Microsoft will not support upcoming CPUs

Hi everybody.
snip~I own an iPad but not an iPhone - an Android based phone is ok for me. I really don't care much if someone detects I'm a Trainz fan: there are too many of my posts in the forums to dispute that.

Whatever comes along down the track I will consider and decide if it is right for me. I also like Google and Chrome for that matter. What does concern me is the possible demise of the PC as we know it.~snip

Pcas1986, there has been some interesting news in regards to Windows PCs in the last couple of days which has been tied up with the overall developments of the Windows 10 platform.

In the smartphone market then the Microsoft Windows 10 sales performance has been nothing less than a disaster for the third financial quarter (Christmas period) of 2015. Of the total smartphone sales Microsoft Windows 10 handsets only made up one and a half percent of the market almost 50% down on the year previous. Microsoft’s chief executive Sayata Nadella informed the media that sales figures such as the above “are unsustainable” the foregoing has led many media analyst to report that Microsoft may withdraw from the smart phone market altogether within the next 12 months.

However, it was a very different story in another section of the mobile market where the sales of Microsoft’s Windows 10 surface pro 4 tablet exceeded all expectations. The surface pro sales performance outstripped both android and Apple taking 45% of the US market against 17% for Apple iPad and 38% for Google Android tablets. Similar figures are expected for the European and Asian markets.

Microsoft has concentrated heavily in selling its high end surface 4 four tablets to its traditional business user base by bundling the tablet with its Azure cloud-based services which encompasses office 360. The tablet in its 10 inch form comes with a detachable QWERTY keyboard which makes it a perfect replacement for many users to the traditional PC but has the advantage that it can be taken anywhere with you.

The foregoing sales figure does now make some sense of what the Microsoft executive meant when he stated last week that “Microsoft where now glimpsing the end of the Windows PC”. Obviously Microsoft now sees its surface tablets as playing a major part in the traditional office PC replacement.

In all the above, many Windows PC gamers will be wondering along with many media writers where the future of PC gaming is. Would the PC gaming market on its own be large enough to support the development of GPU’s, graphics cards and other ancillary equipment needed for high-end gaming. It would seem that many analysts are unsure with opinions divided on whether those developments can go hand-in-hand with what is needed for the mobile market.

As a clue to the future perhaps we can look to the launch this week of the Samsung Galaxy S7 on the Android platform which comes with a virtual reality headset for gaming. LG are also expected to release a similar smart phone in the next couple of weeks. With the user having the headset on, these phones are completely controlled by voice using the Google now application and the Startrek concept really does come to reality . The television advertising for the Samsung devise which started in Europe this morning make them look like a genuine step into the future.

Being an android fan and seeing the advertising it just made me think “hey, I have just got to get me one of these” :hehe:

Bill
 
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Pcas1986, there has been some interesting news in regards to Windows PCs in the last couple of days which has been tied up with the overall developments of the Windows 10 platform.

Was that as identified in Blackwatch's post #37? If so, I found that a little alarming as it relates to my PC usage.


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In the smartphone market then the Microsoft Windows 10 sales performance has been nothing less than a disaster for the third financial quarter...
I think Microsoft were trying to enter an already crowded market. Didn't make a lot of sense to me but what would I know...

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However, it was a very different story in another section of the mobile market where the sales of Microsoft’s Windows 10 surface pro 4 tablet exceeded all expectations. The surface pro sales performance outstripped both android and Apple taking 45% of the US market against 17% for Apple iPad and 38% for Google Android tablets. Similar figures are expected for the European and Asian markets....

My own experience with iPad suggests to me that it is really a cute toy and not a practical business tool. The Surface Pro seems more business focussed and therefore more useful to those trying to make money.

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... Azure cloud-based services which encompasses office 360. ...

Office 365? :) Microsoft frequently bombard me with Azure based development promos. Not for me at present.

...

In all the above, many Windows PC gamers will be wondering along with many media writers where the future of PC gaming is. ...

Therein lies my concern. I suspect we are too small a market for Microsoft who really chase the business/corporate/government dollar. We may have to take refuge in Linux. :eek: But we will still need decent CPU processors and GPUs. How much of a market is required to sustain development.


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As a clue to the future perhaps we can look to the launch this week of the Samsung Galaxy S7 on the Android platform which comes with a virtual reality headset for gaming....

Nice looking phone with lots of features but I really have difficulty trying to relate it to how I enjoy using Trainz. Can I walk around a shopping centre while driving a loco in Trainz. I'd probably bump into people. Scary. :eek:

...

Being an android fan and seeing the advertising it just made me think “hey, I have just got to get me one of these” :hehe:

Bill

I'm an Android fan through economics. i.e. they are a lot cheaper than iPhones. No offense to iPhone users but I'm not one who has to have the latest and greatest of iPhones. You really need to view the Futurama episode that lampoons iPhone users to understand where I'm coming from.

In summary, I've been mucking around with computers, large and micro, since before PC days. There has always been doom and gloom on processor limits but clever engineers keep squeezing more horsepower out of processors, I/O devices on motherboards, and all the other electronic gadgets that make computers work faster. Operating systems, compilers and databases have always lagged behind.

I just wish that some of the new technology that comes out focussed on something other than a more clever phone.
 
Microsoft may withdraw from the smart phone market altogether within the next 12 months.

Oh I hope not!! My one and only smartphone is a Nokia (owned by Microsoft) Lumia model running Windows 8. When I decided recently that it was time to get a smartphone I looked at the market and decided that since I already had a Windows desktop and a Windows laptop I would stick with what I knew. I am more than happy with it and really do not want to move to iOS or to some "sweet flavoured" Google device.
 
Oh I hope not!! My one and only smartphone is a Nokia (owned by Microsoft) Lumia model running Windows 8. When I decided recently that it was time to get a smartphone I looked at the market and decided that since I already had a Windows desktop and a Windows laptop I would stick with what I knew. I am more than happy with it and really do not want to move to iOS or to some "sweet flavoured" Google device.

Pware,I would not worry too much as support for the phone should last as long as Microsoft supports Windows 8. It may well be that when a replacement is needed Windows phones may not be available unless Microsoft can make them far more attractive to buyers, which is something they have not succeeded in doing In the last five years.


If you are anything like me Pware I usually get through mobile phones at least one every 18 months by losing them or breaking them in one way or another. A few years back I dropped one down the toilet of a London Paddington to Bristol HST train, and it's replacement I dropped on the grass while mowing the lawn and then ran over it with my petrol lawnmower, not a pretty sight.

Thankfully the company did at that time buy and replace them for me, but now I am in semi retirement I do not think they will take too kindly to me handing in the bits and pieces of their phone again.:D

Bill
 
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. . .Therein lies my concern. I suspect we are too small a market for Microsoft who really chase the business/corporate/government dollar. We may have to take refuge in Linux. :eek: But we will still need decent CPU processors and GPUs. How much of a market is required to sustain development.

This, along with talk of the demise of the desktop PC is something which concerns me too - a great deal. I have an Android smartphone and an Android tablet, and they both have their uses, but when it comes to sitting down for some serious work or leisure time, there is no way in hell I would consider trading my (comparatively) powerful desktop PC, comfortable keyboard and massive monitor.

The only possible consolation I can think of is that I suspect there are plenty of PC gamers around to make GPU development sustainable. Let's be honest, how many business PCs have been bought in the last five years with nothing but integrated graphics? I can't see anyone shelling out for a GTX980 for word processing, and professional level users such as those involved with 3d modelling, CAD or photo and movie editing have their own professional grade cards, so at the end of the day I would imagine that we already have a situation where GPU development is pretty much driven by the PC gaming market.

Thinking about it, I can't imagine those aforementioned professional user groups being in too much of a hurry to abandon their desktop PCs to work on a 10" screen either.

Stuart
 
Hi everybody.
Stuart, in regards to businesses using 10 or 12 inch screens then that is certainly not the case. Microsoft are emphasizing to business users of their Surface Pro 4 that they can cast wirelessly to large monitors from the tablet using such devices as a Google Chromecast or Amazon alternative. Along with the foregoing any full size Bluetooth keyboard and mouse will also connect with the tablet allowing for full office configuration

The advantage of the above Is that the hybrid tablet only weighs 3 pounds and can be taken anywhere very easily with or without the keyboard. Anyone who has humped a heavy laptop through the London Underground will know what a blessing having a device Weighing only 3 pounds in weight but meeting all your needs is.

However, I do feel that the Surface Pro 4 could also be a good take anywhere hi end gaming device. I have just posted some thoughts in the general section of the forum under the thread entitled “ why do so many use older versions of Trainz (or something like that). Would love to see your thoughts on it Stuart or anyone else who cares comment.

Bill
 
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I don't think we will see the demise of the desktop in the foreseeable future but I can imagine the day without it, even for us gamers.

Thin client terminals and laptops have greatly replaced the desktop in industry. At MWC 2016 a week or so ago Canonical demonstrated their Ubuntu powered hybrid mobile which when plugged into a standard monitor and keyboard performed all the functions of a conventional laptop/desktop. External graphic card adapter are beginning to creep onto the market to house top end graphic cards (similar in principle to a desktop hard-drive) which currently are intended for connection to laptops but probable also the tablet and smartphone tomorrow.

I think someone will always need the bespoke computer with specific interfaces which are frequently more convenient to develop in the desktop form but the thought of tinkering with Trainz while away from home on some low powered device with the capability of plugging it into something more powerful when returning home might be very appealing. However in the mean time I'll stick to making the most of T-ANE Peter
 
Post #47,The world turns and everything moves on eventually boc61. When the railway steam engine was first invented here in Britain a farrier stood in front of one and declared "that thing will never move". Five minutes later he was ran over by it.:D

Bill
 
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Re:#46 I have run TR2010 on a Netbook (Atom 1.8, 2 core, 2GB RAM, Win 7 Starter, 16hrs battery life without WiFi) which I purchased for the soul purpose of not having to cart a works laptop when out and about. A bit sluggish although workable but the 10 inch screen was just to small unfortunately for Surveyor which is my prime interest within Trainz although OK when plugged into an external monitor. Peter
 
My earlier comment about taking refuge in Linux was a bit flippant but I wonder if now is the time for a cut down O/S that is suitable for gaming and simulation. Windows 10 is already tailored for constant internet access for media and social reasons. There are so many resident processes and applications running on my PC that I really wonder how many I really need and can do without. A quick glance at Task Manager revealed that my CPU was at 25%, memory (RAM) also 25% and some 5% network. Of course, looking at task manager makes the numbers drop as those processes scurry away and hide like cockroaches.

My point is that all that stuff can and will constrain applications like Trainz, and especially T:ANE. There have been countless posts on the T:ANE threads from those who have difficulty running T:ANE on their laptops.
 
After upgrading from Win 7 to Win 10 and discovering practically everything in Windows is enabled by default so I went into Start/Settings and went through each item and its subsequent sub-menus in turn and switched off everything I didn't need other than for security or to run Trainz including the likes of backups etc. I also disabled automatic graphic driver updates and reminders and similar. Now generally Sunday morning I give the computer an update, cleanup, defrag etc. save my sessions as CDP's followed by a drive image which also acts as a master backup to a USB hard-drive.

Major Windows updates like the one a few month back tend to reset everything so you need to watch for that and if necessary switch them all off again. Peter
 
Meanwhile the assimilation campaign for Windows 10 pushes on:

If Microsoft's documentation is correct, installing Patch Tuesday's KB 3139929 security update for Internet Explorer also installs a new Windows 10 ad-generating routine called KB 3146449.
Many people -- present company included -- feel that putting an ad generator inside a security patch crosses way over the line. In fact, you have to ask yourself if there are any lines any more.


Microsoft lays it all out in black and white in its inimitable, most obfuscatory way.
This month's MS16-023 security patch for Internet Explorer, KB 3139929, says:
This security update resolves several reported vulnerabilities in Internet Explorer. The most severe of these vulnerabilities could allow remote code execution if a user views a specially crafted webpage in Internet Explorer… Additionally, this security update includes several nonsecurity-related fixes for Internet Explorer

 
Unfortunately as games we are at the mercy of the gaming company, although with Trainz there is the option of purchasing a Mac. With many other programs there are the alternatives of Linux, Chrome, Google OS and so forth but with games its the consoles, WINDOWS or in this instance Mac, and until users can opt out of Windows, Microsoft can effectively do as they please much the pity. Peter
 
DOS - pure luxury! I cut my teeth on CP/M. That makes you a 'young un'

I recall using CP/M but I'd rather forget! As I recall, that was my introduction to Wordstar (I think that was the name - the word processor). You can still use DOS commands in a Win 10 command prompt window although Windows does its best to hide it. I can still remember the old DOS commands but the Unix/Linux commands have me constantly looking for a manual.

I can't imagine ever changing to a Mac but, in a pinch, I could switch sides to Linux. Although the latest offerings are very Windows like.
 
Yes, I remember using WordStar on a CP/M based computer - and yes, it was forgettable (both CP/M and WordStar).

I currently run Linux (Ubuntu) on an old notebook and it has been considerably improved since the earlier releases. But I do prefer Windows 10 to any of the other OSes and earlier Windows versions.
 

Stuart, in regards to businesses using 10 or 12 inch screens then that is certainly not the case. Microsoft are emphasizing to business users of their Surface Pro 4 that they can cast wirelessly to large monitors from the tablet using such devices as a Google Chromecast or Amazon alternative. Along with the foregoing any full size Bluetooth keyboard and mouse will also connect with the tablet allowing for full office configuration

Hi Bill,
Yes, I have no doubt that a great many business users will be more than amply catered for with a solution such as you have outlined, with the added bonus of being easily able to take their data and computer with them wherever they go.

I was referring more to a certain group of professional PC users who rely on having very powerful hardware, such as those involved in graphics, design, 3D CAD and modelling, photographic manipulation and movie editing etc., etc. The people who think nothing of spending a few grand on the latest and greatest CPU every couple of years because every second it saves them is money in the bank. I can't see that group of professionals being in a big hurry to adopt a mobile solution.

Of course I could be wrong . . .:D

Stuart
 
I recall using CP/M but I'd rather forget! As I recall, that was my introduction to Wordstar (I think that was the name - the word processor). You can still use DOS commands in a Win 10 command prompt window although Windows does its best to hide it. I can still remember the old DOS commands but the Unix/Linux commands have me constantly looking for a manual.

I can't imagine ever changing to a Mac but, in a pinch, I could switch sides to Linux. Although the latest offerings are very Windows like.

Ahh CP/M, Wordstar I remember well and dBase which I used quite a lot.

You can run OSX on a PC with a bit of ingenuity, even on an AMD processor! however not with Apples blessing!

Linux wouldn't be a problem here, was using it before I used Windows, these days it's dead easy to install and use, no need for all the compiling I had to do when I started with it.
Having used Macs I find any of the 'Nix OS's far easier.
Incidentally Code Weavers are currently working on d3d and DX11 compatible libraries in WINE / Crossover.
 
Ahh CP/M, Wordstar I remember well and dBase which I used quite a lot.

You can run OSX on a PC with a bit of ingenuity, even on an AMD processor! however not with Apples blessing!

Linux wouldn't be a problem here, was using it before I used Windows, these days it's dead easy to install and use, no need for all the compiling I had to do when I started with it.
Having used Macs I find any of the 'Nix OS's far easier.
Incidentally Code Weavers are currently working on d3d and DX11 compatible libraries in WINE / Crossover.


I'm off topic, but to add to what you said... you can run O/S X on a VM (virtual machine) platform, too. I did it in VMware.
 
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