well where things could get a bit testy over Fords and Chevys.

John

John

ROFLMAO John!!! Yeah, I'm surprised N3V/Auran hasn't sent me a PM about me goofing with their little graphic too
I didn't even consider doing any route making when I had MSTS. It was so complex that it boggles the mind even today. I left that to 3rd party people and just paid for them to do all the work. Some really nice stuff came out for it too. My big gripe with MSTS was the coupler thing. But they eventually fixed that. Couplers and no overhead map display like in Trainz were my biggest complaints. And Railworks 2 seems to have addressed both those problems. No idea yet about route creation in Railworks 2. Do you have it and is it as easy as Trainz to make routes in?

Dep

 

[Robertd81]

I can only speak from experience, but for the most part I've seen people go out of their way to help out new guys, laugh and joke about common issues, and post some interesting stuff relating to Trainz and trains in general. Content creators are still finding new and wonderful ways to eek the most out of the game, and the availability of good quality content is rising every day.

There is a snowball effect however, I'm sure, and it only takes a few too many negative posts in a short time for people to start to notice the bad rather than the good... which is daft. I'll leave details aside, but when reading through the forums I definately avoid certain types of post where I can, because once a grumble has begun there's not much fun to be gained from reading it, nor much I can do to cheer the author up.

Recently I've seen a few new creators (new to me at least) putting stuff up in DLS without even an eyebrow raised from the forums. Bjornl comes to mind with his great new scandinavian content, there are many others though, and they all get my thanks and respect.

So, perhaps we should focus more on the good, and comment more on the good, and all help to lighten the mood around here.

Peace,
Robertd81.

 

[JimDep]

When you think about it, if you agree with the OP, that's kind of a depressing thought. The OP said..."However these days it seems that most people are here to accuse people of doing things (namely stealing), make a dime off from anything, poke fun at the new guys, chew people out, and argue over which simulator is better."
If this is true, and today will be considered as the the "good old days" of the future, then what we have in store for the future doesn't look very bright. However, I remember folks arguing over which train sim was better even back when TRS2004 was around and new. The arguments of TRS vs MSTS are legendary. Today they have just updated the arguments to TS2012 vs Railworks 2. Heck, if anything, the arguments have gotten mellower, as many folks have both sims. But arguing over which sim is better happens on pretty much every forum where there are competing sims. So I don't expect it to go away here. And I don't necessarily see it as a bad thing, unless the argument gets nasty.

That's the way I remember it too. With MSTS, I was involved with the North Eastern Railroad project. That was great, but I enjoyed building routes and making content more with Trainz. I enjoyed being a cheerleader for Trainz for a few years stretch. If these current forums are viewed as "classify these as good times" then our standards have grossly diminished.

 

[pware]

If these current forums are viewed as "classify these as good times" then our standards have grossly diminished.

It is a fact of life that people will always look back and complain that the "standards" were always "better" back in the "good old days". They ignore the many problems that existed back in those "good old days" that do not exist now. They invariably fail to see the many improvements that have occurred because those improvements have now become the new minimum standard they expect.

Human nature, rose coloured glasses and short memories.

Peter Ware

 

[Zorronov]

I think the "good old days" were back when everyone thought I was a god and agreed with me about everything. Yeah...good times!

Cheers,
Fred

P.S. Wait a minute! That must have been in an alternate reality...

 

[JCitron]

ROFLMAO John!!! Yeah, I'm surprised N3V/Auran hasn't sent me a PM about me goofing with their little graphic too
I didn't even consider doing any route making when I had MSTS. It was so complex that it boggles the mind even today. I left that to 3rd party people and just paid for them to do all the work. Some really nice stuff came out for it too. My big gripe with MSTS was the coupler thing. But they eventually fixed that. Couplers and no overhead map display like in Trainz were my biggest complaints. And Railworks 2 seems to have addressed both those problems. No idea yet about route creation in Railworks 2. Do you have it and is it as easy as Trainz to make routes in?

Dep

I don't have it yet, but was thinking about it because I am very curious what the big fuss is over the program. Believe me my content creation didn't go very far with MSTS. I attempted to create my own route and spent hours and hours trying to patiently connect track only to get a stinking GPF (Windows error) and have the program quit. The activities were a bit more doable, but the same thing. That too would randomly quit on me as well. That was so difficult to work in I gave up, and I too purchased some nice routes such as those by Andy Hocking. His Maple Leaf Routes, which include a beautiful rendition of the D&H from Colonie to Oswego, NY, and Rich Garber's Canton, East Metro and a few others by him. The ProTrains routes were nice, but devoid of traffic even with a busy session. There were all these tracks all over the place, but nothing on them except for an occasional AI freight. This is something you see in this country, but not in Europe!

Anyway, it'll be interesting I'm sure when RW3 comes out. I'll have to see what people say about it before I jump on to it or not.

I can see Auran/N3V's public relations group getting a bit in a snit over your graphic. :hehe:

John

 

[JimDep]

It is a fact of life that people will always look back and complain that the "standards" were always "better" back in the "good old days". They ignore the many problems that existed back in those "good old days" that do not exist now. They invariably fail to see the many improvements that have occurred because those improvements have now become the new minimum standard they expect.

Human nature, rose coloured glasses and short memories.

Peter Ware

Really ? Father knows Best vs Glee

My memory is pretty good... long term memory anyway.

 

[pware]

Father knows Best vs Glee

I presume that that is a culture based reference. if so it escapes me (different culture - different side of the Pacific).

My memory is pretty good... long term memory anyway.

Unfortunately all the scientific evidence says the opposite - our long term memories are not as detailed nor as accurate as we like to think they are. Our long term memories are more likely the result of looking through rose coloured glasses to only see what we think happened instead of what actually happened. Our cultural, personal and other beliefs alter our perceptions of the past. This is the reason why eye witness testimonies are often regarded as unreliable and are often successfully challenged in courts.

 

[sniper297]

You forgot American Bandstand VS American Idol.

Well, first editor I used was to make levels for the original DOOM, and after that made some scenery sets for various flightsim versions, so when I got MSTS I didn't think the route editor was all that difficult or unstable compared to some of the other game editors I had played with before. Best I recall I got MSTS the end of June 2001, uploaded version 1 of the Port Ogden & Northern around the second week in August. Rail Simulator October 2007, took until December or January because altho the route was ready for Prime Time, the Kuju Kids didn't include any way to package a route for upload, had to wait for Mike Simpson to make a utility similar to Route Riter. Got TRS2004 around May 2010, TS2010 about a month later, still don't have my first route ready for upload. The Trainz tracklaying tool really irritates me, if it would just allow me to lay the track instead of trying to help by bending previous sections to what it thinks is the best alignment I wouldn't ever need to use the straighten tool.

Opinions vary, I think most agree the MSTS route editor is the most difficult, but there we separate - most say surveyor is easier than the railworks world editor, I find the total opposite, for me the railworks world editor was faster and easier to learn and the tracklaying tool simply works better.

However. Once you're finished making the route, what next? For the kind of operations I want to do the railworks scenario tools and AI traffic are completely hopeless, what's the point of creating a beautiful route if you can't run trains on it the way you want to? Trainz is ugly and clumsy in many places, but to me the important things that I'm looking for in a train simulator are all present and accounted for, AWOL in the other two.