One of our own

[narrowgauge]

Davie, you echoed my thoughts on the weapon. His parents must be experiencing increased sorrow as perhaps without thinking, they have made the weapon accessible and were partly responsible for his death.

Of course, he may have purchased it on the street, and I may be maligning them. What do we know.

Peter

 

[Klinger]

Davie, you echoed my thoughts on the weapon. His parents must be experiencing increased sorrow as perhaps without thinking, they have made the weapon accessible and were partly responsible for his death.

Of course, he may have purchased it on the street, and I may be maligning them. What do we know.

Peter

It was most likely a family gun. Lots of American households have guns (my roommate has 35) and in Wyoming, I can easily see his parents having a hand gun.

 

[qassaquyangli]

I Feel sorry for Alex, such a young railfan(Like me) and im guessing his favorite railroad is UP(Like me).

 

[wilh]

im guessing his favorite railroad is UP(Like me).

Yes, it was his favorite.

 

[SD45T-2]

:'( This makes me sad.

 

[JackieG]

Yea thats sad. I am bullied once in a while...but the really sad thing is...it's because i like trains. But most of my school mates are encougering and want to know about trains. Well he will rest in peace by the railroad tracks, watching for the UP hertage SD70 to come by...hehe: )...Alex, may you forever ride the rails in your resting place. Man if you changed the name this would be me. Exactly.

IDEA! Hey i am building Cheyenne for trainz..so i might as well put in a memorial for our fellow railroader.

 

[RRSignal]

This made me very sad. I was bullied all through my school life and it still has effects on my life now..

First thing I thought when reading the article was how different the USA is.. I mean how can a 13 year old get access to a gun, is that normal? Thats something I would have worried about first.

Part of me thinks suicide must be somewhat easier with a gun out of most of the other methods.

Very sad loss of life

Well, perhaps it would have made you feel better if he'd just jumped in front of a train. Or used another method that would have endangered or killed other innocent people as well.

 

[martinvk]

Truly a sad story. What is even sadder is that after the expected platitudes are voiced, I fear that nothing will be done. Calls will be made to ban bullying, increase vigilance for signs of potential victims, etc. Then contrary voices will question all the proposals. Soon, another event will attract the public's attention and everything will continue as before.

As for the method, guns might make it easier but I doubt a lack of guns would have any effect on the overall suicide rate. They just happened to be the method de jour.

 

[RRSignal]

Truly a sad story. What is even sadder is that after the expected platitudes are voiced, I fear that nothing will be done. Calls will be made to ban bullying, increase vigilance for signs of potential victims, etc. Then contrary voices will question all the proposals. Soon, another event will attract the public's attention and everything will continue as before.

As for the method, guns might make it easier but I doubt a lack of guns would have any effect on the overall suicide rate. They just happened to be the method de jour.

As somebody who's saved his own bacon with a firearm, as well as having subsequently studied the issue intensely, I can attest that the good greatly outweighs the bad as far as firearms are concerned. And, what I was getting at in my prior post, is that, while this person's suicide is tragic, he could easily have chosen another method that could and likely would have hurt others, psychologically or physically. Suicide by train comes to mind as another frequent method, and I don't think I need to explain here the toll that takes on others.

 

[masterowner]

This has spread all over the Rail community from us to the Modelers, here is something from youtube:

http://www.youtube.com/user/jlwii2000#p/u/6/rnk1KKOlIWk

 

[mjolnir]

View from the other mountain

Friends,

While, I too, bemoan the tragedy of the young railfan who was bullied, and chose in response to take his life, the issue for me here, is that the solution lies in better rearing of children.

I don't know the family, and I'm sure that they feel that they did all they could, but the fact of the matter is, if you want to portect a child from facing this type of choice, the process begins YEARS younger. I am convinced that it is quite possible to raise children with a strong sense of self value, and self image, that, even faced with a bully, they will be able, not just to survive, but to thrive. By the time the bullying starts to happen, I submit, my friends, it is much too late.

ns

 

[Davie_UCF]

Well, perhaps it would have made you feel better if he'd just jumped in front of a train. Or used another method that would have endangered or killed other innocent people as well.

Of course not. Thats like saying over here we should give out guns to the depressed they if they do they don't get in the way and can get it done easier.

What i'm saying is a gun makes it easier. If you look at sources its generally a given that most suicide attempts fail because they are difficult, can take time so people get found or they have second thoughts. A gun however can be in the moment, sure you've goto be pretty serious but that's what it's like in those moments so a gun can make it far too easy.

I recall reading 55% of gun deaths in America were suicide a few years back also.

And this from a Havard study:

Why does gun availability matter?
+Some suicide attempts are impulsive
+Some occur during a crisis
+If a gun is not available, nearly every other method substituted is less lethal
+90% of those who survive a nonfatal attempt do not go on to die by suicide (Owens, British J Psych, 2002; review of 90 studies of repetition of self-harm)
+All US case control studies have indicated the presence of a gun is a risk factor for suicide


That is all I meant by it..
David

 

[Euphod]

Harvard fails to mention those that have committed suicide by other methods, and provide the statistics for how the victim came into the possession of a tall building, a knife, a cop, or an automobile. Harvard would publish a study linking the common cold to firearms (and they probably will) when they deem us stupid enough to accept it.

This young man's suicide is a tragedy, but it wasn't a gun's fault, nor was it a bully's fault, and probably wasn't Asperger's fault either. He made a decision, not a great one mind you, but a decision, and carried out his decision. I give him credit for that much.

 

[RRSignal]

Of course not. Thats like saying over here we should give out guns to the depressed they if they do they don't get in the way and can get it done easier.

What i'm saying is a gun makes it easier. If you look at sources its generally a given that most suicide attempts fail because they are difficult, can take time so people get found or they have second thoughts. A gun however can be in the moment, sure you've goto be pretty serious but that's what it's like in those moments so a gun can make it far too easy.

I recall reading 55% of gun deaths in America were suicide a few years back also.

More like 65-70% of gun deaths are suicides. And, if you really want to get into details, about 66-75% of the remaining deaths are of criminals i.e. felons (DOJ) or persons with a "lengthy criminal record." (National Center for Policy Analysis)

But, if guns play a role in suicide, shouldn't Japan have one of the lowest suicide rates in the world, instead of one the highest?

 

[mjolnir]

From the other mountain, again:

I'll concede most of what you write,

...<snippage>...

This young man's suicide is a tragedy, but it wasn't a gun's fault, nor was it a bully's fault, and probably wasn't Asperger's fault either. He made a decision, not a great one mind you, but a decision, and carried out his decision. I give him credit for that much.

except that, based upon the information available, I'm not willing to let the bullies off the hook as completely as you seem to be. Simply put, through their actions (and words, for my purpose here, are actions) the bullies incited violence. Consider a mafia or gang boss who orders a someone to carry out a hit on a third person. Or consider someone who incites another person to steal. As I understand legal matters, whether or not the hit is carried out, on the one hand, or whether or not the stealing happens on the other, the person who incited criminal activity is considered as culpable as the person they incited who actually carried out the crime. So, why are the bullies different?

ns

 

[peghorse]

Forget new age theories and pampering those who seek to cause others physical or mental harm.
This is the kind of society that is promoted these days. One where self indulgence and personal glory reigns supreme over others feelings.

The ONLY way to deal with bullies is to ensure they receive exactly the same treatment, preferably in full public view.
A sister of mine was the target of bullying & violence in primary school because she wore glasses.
Her tormentor ended up examining a water fountain at extremely close quarters as I caught him bullying and threatening her.
In a fit of pure rage I gladly assisted him with his new found hobby, to the rousing cheers of the entire schoolyard.
Not very nice but these people need to be tackled head on as fear is their main weapon.

The young lad seems to have been a likely candidate for being aspie certainly.
I do hope those that were responsible are haunted by this scenario throughout the rest of their lives.

Let's leave this one in the lap of the Karma gods and remember the youngster for his dreams and enthusiasm for his chosen hobby and innocence lost.

 

[rjhowie]

Being deeply involved in the community and in particular a very challenging one at that I gave much service to young people and their parents through being a captain the the local Boys' Brigade Company there. On two occasions I was able to talk two teenagers away from doing this very tragic thing being related here. Unfortunately another had left home to come and see me due to pressures but for some reason stopped and went back to take his life. I will forever wonder about him because he was a great person who was well liked and may have been different had he reached my home.

Conducting such funerals as I have, is a great challenge especially for family and friends left behind and I well know the scars that are left. There are always the questions "why" or "someone wondering "could I have done something." But these are expressions of loss and love. We can see a physical injury and relate easy to that but the mental ones even to those close are not so easy to see or therefor to relate anything. Any young life taken this way with so much potential is sad and distressing for all.

 

[Euphod]

I'm not willing to let the bullies off the hook as completely as you seem to be.

Well, I agree that bullies should be rooted out, exposed, de-fanged and monitored, as they should have been from the first days of mankind. Problem though, is that life comes down to individual decisions, and those decisions are made sometimes under duress, in the worst possible conditions. Bullies must be dealt with in the manner they respect, but some individuals aren't capable of that behavior. Authorities cannot be present everywhere, everyday, and parents can only go so far in teaching and protecting. This is not new, most everyone has been bullied at one point or another, and it even continues here, in an adult forum, when members try to impress their ideology upon others. Individuals must develop some strategy to deal with these bullies, because they only grow up and continue to interact with us for the rest of our lives.

 

[JCitron]

I was thinking that perhaps there may have been other underlying mental health issues as well which culminated in this tragedy. He was also at the age too when the body chemistry is changing, and other hormonal changes are happening. This causes all kinds of angst, and probably added to the situation.

I have family members who have attempted a few times to take their own lives. Both are severe bi-polar and on medication to treat the illness.

The unfortunate part is mental health issues are always dealt with in an offhanded manner as though they don't exist. When hospital spending is cut, the first ward to go is the mental health ward. There are too few doctors to treat the huge number of patients with this type of illness, and sadly many insurances do not cover the treatment the way it should be covered. The insurance companies set limits on number of treatments and how much medication can be taken.

Treating mental health issues with medication alone is not the answer either. The medication works only if the patient is willing to work with the doctor to solve the problem. This adds to the situation because the "pills" are a quick bandage to cover over the problem that still exists. Sadly many doctors too will hand out antidepressants with overlapping side-effects, and the patient ends up in a flood of medication with one pill conflicting with the other, or causing additional side-effects. I've seen this with one of my family members! Her doctor gave her one medication to make her sleep because another medication kept her awake. She was at a point of 100% insomnia all the time. It only got worse until she had to be committed to an institution after her third attempt to take her life.

I really do grieve for the family. Losing a beautiful child, a person in the making, is truly a sad thing. He was definitely different than many kids around him, and inpart added to his bullying.

John